Page 15 | NMW to increase again next year to £12.21 ph.

ZoeZee · 2024-10-29T19:51:32+00:00

If you’ve not had a pay rise this year, despite bringing it up to your employer, and now there’s set to be another 6% NMW increase next year (which is fantastic, don’t get me wrong) the pay gap is narrowing ever more between skilled/unskilled employees. Skilled and those with MANY years of experience, might as ditch their responsible/stressful jobs (which often keep you awake at night) and look for something that doesn’t have the added responsibility? Almost 20 years experience means nothing to some employers! AIBU? Any employers who have a view on this increase, please let me know how this might affect you and your staff.

RedToothBrush · 29/10/2024 23:14

Shitshower · 29/10/2024 23:03

We cannot continue to pay people shit wages just to prevent businesses not closing. Sorry, but we can’t.
I have run a business before and I had to shut it because I couldn’t afford the staff I needed to run it.
It was a great idea and I loved running it, but in all honesty, it was not financially viable.
Some businesses just aren’t, and that is not the responsibility of the employee, and there shouldn’t be an expectation that I won’t want more money because I will cause a company to shut.
Big businesses have always taken the piss, remember the “work experience” they made people on benefits do? When they had to work in Poundland or Tesco as a part of getting their benefits? And those businesses were only too happy to take that.
Its time that those at the bottom who do the shit, hard jobs that many of you could not function without us doing, got paid fairly for doing it.

We could approach this in a different wage and not actually make it about wages, but properly fairly tasking people and business who can find all the legal loopholes to avoid taxation that small businesses can't.

That way you raise treasury income so the need to tax small business as heavily is reduced. It also means you can reduce taxation on citizens in other ways.

So the cost of living crisis eases and wages go further.

You could also do a lot to tackle the rental market which is fleecing a lot of the poorest in society (and most likely to be on MW).

Again you solve the issues in a different way without jeapordising crucial public and community services that many small businesses provide.

But nope this is actually all about the stranglehold these huge multinationals have and how they are able to direct the political narative so people just bleat on about wages as if this is the solution to the problem.

Its really not. Its going to produce a whole pile of its own economic and social issues.

That nursery you desparately need so you can go to your MW job is now the only one in town. So what are you going to do? You have to take a job or lose your benefits. But lack of places and rising costs means the nursery left in town can hike its prices up massively. Oh fuck you are priced out cos you can't compete with those on £60k.

Whoopie.

There are far too many people who have totally one dimenionsal thinking on this.

hamsterchump · 29/10/2024 23:14

Laptoppie · 29/10/2024 23:09

You think 30 years ago when he started his company he should have predicted a £20k rise in shipping costs within one year? That's an unprecedented hike. By that logic no SMEs should open and operate in case stuff like this happens.

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Also if he had 30 years of good times, presumably he has saved and won't exactly be going hungry if he experiences a slight increase in costs? So you'll excuse me if I dont weep for him.

At the end of the day it's up to him, he can either try to mitigate his increased costs in some way or get by on lower profits (imagine the horror!) or change/improve the business in some way or ultimately wind up.

MintsPi · 29/10/2024 23:16

I am completely against the rise. This will lead to a huge increase in my weekly shop. The staff there are friendly but I am not concerned if they can pay their bills or not. Getting my shopping cheaper is far more of a concern.

Maybe the government could look at building large communal homes where all these workers can live? Food, water, heating and a small room all supplied in exchange for their wages. If they want anything more than that they should have worked harder.

Laptoppie · 29/10/2024 23:16

hamsterchump · 29/10/2024 23:11

No of course not but he should have realised that owning a business is insecure and can be temporary and at any time something unexpected could happen which would threaten it's viability. Adapt or die.

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Or the government could support SMEs? They're often the drivers for innovation and growth, they often offer jobs in areas the big businesses don't bother going to, and often offer skills or services not found in abundance elsewhere. I think they should top up low earners wages in small companies, ones with a huge turnover should have to pay the wages themselves- like the supermarkets.

Horseracingbuddy · 29/10/2024 23:17

AlexMason01 · 29/10/2024 23:12

better entertainment else where, booze cheaper at supermarkets etc all other various factors that add up as to why people dont use the pubs

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Yep, use it or lose it.

BIossomtoes · 29/10/2024 23:18

MintsPi · 29/10/2024 23:16

I am completely against the rise. This will lead to a huge increase in my weekly shop. The staff there are friendly but I am not concerned if they can pay their bills or not. Getting my shopping cheaper is far more of a concern.

Maybe the government could look at building large communal homes where all these workers can live? Food, water, heating and a small room all supplied in exchange for their wages. If they want anything more than that they should have worked harder.

Fucking hell. Do people really think like this?

cardibach · 29/10/2024 23:18

Horseracingbuddy · 29/10/2024 23:10

Tell that to the 6 members of staff that he's going to lay off, they won't be feeling calm or exploited. It's not a failing business either, it's a deprived town who value their town centre pub. There are more aspects to running a business supporting the community than pounds, shillings and pence.

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No. Businesses are all about the money. That’s how it works. What support a community might need is another issue entirely.

hamsterchump · 29/10/2024 23:18

Horseracingbuddy · 29/10/2024 23:10

Tell that to the 6 members of staff that he's going to lay off, they won't be feeling calm or exploited. It's not a failing business either, it's a deprived town who value their town centre pub. There are more aspects to running a business supporting the community than pounds, shillings and pence.

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If they've been employed more than 2 years then they'll be due some statutory redundancy which will hopefully bridge the gap for them and I sincerely hope they and your relative find other jobs quickly.

I'm sorry but I really do have to labour this point, if a business is not financially viable then it is failing. It may be lovely and those who use it may value it greatly but it is failing.

You said there is another pub, perhaps that one will be able to turn a profit once the demand falls more in line with the supply.

MrsRobinsonsHandprints · 29/10/2024 23:18

cardibach · 29/10/2024 22:39

By ‘don’t pay my staff minimum wage’ I assume you mean you pay more - in which case this won’t affect you. And if you can afford to pay them more, so can other businesses.

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How can you not see that if minimum wage goes up, everyone not on minimum wage will want their wage to rise by the same amount?

notnorman · 29/10/2024 23:19

If you have any idea about business this just means that all wages will go up, costs will go up and inflation will go up.
I employ 25 people so I know what I'm talking about

Original poster

ZoeZee · 29/10/2024 23:19

I’m probably bitter as I work for someone (not original employer) who doesn’t think anything of blowing £1K on parking fines, new cars, money really is no object.

I do need to leave for my own sanity!

OP posts:

cardibach · 29/10/2024 23:20

MrsRobinsonsHandprints · 29/10/2024 23:18

How can you not see that if minimum wage goes up, everyone not on minimum wage will want their wage to rise by the same amount?

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Where did I say anything of the sort?
You already pay more than NMW, and presumably have a pay structure your staff is happy with. You won’t be affected.

hamsterchump · 29/10/2024 23:20

Lulubo1 · 29/10/2024 23:14

If everyone had that mindset, there would be no businesses or jobs at all. Smh

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Of course there would be, but hopefully they'd be ran by people smart enough to understand the nature of business and consider risk and weigh it up against uncertain reward!

RedToothBrush · 29/10/2024 23:20

Its. Not. A. Wage. Issue.

Its. A. Cost. Of. Living. Issue.

Its about inflation. Even if you get a pay rise this doesn't mean your quality of life improves. It only improves if inflation isn't also pushed up. And you retain a job and the ability to get to work (child care and transportation). And you don't tip the economy into resession because of ll these business going pop. And then renters and mortgage owners end up defaulting.

Small businesses have had to absorb particular steep increases in costs across the board in a very short period. This will be the final straw for so many.

Laptoppie · 29/10/2024 23:21

hamsterchump · 29/10/2024 23:20

Of course there would be, but hopefully they'd be ran by people smart enough to understand the nature of business and consider risk and weigh it up against uncertain reward!

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You're one of the most ignorant posters I've ever seen on here, and that's saying something.

DownThePubWithStevieNicks · 29/10/2024 23:21

MintsPi · 29/10/2024 23:16

I am completely against the rise. This will lead to a huge increase in my weekly shop. The staff there are friendly but I am not concerned if they can pay their bills or not. Getting my shopping cheaper is far more of a concern.

Maybe the government could look at building large communal homes where all these workers can live? Food, water, heating and a small room all supplied in exchange for their wages. If they want anything more than that they should have worked harder.

Says a lot about this thread that I can’t be completely sure this is a joke!

RedToothBrush · 29/10/2024 23:22

ZoeZee · 29/10/2024 23:19

I’m probably bitter as I work for someone (not original employer) who doesn’t think anything of blowing £1K on parking fines, new cars, money really is no object.

I do need to leave for my own sanity!

See this is the real point.

Theres a world of difference between that and someone who is putting in 60 or 70 hours a week and taking far less home per week than their staff who do 35 hours on NMW.

Walkden · 29/10/2024 23:24

"Its. Not. A. Wage. Issue.
Its. A. Cost. Of. Living. Issue"

Patronising. People. Like. This. Does. Not. Make . You. Right

MangoRose · 29/10/2024 23:26

Trikey · 29/10/2024 23:14

I think this will finish my pre-school which has been running for 30 years. The nmw increase, the rise in employer NI contributions, the fact we can't charge top-up fees and the funding that doesn't match what it actually costs to provide places. Successive governments have meddled with and distorted the sector so much that it is now un-workable.
We are a not for profit small, excellent setting but we can't run at a loss.

This will happen to so many settings. People just do not understand the impact of these rises, as shown on this thread.

friendlycat · 29/10/2024 23:27

Laptoppie · 29/10/2024 23:21

You're one of the most ignorant posters I've ever seen on here, and that's saying something.

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Quite agree. The person you are responding to is clueless about business.

MintsPi · 29/10/2024 23:27

BIossomtoes · 29/10/2024 23:18

Fucking hell. Do people really think like this?

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I wasn't being entirely serious..I earn 11.94 a hour myself..

But this is what the argument is seeming boiling down to. NMW increase is bad but benefit tops are also bad. We need people to work as cleaners, carers, retail workers etc but not in a capacity where they can have a little bit of anything above the basics. The only way to balance things is to bring in some form of cheap communal living. Satisfies those who think the minimum wage earners should know their place.

hamsterchump · 29/10/2024 23:27

RedToothBrush · 29/10/2024 23:14

We could approach this in a different wage and not actually make it about wages, but properly fairly tasking people and business who can find all the legal loopholes to avoid taxation that small businesses can't.

That way you raise treasury income so the need to tax small business as heavily is reduced. It also means you can reduce taxation on citizens in other ways.

So the cost of living crisis eases and wages go further.

You could also do a lot to tackle the rental market which is fleecing a lot of the poorest in society (and most likely to be on MW).

Again you solve the issues in a different way without jeapordising crucial public and community services that many small businesses provide.

But nope this is actually all about the stranglehold these huge multinationals have and how they are able to direct the political narative so people just bleat on about wages as if this is the solution to the problem.

Its really not. Its going to produce a whole pile of its own economic and social issues.

That nursery you desparately need so you can go to your MW job is now the only one in town. So what are you going to do? You have to take a job or lose your benefits. But lack of places and rising costs means the nursery left in town can hike its prices up massively. Oh fuck you are priced out cos you can't compete with those on £60k.

Whoopie.

There are far too many people who have totally one dimenionsal thinking on this.

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So another prospective nursery provider spots the gap in the market and money to be made and sets up, undercutting the original one, oh and then another and another, and the price reduces. Come on you read about this is school yes?

This is actually why essential services should not be privatised in my opinion so they aren't subject to this kind of market flux and I suppose we could all argue about whether a nursery is an essential service or not but we should probably have another thread. I actually would most likely come down on the side that they are essential and in my opinion should be nationalised along with the NHS, all utilities, public transport and social care but that really is another thread.

Lucy25 · 29/10/2024 23:29

RedToothBrush · 29/10/2024 23:14

We could approach this in a different wage and not actually make it about wages, but properly fairly tasking people and business who can find all the legal loopholes to avoid taxation that small businesses can't.

That way you raise treasury income so the need to tax small business as heavily is reduced. It also means you can reduce taxation on citizens in other ways.

So the cost of living crisis eases and wages go further.

You could also do a lot to tackle the rental market which is fleecing a lot of the poorest in society (and most likely to be on MW).

Again you solve the issues in a different way without jeapordising crucial public and community services that many small businesses provide.

But nope this is actually all about the stranglehold these huge multinationals have and how they are able to direct the political narative so people just bleat on about wages as if this is the solution to the problem.

Its really not. Its going to produce a whole pile of its own economic and social issues.

That nursery you desparately need so you can go to your MW job is now the only one in town. So what are you going to do? You have to take a job or lose your benefits. But lack of places and rising costs means the nursery left in town can hike its prices up massively. Oh fuck you are priced out cos you can't compete with those on £60k.

Whoopie.

There are far too many people who have totally one dimenionsal thinking on this.

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One dimensional thinking! Maybe, it’s more to do with, people have different views, that you disagree with and are going by their own work experience.How dare people for ‘bleating’

IDontHateRainbows · 29/10/2024 23:29

BIossomtoes · 29/10/2024 23:18

Fucking hell. Do people really think like this?

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I believe it was ironic. Although the poster forgot to mention gruel.

hamsterchump · 29/10/2024 23:31

Laptoppie · 29/10/2024 23:16

Or the government could support SMEs? They're often the drivers for innovation and growth, they often offer jobs in areas the big businesses don't bother going to, and often offer skills or services not found in abundance elsewhere. I think they should top up low earners wages in small companies, ones with a huge turnover should have to pay the wages themselves- like the supermarkets.

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...They often exploit their workers worse than larger companies who at least usually have clued up legal departments to quash their most exploitative ideas.

Where I live the majority of people are employed in the hospitality sector, the tales I could tell you about small "family" businesses and the way they treat their staff would make your hair curl!

No, they can't be trusted and like almost all businesses must be forced to treat their staff decently. Those who pay NMW would pay less if they could.