Feels like I'm losing the kids

[HandOld]

My boys are 6 and 3.

My husband can be a total arsehole. I'm really trying to find the strength to leave. There is just a lot of logistical things that feel impossible.

I said something he didn't like just now and he was "fucks sake this and that" "fuck off" "don't fucking ignore me" "your life is collapsing" "you got a fucking huge ego on you" all in frotn of the kids. I'm just ignoring him as don't want hom to shout anymore in frotn of them so trying not to antagonise. He says "I'm not shouting. Get a fucking grip" etc.

I apologised and he calmed down. And both boys went on the sofa and cuddled H and he started cooinh over them and giving them sweets and H glared at me and ive left them downstairs. And now I'm all alone upstairs

If I leave I'm going to lose my boys. They think he's so cool and fun. I'm meant to be working in 30 mins and I can't stop crying. They love him so much and he's so nice to them. But he's so cruel to me. I just can see them staying with him and I'll be alone and they'll hate me.

I know this isn't an AIBU but I'm in so much pain. I feel like I can't breath. I don't know what to do.

The children will feel uncertain about leaving with you because of the unknown changes, but with time and reassurance they will start to feel better

Your kids are probably scared of him.

Would it be nice not to live with him?

This. Poor kids. Poor you.

Don’t let them grow up thinking that’s how a man should treat his wife, and definitely don’t let them live their lives in this hostile and negative environment.

You're all victims of his emotional abuse so stop putting yourself down. It's time to get tough. They're young enough to have space away from this and have a chance at developing healthy patterns ( when they are with you). They will develop certain personality traits because of him so it's better you leave than stay. Also, you as the mum must always put yourself first in order to be an even better mum than you are already.

If they want to be with him and never see you, this is absolutely out your control and was always going to be. If they are of that feeling, then they'll become quite difficult for you to manage on top of the abusive husband if you stay there. You'll potential have 3 of them up against you and you do not want that. You need to escape, offer them a space to be with you and just go with what comes week by week. You can't predict how it will play out. I really doubt they'll want to not see you. He's a head f**k.

They're cuddling him because they have learnt that to get him to be nice to them / you, they and you have to be nice to him first.

They're cuddling him because they're scared that if they don't, he'll shout at them like he shouts at you.

You are allowing this. Because you are accepting it.

So every single time he speaks to you in the wrong way, you call it out. "It is not ok to speak to me in that way." "Please lower your voice." Etc. this will show your kids that what daddy is doing is wrong and not ok.

i did say to him "i'm not ignoring you i just don't want us to shout in front of kids' - and then he laughs saying i'm ridiculous and he's not bloody shouting etc. he kept going this morning so i just said sorry as that usually shuts him up. but you're right of course - it's really playing into the dynamic that he is the big man and i'm being walked all over. i hate it when he's like that in front of them. every time he does it i can't quite believe he's doing it. like does he not know how he sounds? two small kids right next to him as he's saying 'fucking hell what's wrong with you' etc.

If my husband ever spoke to me like that, I’d tell him to try talking to me like that one more time, and see what happens. Don’t let him treat you this way. I’m certain if you matched his tone and words (away from the kids, of course), he’d be stunned. Sometimes a dose of their own medicine is exactly what’s needed to make them see the impact of their words.

OP, just a warning. I'm surrounded by gaslighting abusive people. I am single but these have been in my sphere most my life.

Now, I see it every time and it's a full time job calling it out. It's best you completely detach but as you're living there, I agree with the poster who said you must call it out so the kids see it. Because as males, there's a huge risk they will adopt those behaviours and eventually use them against you or adopt certain tactics in relationship with others.

I have a pre teen who often uses ' you're too sensitive ', ' you're over reacting ' type responses to challenge. I'm pretty sure exposure to professional gaslighters and emotionally stunted adults has contributed. The fact it took me time to see it and call it out didn't help. I knew no different until years and years of counselling.

Stop it before it's passed on generationally.

@HandOld he does know how it sounds. He does know what he's doing. He's doing it on purpose because it upsets you. Shouting and then saying 'I'm not shouting' so that you start questioning your own judgement is exactly what gaslighting is, and the confusion and head pain it causes are classic signs.

The thing to remember is that this is what it looks like - a grown man bullying his wife and doing it in front of his children because he knows that adds an extra layer to her distress. Deliberately making children witnesses to abuse is a recognised aspect of coercive control.

He does not care about your children, not really. Again, it's exactly what it looks like. People who care about their children do not abuse the other parent in front of them.

Please have at the examples of coercive control here: safelives.org.uk/about-domestic-abuse/what-is-domestic-abuse/coercive-control/

I just want to hop in and validate your feelings. Parental alienation is a real thing, seen it in my own family, and mums often come out worse, since the dads can be very much Disney dads and often have more money, or generally feel more stable (less emotional).

You should check out @anniestoykrov on Instagram who talks about this a lot. She also has 2 boys and is out the other side having left and divorced. She has a subscription only Substack blog which I think you'd really benefit from reading.

So sorry you are going through this. It is very scary to feel you could absolutely lose your kids in this way.

Sorry correct insta is @anniestoykov

He is their dad. Dc will always love him .
Accept that.
Dc love parents regardless. They too young to understand.
It does not mean you losing them
But plan to leave.

I don’t agree with that, many people hate their parents.

OP, I am so sorry you are married to a bully. I can tell you are a strong woman and you will get through this. It’s definitely time to leave this looser but in the meantime please assert yourself and don’t let him talk down to you. Stand your ground and show your children how to behave with bullies.

good luck on Monday with your appointment, you will look back in a couple of years and feel proud that you managed to escape.

i just wish i didn#t have this horrible physical discomfort the whole time. crying this mroning actually felt good afterwards as i rarely cry. but the knotty feeling in my chest and stomach - i can't focus at work. more challenging as half term so both kids are around a lot more so dynamics are harder. i feel so scared of how awful it will be. imagine what he will be like after i say we want to split if he will shout like that in front of them over nothing.

Get advice from Women’s Aid. Plan your departure. Leave when he isn’t there. Take them with you. He can apply to the court for contact. Do not communicate with him except to give him one email account for all messages. Only respond to messages about the children. Discuss nothing else with him. Do this for your boys. xx

Your children do love you, they love him too but he probably scares them, in a way they can’t articulate as they are so little. My mother was a horrible, aggressive shouty monster when I was growing up and looking back, I’d be extra cuddly towards her when she’d been at her worst as a sort of survival tactic- she wouldn’t lose her shit and scream at me if I was “good”.

I understand that fear that you have, I felt the same with my toxic abusive ex regarding our children at times, but you need to get out of this relationship and take your children with you. Their father is toxic and it sounds like he’s weaponising them and the love you have for them, against you. Realistically, there’s a very good chance that in the future he does to one or both of them what he’s doing to you right now. That’s how these types of people are.

Ypur post has made me feel so sad OP. I hope you find the strength to leave this awful bully.

Hugs op. Your kids are young enough to leave and show them a normal and healthy upbringing. He's an awful bully and you need to get them away. Being with him 50% of the time is better than 100.

You have highly intelligent children who are currently in survival mode in my opinion.

Many kidnapped victims also positioned themselves as the person who adored their perpetrators.

What if your children are just trying to side with your H to reduce the fall out onto them?

You are their safe parent and can take this domestic abuse but their survival is based on sucking up to the abuser.

You can leave (you drive, you have work). They rely on the abuser to live.

I'd read Lundy Bancroft "Why does he do that?". There's a free pdf here.

It's not just about physical abuse, it's all types and discusses how children are used, how to get out safely etc. I think you might find it really helpful and validating.

Research shows children bond with abusive parents in dysfunctional way

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3574772/

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/352996008_Why_some_children_want_to_stay_with_their_abusive_parents

But that does not mean op should not leave
She should . to show them what a good parent is. And lessen the damage.
And much better to leave and provide a safe calm home even if a court orders contact with the other parent.

https://lundybancroft.com/kids-who-side-with-the-abuser-part-1/

Thanks everyone. I read a lot on here about finding your anger but I don't find it for long enough. The generational things keeps me up at night. My heart would break if they turned out like their H. I'm seeing the solicitor on Monday. I've been waiting for various thungs like more money or youngest to start school but perhaps I just need to do it somehow.

This. Adults need to sort themselves out, and not involve the kids in all the drama.