Very bizarre afternoon and feel out of sorts

[Iwashopingnottobreakmyduck]

Drove 3 hours to visit MIL with DH and older children.

Walking back from the pub - met a man in a jacket, sweatpants and hat. He asked if we could call an ambulance, I asked why and he said he felt dizzy and started to collapse. DH phoned an ambulance. The guy told me his name, age and said he had epilepsy. He collapsed on the ground and started to fit violently.

An A and E consultant also walking past put him in recovery and numerous people stopped and asked to help. 45 minutes waiting in the freezing cold for an ambulance. Occasionally he came round and ‘fitted’. My daughter gave up her coat for his head support.

The ambulance arrived 45 minutes later and we were promptly told it was all a big con. This man is well known to them. He had appeared in court over it - calling ambulances out etc and abusing paramedics etc

We stood back and sure enough after the paramedics said they weren’t taking him to hospital and told him to get up and that he had enough attention etc he started being abusive to them and got up and we were shocked.

According to ambulance staff he is not either mentally ill or epileptic like he told us, that’s what they said.

DH has driven home and I feel very out of sorts. I had my head down listening to his breathing and he had drooled all over my daughter’s coat I held his hand for 45 minutes. No alcohol or drugs involved. According to a local man he does this every few days and there is a court order to stop him from doing it and they have sentenced him on previous ocassions. The police may be in touch with us. DH says he feels upset and used and of course was on the phone to 999 for 45 minutes, a crew was diverted from a real emergency. Daughter is pretty upset by it. Even the A and E doctor was taking his pulse etc - he didn’t know him as didn’t work at the local hospital.

I said to DH that whatever his needs are - they aren’t being met. I don’t know the answer or why. Or what society can do. But I feel very out of sorts.

Exactly the 2 guys i've been involved with professionally were most likely involved in drug-seeking behaviour - one would regularly present with renal colic requiring iv pethidine and the other with abdominal pain/vomiting blood needing opiates which turned out to be pigs blood from a jug in his locker

What a horrible experience. It's little wonder you're feeling traumatised 😔 Wish I had some helpful advice to offer, can only say sorry this happened to you.

Maybe he doesn't have mental health issues and is just a complete arse wipe.

Not a popular or palatable comment for me to make, I know, but this is disgusting behaviour on so many levels and 'mental health' is used far too frequently as some sort of catch all every time someone behaves in an unacceptable way.

Not all disgusting behaviour can be chalked up to 'mental health'. Maybe he gets a kick out of inconveniencing others, and thinking about others suffering due to his selfish behaviour. Maybe it's a fetish.

Maybe he's simply bored.

Sorry you had to deal with this OP.

Maybe he wanted some intra-venous diazepam for his pretend seizures or a spell in a nice warm hospital being cared for

How terrible for you and your family to experience something like that. Taking advantage of good people. Terrible man.
But don’t let it get to you. Don’t think about it. I know, easier said than done. But he’s already wasted your time and energy, don’t allow him to continue to waste more for absolutely nothing.

How awful. You did the right thing though OP- for all you knew he was genuinely ill and needed emergency attention. I can understand you all feeling shaken and used- and to think that the ambulance was diverted away from someone in need is awful.

Why does it have to be a mental illness and not just done out of nastiness and being malicious?

Sounds like he gets a kick out of wasting their time!

If it’s any comfort, it’s pretty common (although not to the scale that he has been taking it to). My partner is a paramedic and they are often called to ‘seizure’ jobs that turn out to be cons. Lots of people fake them and often regularly. I don’t know why - I assume munchausens or similar. They have to treat them as though they are genuinely having a seizure even though they can tell when it is fake, unless there is something in place to counter this like there was with the man you encountered today. These people regularly fool members of the public because they’re extremely convincing.

What needs?! Being a dick head and wasting people’s time? He needs to be wary of boy who cried wolf

Im not great with malingerers, especially the way the NHS is so stretched

Sorry it was unsettling for you. I have seen a fair amount of people like him so lm
like 🙄

This is unfortunately part of the reality of working in frontline NHS. Time wasters. You did the right thing though so don't be upset.

The man is obviously mentally sick. Nobody would do that time and time again to get attention unless they really did attention.

However you did everything right, were not to know his back story.

I can understand the whole thing was very upsetting for you all but it will pass.

Don't let it spoil your weekend, look after yourselves, you're good people.

He sounds deranged with some serious MH issues, it's also compulsive behaviour and he seems unable to stop doing it. He needs psych care.

How horrible for you and your family. Not surprised you are feeling weird. You did the right thing and put yourself out to help someone who appeared to be in need, but that person then abused your good faith and help. It is made even worse because your DD was dragged into it. You've had a brush with someone who is either mentally unwell or gets off on this behaviour. All of the above is unsettling, even chilling. Remember that you did the right thing and you are all safe. x

I didn’t see the story you mention so don’t know the context but some nosebleeds can be life threatening and terrifying for people as they result in profound blood loss

There’ll come a day when he actually needs medical attention and no one will believe him. It’s a classic case of the boy who cried Wolf.
One thing I Will say is, if he’s throwing himself on floor pretending to have an epileptic seizure he clearly is mentally ill.

Two things - FND is not fake or ‘put on’, it’s very real. It’s just not yet understood, rather like CFS/ME was in its infancy. Very real, just not quite classified and understood properly. This man did not have FND as he was very clearly faking it from how it all transpired.

the other thing is that you are bound to feel the way you do because, despite the outcome, you all experienced - for over 45 minutes - an intense medical emergency. With hindsight you didn’t, but at the time, your brain and body experienced this. So allow yourself to feel all the many feelings you will feel as a result of attending intensively to this man, and of course the bizarre outcome and the way that will make you feel too.

Well done as a family for looking after a fellow citizen so well. I know it went a bit strange but you weren’t to know it would pan out that way.

What happens if he genuinely needs medical assistance if he's court ordered to never use an ambulance?

Isn't that basically condemning someone to death? It doesn't sound like he's the kind of person to have support to get to hospital if he does need it. Mostly because he's a massive time and resource waster, but what happens in a genuine situation?

@Jimmyneutronsforehead it sounds like he was attended by paramedics, who assessed him at the scene, so he would always have support.

I agree that the thornier issue here is that this gentleman needs to be supported to receive what he needs without having to resort to duping people into thinking he has a genuine medical emergency.

Yes, perhaps.

But why should that trump someone else's genuine need for ambulance care?

Mental health or not, this bloke wasn't experiencing an emergency and I bet he knows full well the impact his actions are having.

Sometimes I think humans are far too quick to assign 'mentally ill' as an excuse for shitty behaviour because it's more palatable than admitting that some human beings are just knows.

*knobs

My first thought was this https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/24517-psychogenic-nonepileptic-seizure-pnes

He clearly is very psychologically distressed.

Nope, he may not be able to control them if it’s PNES that is the cause. Must have been convincing if an A&E doctor was taken in. Besides which, even if he’s not mentally ill with anything clear cut and diagnosable, Firstly, MH issues are notoriously difficult to diagnose because there can be huge symptom crossover etc, and secondly, nobody behaves that way simply because they’re a knob. Behaviour is communication. No completely psychologically sound, happy and contented person behaves in this way.

People like this piss me off. What makes people do shit like this?😡😡😡

My son and daughter both suffer with epilepsy. DS suffers the worse been fighting for his life a few times.

@Iwashopingnottobreakmyduck That was a horrible thing to have happen, especially as this horrible faker dribbled all over your daughter's coat.

Here is a guide to epilepsy fakers by a professional who works with people likely to do this.

{Online}

(1) The Electric Shock Boogaloo. If he is shaking like he is getting a short-circuited washing machine mind-meld - it's pretty much a guaranteed fake. (Just had one of these last week.)

(2) “Collapsed” into a suspiciously comfortable position. Particularly suspicious if he somehow managed to fall with his head landing on the pillow that happened to be on the floor. (Yes, I've seen this.)

(3) If you drop his hand on his face, but it misses and falls to one side or the other. Not as “unconscious “ as he is pretending.

(4) A vigorous Sternum Rub seems to work some absolute miracles in reviving certain “seizure victims “.

The 'Sternum rub' is where one makes a fist, and rubs the knuckles up and down the breast bone in a scrubbing motion- It is very uncomfortable.

Does he suffer from Munchasens, (I think it has a new name now), which is when you fake illness to get attention?

Even though it wasn’t genuine, you did the right thing, and supported a person (apparently) in need.