To want to set boundaries with widowed parent and how not to feel too guilty or resentful

[GreatSnail]

I'll try to keep it brief as possible.

My parents split up when I was in primary school and my Dad moved back to his home town hours away from where I still live. He met my Step-Mum within a few months and they were together ever since till she passed away 4 months ago, so 30 years.

Step-Mum was a mixed character but very possessive of my Dad and my relationship with her was complicated due to that and that effected my relationship with my Dad so at one stage I had only 'phone contact with him for 6 years. In the last few years Step-Mum became chronically unwell and covid was a thing so I saw my Dad twice in 10 years till Step-Mum died.

As soon as she passed away I went to support him emotionally and practically and stayed for 2 weeks. Then I visited again for a few days after another couple of months and have two more visits planned in the next 6 months.

Dad calls every day, sometimes 2-3 times a day which i've been happy to go along with to support him but he stresses about things he doesn't need to and often, there are things he could do to make life less stressful for himself but he refuses.

I've been happy to step up and help him with things and offer support and visit even though there's lots of aspects of doing that that cause me a lot of stress; because i've been thinking it's early days and things will settle down.

But the last few weeks i've been gently hinting that I can't or don't want to talk to him every day and he just hasn't picked up on the hints. So i've said it out loud and it's clear that he's been expecting me to visit every few weeks and talk at least once a day forever, and he's getting really upset and saying he'll have no-one else to talk to and so on. I'm not suggesting I never talk to him, just not every day and that it's still early days and we can talk every day for now but that isn't healthy long-term for either of us.

If he was a demanding ass-hole it would be easier but he's not, he's just expressing his fears and vulnerability then I feel guilty and pressured.

And the other side is part of me thinks it's a bit of a cheek that he wasn't a particularly involved Father for the majority of my life and now that his circumstances have changed, he's wanting me to be the most important person in his life and for him to be the priority in mine but I don't want to think like that, feel resentful or drag up the past when he's vulnerable.

He's not elderly, he's just retirement age. He can look after himself and the house, he drives, has a dog, IMO no money worries but he still stresses about money. He's a lovely man, never abusive or nasty, not ND but very set in his ways. I don't have kids or other caring responsibilities but do work full-time, albeit remotely which makes it harder to be boundaried as he knows I have the time to talk to him every day.

Any advice from anyone who has gone through this or advice in general would be much appreciated as i've given it four months thinking he'd naturally need less support but he's becoming more not less dependent on me.

I have been ignoring it because it's been early days but clearly, i was setting up expectations which i'm not willing to meet forever.

Which is why i'm having the conversations about boundary setting now. It's just easy, hence seeking advice and it's helpful to hear all the different perspectives.

I’m sorry to read your post OP. My father did the same except my mother had died at the young age of 48. He moved on and prioritised every new woman in his life. He then married and I rarely saw us. She had no children and didn’t understand the child parent relationship. She controlled his access to us. When he died, she moved house and I’ve never heard from her again, including my kids who she knew from birth. Just goes to show she was never interested in us. Your father may be different but you control it.

I get it to some.extent. step mother here was thoroughly awful and made it very hard to have a relationship with him. She died in an awful way and since then I have had more of his time, however he has mainly turned to serial online dating. He's on his phone constantly.
I chose to accept that he was a pretty selfish weak.person who didn't stand up to sm for an easy life and who can't function on his own. I wish he was calling me more actually. So, n your case, I'd forgive the past, accept he is generally quite selfish yet for your sanity, arrange a weekly call and fortnightly visit.

I'm sorry OP, I don't say this to be unkind, but he sounds like a very selfish man, step mum was his emotional support, and now she is gone he is subbing you in because it suits him. I say this from a place of experience because I am estranged from my father due to his wife and I have no doubt should she never be around he'd be back pretending the last 15 years hadn't happened. Maybe she was abusive and controlling but at some point he made a choice to bit be very present for you and then to assume you'd pick up the mantle when she was gone.

I honestly think you should look into some counselling to support you in setting some boundaries.

One possibility is that he was selfish, another was that he was in an abusive relationship, something that happens to men as well as women.

Yeah, don’t do this. Won’t do either of you any good in the long run.

Is there a Men's shed nearby you can take him to when you visit next?
https://menssheds.org.uk/

I miss landlines in this situation, it was easier to tactfully avoid calls.

Sympathies.
I had to go very low contact with narcissist widowed mother, who thinks I'm here to give her my time and energy while she can emotionally abuse me as she wishes.
At 42, I chose my own life. Only regret is I didn't
"mature" earlier.

He could have been the best Dad in the world and it still wouldn’t be right that he was looking to you to meet all his emotional needs. This is selfish behaviour and doesn’t consider you as a person at all, just as his daughter, therefore available.

I was just thinking, imagine you were his son? If he rang you and started to talk about his past relationship you probably wouldn’t listen for hours would you? You’d probably change the subject.

I think I if your step mum was controlling he's probably a bit lost as that will have affected his ability to independently think, plan even socialise.

Try and find some activities he can do - does smoking really have to stop him? Seems a poor excuse to me

Bereavement and social clubs seem an excellent idea. It’s a shame that smoking is being a barrier to him maintaining a social life- any chance he’d consider quitting?

FWIW my experience is that men in this situation quite quickly find a new partner- I mean, surprisingly quickly. I don’t know how you would feel about that if it happened?

He didn't walk out.

Short story is he and Mum met when they both teens and Mums family were living in the area Dad was born in, married and had me. When Mums family moved to the other end of the country, we moved too (I was a baby).

FF a few years and Mum had an affair and wanted to separate, all of my Dads family, friends and history was in his home town so he moved back up there and stayed. He did lose everything then met Step-Mum very quickly and built a life with her and I understand why

So I did feel very, very sympathetic towards my Dad for years and hated my Mum for breaking up the family which is an extra layer of emotion and why it's not the case that he abandoned me or anything like that. Though he 100% put Step-Mum first which I don' t think he should have done as a parent and he is not at all blameless in how things went.

My dad ditched us in favour of step mum, but unlike you there's no way I'll be supporting him if she dies first.

You're a saint and he doesn't deserve you.

You need to tell him that you can call him twice a week, yes he'll be upset, allow him to be upset. He has to go through that upset to work out how to handle it going forward.

Have a think about when best to break that to him and make sure you have something to look after yourself with, as you'll be understandably upset too. Maybe have something to look forward to after the call.

Do some research into stuff he can fill his time with and meet new people and encourage him as much as possible to do those things.

Here's one:

https://www.ageuk.org.uk/services/befriending-services/

Be ready for him to put up all sorts of reasons why he shouldn't but keep reminding him he needs to find other ways to connect with people and live his life. You can't be it all for him.

How about you try to set a particular time for one call each day and then don’t pick up if he calls other times? You could agree one call a day and if he needs anything else then it’s WhatsApp. Explain that you have work. Then, set a routine where you meet for Sunday lunch once every two weeks/ frequency that suits you.

Maybe suggest a time for a call each day so that at the very least you feel a bit in control. Tell him this would suit you best as you have work and other commitments. And during those calls, talk to him about ways he can open up his life a bit. Maybe research some ideas for him yourself.
You are both making up for lost time but.this has to be in a balanced way.
I am widowed ... it is pretty bloody tough TBH especially as I have been ill .... but I am determined that my troubles should be as little burden to my family as possible. It is a difficult balance as, like you, they want to help and I have to consider that, but I also make sure I talk a lot about all the things I am doing to fill my life, which is what your dad does not have ... yet.
I am lucky to have musical interests and talents so these fill a good chunk of my life. I also belong to the local U3A (and in fact run concert trips for them) and they are a godsend ... endless interest groups and social events ... you might research this in your area.
By the way .... I am quite a bit older than him!
Good luck with this.

Sending love and strength to you. What a difficult mix of emotions. My mother is bereaved and we don't have the complex history and I've still had to put in my own boundaries as the effect on my own wellbeing, my grief and my family was growing and growing. I also don't share my full diary and bend the truth. A work call might actually be a speed bath before having to pick up kids or a dentist appt might actually be a quiet walk to bakery for my own sanity.
Id ask you to consider that to be kind, these boundaries will benefit him too. There's lots of great helplines that are a listening ear. Would it be worth earmarking a time each week that suits you that you can have a proper chat? Or would it be possible to extend the time gap each time? Eg I'll ring you on Monday then Thursday then Wednesday then next Wed etc !?

Bit of both.

He was/is selfish and I don't know if i'd say his relationship with SM was abusive but she was definitely controlling and moody and weaponised her experiences in her 1st marriage (not to my Dad), and her MH - she was always sensitive, anxious, needy etc.

She didn't speak to me for years which was a pattern for her throughout her life with her family (including her DD), friends etc. When she died, it was a minefield trying to figure out who to invite to the funeral because of it. I'm not sure if a lot of her family even know she'd dead as they'd been estranged for so long.

I saw how she was growing up and knew to keep in her favour but in my 20s I got a bit more vocal and boundaried, hence her not talking to me for years and then when she started talking to me again, I just put aside all my feelings about her to keep her on side so I could see my Dad more/have a better relationship with him, even though Dad had never stopped talking to me, it was difficult.

But my Dad could have, if he'd wanted to, left her at any time if he chose to but he didn't. It was a controlling relationship but I wouldn't say coercive control really, though other people might, I don't.

Feelings aren’t facts, just because you feel guilty doesn’t mean you should. Therapists say to sit with the guilt and I have found that helpful as guilt is a horrible feeling and often we will do anything to stop it.

he is manipulating you, pulling on your heart strings in my opinion. He needs a woman to look after him, doesn’t matter who it is.

I'm sorry to hear about that.

It does sound a bit different to my situation but with some similarities too.

I'm glad my Step-Mum died first to be honest as i'm able to hear my Dads views of their relationship and have a closer relationship to him.

She'd said in the past that she wanted to have a relationship with me if Dad died and I said oh of course, but had Dad died first I would have never spoken to her again and I suspect she'd have me taken out of the will and I wouldn't have given a shit. I was very prepared to lose inheritance if the alternative was faking that I liked her and having to have her in my life.

But - when I was younger and going through a lot, good or bad, we were very close at times. She was a complicated person and because of that, her relationships with everyone in her life were complicated so my feelings towards her now she's dead are also complicated.

You were a primary aged child when moved away to his home town, married your step-mum and stepped away from your relationship. I think that was unforgiveable and he is very entitled to believe that he is deserving of your time and attention with daily phone calls and regular visits.

He was a dreadful father to you and you shouldn't feel any guilt about setting boundaries.

I wish my Dad was on his 'phone constantly lol.

One of the stressors we have is he refuses to come into the 21st century and have a smartphone, so anything online, have an email address etc.

So that's often related to what he's stressing to me about, things that i'm having to do for him and so on.

@GreatSnail You may find the Elderly Parents board is a more supportive place for your question

I always thought he'd find someone else very quickly just because he's literally never lived alone.

He went from his Mum to marrying my Mum (they were teens), then back to his Mum for a few months when my Mum had an affair and ended the relationship and he was living with SM within a few months of relocating back to his home town and then with her ever since.

I have spoken to him about maybe meeting someone else in the future and he's saying he's not interested so far. Partly because he's been a carer for the last few years and with his age, wouldn't want to end up with high levels of caring responsibilities again and I get that.

The fact he's been a carer for years means he's really able to do almost everything he needs to be live independently and look after himself; it's the social and emotional support and interaction that he's missing. He's not one of those men in his 60s who can't cook, clean, iron, pay a bill, organise finances or arrange appts. So long as it's not online, he's really good with all that stuff.

Edit - I didn't answer your question, I'd be fine with him having another relationship so long as it seemed healthy and not like he was being exploited or taken advantage of.

I have very similar feelings to you about my parents. Different background to you, they made their own choices, putting themselves first and before anything we needed. (moved abroad, we saw them once a year).

As they have aged, they need me more, when they returned to the UK they chose to move an hour away from me.

It feels complicated working through your feelings it doesn't it?

I don't resent them their choices, we all have the right to create a life that suits us. However, I keep the same mantra about my choices too and refuse to feel guilty about not being able to be fully there for them.
My parents choices have impacted our relationship and the practicalities of our lives now. These are not of my choosing.

In your situation I wouldn't be as vocal with him about ‘ we will speak in two days’, or ‘in the long term we won’t have this much contact’, he can't process that yet and is scared.

I would very slowly wean him off. (as a teacher/headteacher I have had to do that with parent contact!).

So feed the need now as he is anxious.
Next don't pick up his call but respond five minutes later with a call back, 10 minutes later, 20 minutes later.
In your responses replace a text with a call and extend the time between. Your messages could start to say ‘ busy at work, call in 30’. Eventually you can start to leave the return call to the next day. Eventually you will have a pattern that suits you, but that he is secure with.

Whilst doing that set a date for your next visit, so he knows that he isn't going to be abandoned. Keep reminding him of the visit. Plan to go out together, local pub, a group etc, to give him a start. Repeat the next time you visit. He might continue without you, he might not, but you have given him the support, his choice if he doesn't.

I manage my parents in a similar way. We talk once a week by phone. If I'm busy and miss the call I return it as soon as I can. Sometimes I'm not up to talking either and I return the missed call at a later time. I have tried going out to groups with them when I'm there and ask about them when I call. They don't really maintain the opportunities they have around them, but that is their choice.

I've accepted that our relationship is only OK, we are not really close. That is the choices they made and I am not going to feel guilty about that.

You sound really caring. Look after you!