Do you think there is a correlation between kids who run about in restaurants and don't sit up to a table at home during meals

[longlocks]

I believe so. As if a child who doesn't sit up to a table for meals at home - due to no table (seen property listings with no table) or parents being lazy and letting them eat in front of telly or in their rooms. Or don't have a proper structure of mealtimes, so eat a bit, run about, eat etc.

For these children, going out for a meal sitting up to a table is an alien concept to them.

The only times I didn't sit up to a table as a kid for meals was breakfast during the week as usually parents and myself had staggered breakfasts due to school and their work/other commitments. Or when I was ill. That was usually food eaten with hands - sandwiches, cheese n biscuits.

Think parents should only take kids out if they can sit at a table and only leave in these situations 1. Visiting the loo and 2. If there is a buffet - either a full one or for a part, such as Harvester with salad bar or places with unlimited soft drinks where the diners themselves fill up the drinks (Nando's)

Extremely irritating. My hubby & I went for a pub lunch last Sunday. There was a family get together seated next to us. 6 kids running riot around the restaurant, 3 sitting glued to screens with volume up & no headphones. The kids running around weren't once acknowledged by parents who were too busy chatting & enjoying their drinks. We left. So angry at the entitled attitude. A lunch out is not cheap, folk should be able to enjoy. Some families seem to want to just takeover whatever space they're in..

A bit of an oversimplification I think.

One of mine really struggles to sit at table at home, he’s young and it stresses him out - food generally isn’t his favourite and neither is staying still. We encourage him to sit at the table but don’t make a massive fuss about it. He comes and goes, normally. TV is not on.

He does a much better job when we are out because he gets that other people are there and it’s not appropriate to disturb them. Within reason, we allow him to eg sit on floor beside table to colour in or go for a (calm, walking) stretch of the legs outside / to the window whatever. Obviously venue dependent. We also try to bring a card game or something to make it more appealing to stay at table.

Children are different to adults and have different needs. Their parents - and really, society - need to understand and to a reasonable degree accommodate those needs. Obviously child free venues exist also, which is fine, but family restaurants need to be a place of tolerance for usual childlike behaviour. A lot of other countries seem to be much more realistic and tolerant of children being children than the UK.

This. Some parents truly don’t give a fuck. They couldn’t care less if your experience is being ruined by their kids. You mustn’t say anything or you’ll find yourself in a fight. Zero respect. Zero manners. Zero civility. That’s not me being “smug” as a pp has described decent attitudes. That’s me remembering the past and when children were actually parented and those parents would have felt embarrassed to have their kids do as they like in a restaurant.

@longlocks - I agree with the posters who have said that it isn't necessarily about not having a dining table - it's about the parenting. You can have a dining table, but if you don't teach your children how to behave at it, they won't behave any better in a restaurant, and conversely, parents don't need a dining table to teach their children good manners and how to behave in public.

I mostly agree. We always sat down at the table but my 2nd was a lot trickier taking out to eat. I would bring lots of activities and we adjusted our life while they were little! We still went out but would go to a pub with a garden. So they could have a play then come and sit down.
If they were being a pain myself or my husband would have taken them out of the restaurant/ cafe until they would sit nicely. There's no way I would let them disturb other customers.

Gdcs would usually eat at the table at home, and good behaviour was normally pretty much enforced, but there was at least a year when we didn’t feel able to take toddler Gds to any but a very child-friendly restaurant, with e.g. a play area. Or else to a pub with a large garden, in summer.

He was simply a human hurricane, so trying to get him to sit nicely at the table once he’d eaten, but others hadn’t finished, was a PITA too far.
Roll on to when he was maybe 5, and he was vastly improved.
No such problem with his sisters, both older and younger.

Edited to add, no SN, in case anybody’s wondering.

Yes and no!
My children always had dinner at the table, where we would all sit around and talk.
That still didn't mean they were able to sit quietly for a leisurely meal in a restaurant until they were at least 5, and maybe 7. I actually think it's really not worth taking small children to restaurants; you just don't get your money's worth in terms of enjoyment!
However, that doesn't mean it is OK to let your children run around annoying other people. It means the adults have to take it in shifts to take them outside, again not much fun really.
We used to talk a lot about table manners, and made a bit of a game out of it, seeing who could come up with the most outrageous breach of table manners. It entertained the DC, but also made them aware of what was acceptable behaviour and what was likely to offend visiting grandparents!

I don't understand this MN obsession with screens for kids in restaurants. When we were younger, almost every family pub had some kind of play area/soft play. When we were done, we'd go off and play. At a basic level, there'd be colouring packs or puzzles on the menus. We certainly didn't sit and wait quietly whilst our parents talked. Now these are almost non-existant because they can use that space for tables to bring in more revenue and save money not producing the kids packs.

Do you have evidence for a correlation or is it just an idea you have come up with and you want people to discuss (for some reason).

That's a massive oversimplification, OP.

We've got a proper table and we have always sat down as a family for dinner every night (and all other meals are weekends).

Doesn't mean the kids will stay sat for more than about 5 minutes. We've tried modelling good habits, bribery, threats, consequences. The lot. They are well behaved in loads of other areas of life but not this one.

It's very rare we take them to eat out for fear of all the judgement tbh.

It's not always a case of 'lazy parenting ' or 'just train them'.

Having taken 100 Y7 pupils on a school trip this year, it was quite surprising how many had no idea how to behave at a table, and some had never eaten at a table before.

Things like:

• constantly getting up and walking round.
• unable to use a knife and fork properly. Some didn't know how to use a knife and just stabbed the food the fork then bit chunks off mid-air
• reaching across rather than asking for things to be passed
• throwing food.
• talking with mouth full of food
• wearing a hat/hood at the meal table
• expecting others to clear up after you.

One of the older members of staff had to give them a mid-meal lesson on how to behave at a meal table.

By the end of the week there was a massive improvement!

BUT... don't forget it's not the child's fault if they haven't been taught these things.

Almost as if they wanted to start some kind of bunfight ahead of deadline...

I think there is a corellation between gentle parenting = kids running amok everywhere.
Yesterday went to a pub, 12pm opening. Lots of families sitting, their kids running around like it is a nursery.

DS was perfectly capable of sitting nicely at a table at home or at his grandparents, but if we were at a restaurant or cafe I was constantly chasing after him and repeatedly carrying him back to the table. Turns out he's autistic and getting overwhelmed by the noise and activity.

It would drive me nuts and I'd try and avoid eating out when I could.

We rarely eat at the table at home. We used to, when dd was little in a high chair and then for a while afterwards.
I wasn’t brought up to eat at a table, dh was, but we both prefer not to now.
Dd is generally well behaved in restaurants though.
She’s still quite young and learning but she’s never been allowed out of her seat during a meal in a restaurant unless she asks for the toilet and then we walk holding hands.
I have zero tolerance for it because it can actually be dangerous. She has no problem eating at her desk in school either.

As an aside, I have learned most of what I know about table manners etc on here to be honest.
Nobody cares about any of that stuff or teaches it to their children where I am from, it’s just not a part of my world.
Dh is from a slightly different background. They eat all of their meals at a dining table and use table manners.
I have made a fool of myself many a time at that table since we started going out when I was a teenager, but his parents understand that I wasn’t brought up with it and I’m not intentionally trying to be rude. They don’t judge me for it.
I don’t really understand why some people think that the way they do something, like how they eat their meals, is the correct way to do it and otherwise, you’re doing it wrong. They accept differences in other cultures but not within their own.
Allowing your kids to run around during a meal out is a separate thing. Kids shouldn’t get up and down or run around because it can be dangerous.
Anyway, how other kids behave in restaurants is not something I could get wound up about. Even if it is annoying, it’s not a big issue. When the current generation of children are grown up, will restaurants be full of adults running around behaving like toddlers? Of course not.

It's annoying because people are spending money to enjoy their meal out & entitled families think is OK for their children to encroach on people's personal space via running around & being excessively loud. It's ignorant & show a total lack or respect to society in general.
Kids on devices with sound up & no headphones it's equally ignorant. Leave your kids at home if they are unable to sit through a meal without load visual & audio stimulation without a set of headphones

It’s awful that there isn’t enough room for the most basic furniture in newer house. I’d find it depressing sitting on a sofa eating Christmas dinner too. I don’t know how food soiling can be avoided with small children. I live in a newish house with no storage space, but managed to get a round table in the end of the kitchen. I notice in some houses there is an enormous corner sofa and huge TV that are too big for the room, so in some houses I think better use could be made of space.

Some of us do care about “ that stuff!” It’s important to teach children table manners, how to be considerate to others, how to use a knife and fork properly. It’s not about culture.

No. My children don't usually sit at the table for dinner. At weekends we all eat as a family but most days myself and DH eat much later.

My kids however know how to behave in a restaurants and have never run around. The only time I've had problems is when we've been out in a big group and other people (within the group) are letting their kids run around. It's kind of a losing battle if others are allowing it. Although I did keep making them sit down.

Before I had children, I probably would have thought this. But it's bollocks. We dont' eat at the tabel together very often. But my children are completely perfectly well behaved in restaurants.

I think that children who are allowed to run wild are generally children who aren't well parented. So they have nto been taught manners, and they are not corrected when the behave badly. It makes no difference if they eat at the tabel or not - they're always allowed to do what they like.

I don't know why but the phrase "sit up to a table" which I've never come across before is really grating. I do agree though on the whole that if children are allowed to be grazers they aren't learning how to sit chat and eat, then leave!

I imagine it varies hugely regardless of dining set up. I also think it's kids who don't go to restaurants who MAY do this - yes, not always.

Our friends' DC don't go to restaurants or cafes and haven't since birth. They sit at the table at home always but they aren't taken to restaurants after pretty terrible behaviour in a couple. They had not been taken to one until they were about 3 and 4. I have another friend whose pretty spirited little one has always been to restaurants and he's great in them. Of course there are just two examples. My DD is mostly ok despite being taken to restaurants from birth. But she's a toddler in the thick of defiance and exploration.

My 9 year old has autism and adhd. He just cannot sit still at home or out, he eats a bit then needs to move. We don't go out often because of his needs but when we do he is aware of the rules of sitting still, he really tries! But I usually end up walking around with him as he just finds it so overstimulating. Not bad behaviour, just his needs. Which is why we don't go out often!!!

ekkkk you're full of yourself aren't you! My child eats in front of the telly and is often always the best kid when taken out for a meal. Sometimes we fold out the table sometimes we don't. Balance.

This.

My children are 5&3. They sit at the table for all meals and snacks. Most of the time are also expected to sit at the table until everyone agrees they can leave (IE they have to ask to leave the table and sometimes their sibling hasn't finished eating, they say no and then we get to practice our negotiating and patience skills 😂) We had it in mind that by the time you're 4 you should wait to be excused but it's tough on the 5 year old that his little sister (who is usually 3 going on 13!) is getting away with stuff and he isn't, despite reminding him he also got away with it when he was 3.

We very rarely go out to eat. However, when we do I go prepared with busy bags etc because there are often long waits on food (compared to me calling them to table only when the food is ready) and then also adults like to sit around and pontificate after a meal which is super boring for little kids. So I have colouring, sticker books etc to keep them entertained. But even then I recognise that after a point either DH or I will need to take them outside to run off their energy. I don't like them being down from the table/under people's feet or being a pest whilst other diners are trying to enjoy their food but equally I have seriously low expectations that they'd be able to sit still and quiet for the length of time adults would enjoy a lunch/dinner.

Spoke to my mum about the expectation on kids, pondering if behaviour now is worse than it was when she was a kid as I can't imagine they were allowed to leave the table and run amuck. But she pointed out that when she was younger there was often a 'kids tea' at a different time to the adults which was much shorter in length, and that she doesn't remember ever going out to eat with her parents until she was much older. The way we do things as a family has changed, perhaps societal expectations on behaviour for small kids should also evolve. Feels like if kids are at the table on a tablet that also wouldn't be acceptable...was a thread about that recently I believe. Tough break being a littlun really, or a parent of one. Feels like you can't do much right!!