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If the UK has to pay reparations, will other countries?

897 replies

Controversialname · 24/10/2024 19:07

If the UK is made to pay reparations where will that leave other nations who were or indeed still are involved in slavery?

OP posts:
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Hemiola · 24/10/2024 21:37

I found myself getting irate at this today. Where does it end? Do my Welsh people get to ask for reparations from the English? Does the UK get reparation from the Romans?!
I absolutely recognise the hideous of our history of slavery but you cannot change the past, only learn from it and change our future. As others have said, sadly we are not addressing modern slavery.

Firestace · 24/10/2024 21:40

GretchenWienersHair · 24/10/2024 20:55

@Firestace whatever helps you to sleep at night

I sleep okay thanks, I do a job that benefits society, I try and treat people well and share the resources I have if I can. I don't feel the need to lose sleep over something as nonsensical as this.

WrigglyDonCat · 24/10/2024 21:41

Modern Danegeld pure and simple.

Various disaffected nations: Give us some money and we'll go away, if you don't we'll keep making trouble for you"

Leftwingers: "Here's your cash, off you toddle"

10 years later...

Various disaffected nations: "Hi, it's us again, can we have some more cash please 'cos we is like still so poor and it's all your fault"

Leftwingers: "Gosh, we need some more halo points to prove what wonderful good people we are - here, have some more cash"

Devonshiregal · 24/10/2024 21:56

Witchyandtwitchy · 24/10/2024 19:29

Exactly!!

Yes and how come reparations are never paid to women? Shouldn’t every man be taxed to cover all the pain men cause women? The most shat upon, enslaved people in the world who are still getting shit to this very day up and down and across the world, millions who can’t afford to live because this country is in such a state yet we a discussing forking out money to pay for something nobody even alive now did? Fucking virtue signalling joke. Why don’t we just have money spent on making people who are alive now safe and ok. You know, so people aren’t having to rely on food banks and be freezing and not affording rent.

SleepToad · 24/10/2024 21:58

Oh yes please. One of my ancestors was white, from Somerset and placed into slavery following the Monmouth rebellion.

Most people capturing slaves in West Africa were black. The earlier African slave trade was run by arabs.

And what about the jews who were the slaves of Egypt..the slaves that built the pyramids....the fact that the Zulu kingdom traded slaves...that there are still slaves in the Indian subcontinent, the middle and far east...

But hay let's approach the one western country that has supported growth in the commonwealth,consistently given billions in aid...why not approach German and Belgium, who's colonial past whilst much smaller was much much more brutal

iamtheblcksheep · 24/10/2024 21:59

Hemiola · 24/10/2024 21:37

I found myself getting irate at this today. Where does it end? Do my Welsh people get to ask for reparations from the English? Does the UK get reparation from the Romans?!
I absolutely recognise the hideous of our history of slavery but you cannot change the past, only learn from it and change our future. As others have said, sadly we are not addressing modern slavery.

It’s the only think that’s made me laugh today. It will never ever happen but the audacity of those demanding it is pretty hilarious.

CraftyPlumViewer · 24/10/2024 22:02

Hemiola · 24/10/2024 21:37

I found myself getting irate at this today. Where does it end? Do my Welsh people get to ask for reparations from the English? Does the UK get reparation from the Romans?!
I absolutely recognise the hideous of our history of slavery but you cannot change the past, only learn from it and change our future. As others have said, sadly we are not addressing modern slavery.

I don't know the answer to "where does it end" but Britain has certainly believed in and, at times, insisted on reparations where it was the wronged party (e.g. after WW1).

The nations that Britain harmed did not have the same leverage to demand reparations at the time slavery ended, as Britain did in relation to Germany post-war, but there have been some calls for reparations for slavery dating back centuries (to when it was abolished), so these are not new demands but rather demands that the UK has refused for centuries.

I don't think the Romans are a good example because I don't think many would argue that modern British people are economically disadvantaged by the former Roman occupation, and of course the Roman state no longer exists. People living in formerly colonies and other relevant countries do still suffer economic hardship as a result of colonialism (a lot of the direct evils of which, like stealing Indigenous children from their families, were still happening in Australia and Canada within living memory - although those governments have now made some payments of reparations).

I do think this is all academic because even if a British government had the will to pay reparations (which it wont), the country doesn't have the means - but I do think "what about the Romans", etc, is a little trite.

Controversialname · 24/10/2024 22:04

What was the purpose/function of the commonwealth? My history and geography are awful.

OP posts:
Heresoneimadearlier · 24/10/2024 22:04

violentovulation · 24/10/2024 19:27

I hope the UK does have to pay them. It's only fair.

You are happy for us tax payers to pay £18 trillion pounds according to the BBC?

Hunglikeapolevaulter · 24/10/2024 22:05

People living in formerly colonies and other relevant countries do still suffer economic hardship as a result of colonialism

A lot of the current suffering is corruption and shit governance though. Reparations will make a small amount of people even richer and the average person will get bugger all.

MereDintofPandiculation · 24/10/2024 22:07

violentovulation · 24/10/2024 19:27

I hope the UK does have to pay them. It's only fair.

Being descended on both sides from a long line of manual labourers/farmworkers, I need a little more convincing about why I am to blame and how much I have benefited.

Thatmakesperfectsense · 24/10/2024 22:08

With indigenous Brits becoming a minority in the country over the next 50-60 years surely the population who live in Britain and who's tax payments will have to pay the bill have no descendants who benifited through slavery.

As of the end of September 2024, the UK's debt is estimated to be 98.5% of its gross domestic product (GDP). This is equivalent to around £2.7 trillion, or about £96,000 per household.

We just can't afford it.

Hunglikeapolevaulter · 24/10/2024 22:08

What was the purpose/function of the commonwealth? My history and geography are awful.

It's an international association made up of former territories of the British Empire, but it's really more of a diplomacy thing now. Hence the focus being on royal tours and sporting tournaments.

cherrysonata · 24/10/2024 22:08

I suspect part of it is the Commonwealth nations see Starmer as a soft touch so it's a bit of a try on. Not without reason.

EasternStandard · 24/10/2024 22:09

cherrysonata · 24/10/2024 22:08

I suspect part of it is the Commonwealth nations see Starmer as a soft touch so it's a bit of a try on. Not without reason.

Yes a spokesperson said today a change of governance seemed a good reason to ask again

MereDintofPandiculation · 24/10/2024 22:10

Heresoneimadearlier · 24/10/2024 22:04

You are happy for us tax payers to pay £18 trillion pounds according to the BBC?

Or to put in in context, something like 15,000 times the entire annual government expenditure (1.2 billion (not trillion) for 2022-23)

FootbalIslife · 24/10/2024 22:12

We were the first to end slavery, Arabs and Africans at the time held more slaves than we did and continued to do so into this century.

Shall we get repatriations back from them? where’s the compensation from them? Where does it end?

what about the different empires that existed through time? The Belgians were notoriously cruel, are they giving reparations as well? Empires have been fought, won, lost, grown over many centuries. Trying to unpick who owes what to who, is utterly ridiculous.

Should the Germans give the Jews money and land? What about how China is exploiting Africa now?

Hemiola · 24/10/2024 22:14

CraftyPlumViewer · 24/10/2024 22:02

I don't know the answer to "where does it end" but Britain has certainly believed in and, at times, insisted on reparations where it was the wronged party (e.g. after WW1).

The nations that Britain harmed did not have the same leverage to demand reparations at the time slavery ended, as Britain did in relation to Germany post-war, but there have been some calls for reparations for slavery dating back centuries (to when it was abolished), so these are not new demands but rather demands that the UK has refused for centuries.

I don't think the Romans are a good example because I don't think many would argue that modern British people are economically disadvantaged by the former Roman occupation, and of course the Roman state no longer exists. People living in formerly colonies and other relevant countries do still suffer economic hardship as a result of colonialism (a lot of the direct evils of which, like stealing Indigenous children from their families, were still happening in Australia and Canada within living memory - although those governments have now made some payments of reparations).

I do think this is all academic because even if a British government had the will to pay reparations (which it wont), the country doesn't have the means - but I do think "what about the Romans", etc, is a little trite.

Thank you for your full and thoughtful reply..I do realise that my Romans comment was a little trite. I also recognise the benefits for economically to the UK and the damage economically and socially to those countries affected by slavery.
The whole situation is very complicated and hard to untangle but I'd still prefer to focus on future rather than history. But I do say that as someone not affected but these issues and therefore in a position of privilege.

Needanewname42 · 24/10/2024 22:20

GretchenWienersHair · 24/10/2024 20:51

This thread is making me feel sick. The racists really out themselves when this topic comes up.

For those of you talking about “shameless money grabs” or “things of the past”, the British government only finished paying off the descendants of the slave owners 2015, after they were paid compensation for the loss of income once slavery had been abolished. That’s my tax, your tax, and everyone else in Great Britain’s tax paying people who lost out when they could no longer enslave my ancestors. So, frankly, fuck you if you think it’s a “shameless money grab” or “should be kept in the past”. The damage that was done cannot be overturned and reparations is the very least that this government can do.

Given lots of decendents of slaves came to the UK from the Caribbean what is the logic in their taxes going to pay the Caribbean islands?

Should the UN ship everyone back to where their ancestors came from?

Let's not forget their were very poor people in the UK. People who maybe weren't slaves but weren't a kick in the backside from it.
People who lived in 'miners rows', or factory tenements, couldn't exactly look for a better job because that involved moving house, and the kids were already working with the same employer.

Maybe they'd be classed as modern day slaves. No real choice but to keep working, pay the rent to the employer, buy food in the local shops.

Travel wasn't easy either.
It's not all 'white privilege'

Secradonugh · 24/10/2024 22:21

Controversialname · 24/10/2024 22:04

What was the purpose/function of the commonwealth? My history and geography are awful.

There are many answers to this, some more truthful than others. But mainly it started with trade routes and protecting those boats. Realising we could use spices, tea etc
. As a form of barter. There was also the expansion from Spain, Portugal, france of conquering the world, and we didn't want them to secure those routes because we wanted them. To enable some of it we needed to have docks and navies in those areas so we decided that certain lands were ours and they became the commonwealth countries. That was usually done by trading technology, or religion, or ways of government. Sometimes it was violence. The Wikipedia article is actually a fair and unbiased review.

Bobcat246 · 24/10/2024 22:35

18 trillion divided by approximately 68 million UK citizens is around £265,000 a head. Divvy it up between the 37.4 million of us who pay income tax and it's £485,000 a head.

Still up for paying?

Nightthoughtss · 24/10/2024 22:43

What a load of bollicks. There’s slavery happening now in South Sudan.What’s with the endless self flagellation.

CraftyPlumViewer · 24/10/2024 22:44

FootbalIslife · 24/10/2024 22:12

We were the first to end slavery, Arabs and Africans at the time held more slaves than we did and continued to do so into this century.

Shall we get repatriations back from them? where’s the compensation from them? Where does it end?

what about the different empires that existed through time? The Belgians were notoriously cruel, are they giving reparations as well? Empires have been fought, won, lost, grown over many centuries. Trying to unpick who owes what to who, is utterly ridiculous.

Should the Germans give the Jews money and land? What about how China is exploiting Africa now?

Reparations have been similarly demanded from Belgium (and similarly have not been paid) and yes, Germany did pay reparations to holocaust survivors and the heirs of survivors (and those who did not).

I'm not sure who you mean by "we" but assuming you mean Britain, I'm not clear why you think Arabs and Africans should pay reparations to the UK?

JaneEyreLaughing · 24/10/2024 22:44

Firestace · 24/10/2024 19:31

We've already given billions in aid over the years to a lot countries that are wanting this.

Much Wants More

Hunglikeapolevaulter · 24/10/2024 22:45

I'm not clear why you think Arabs and Africans should pay reparations to the UK?

The Barbary slave trade?

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