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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be shocked deferring by a year has become this common?

432 replies

Killiam · 01/10/2024 14:32

My DS is 4, his birthday is august 28th, he started school this year.
Today I went to a session at his school where parents were invited in to see what they have been doing etc.
After I was talking to some parents and they noted more than once how tiny he is, I said ah well he has just turned 4 so makes sense. This is when I learned of his class of 24 kids, 4 of them should have started the year before 1 June birthday, 2 July and 1 August. The next closest in age to my son is a June baby so no other July or August babies born his year at all!
DS seems to be doing well but when I asked the other summer parents why they decided to defer they basically all said they just felt their kids needed more time, nothing the separates them from DS.
DS does cry most days going in and couldn't write his name or anything before starting.
The school is in central London and is very diverse but lots of Eastern European and Asian parents and Ive learn that in most of those countries 6 or even 7 is a more common. starting age so I wonder if that plays a role?

AIBU to be shocked it is so common to defer now? Starting to wonder if I made the right choice!

OP posts:
12345678sh · 01/10/2024 18:29

I have two summer born children (July) I held one back due to some on going health stuff that was resolved by the time he was 5 and my other child I didn't hold back and I really regret it. She's struggled so much more. She's just gone into year 3 and she's getting there.

peebles32 · 01/10/2024 18:30

I wish it could be like other parts of the world. Children are not ready at four. I know it varies dependant on child but I really think the whole system needs an overhaul. The assessment at the end of reception is based on the norm so not a true reflection for a lot of kids.

Foxxo · 01/10/2024 18:31

all i will say is that i have a september kid, and my bestie had an august 28th kid.

It took her child until Yr 5 to academically catch up to mine, and her child was made to feel stupid because she struggled to keep up as much, even though i pointed out that my DS was almost an entire YEAR older than she was.

SunriseMonsters · 01/10/2024 18:31

Redmat · 01/10/2024 18:15

Well logically if this trend continues in a big way our children's year groups will change from June to June year groups and May children will become the youngest.

Yes. That would be the ideal outcome within current legislation. As stated upthread, it isn't about who is the youngest in the class. It is about starting school so young being objectively bad for children. If all children in a class were born in August it would be better for them all to start at 5 than at 4. That is the reason for the policy because the data shows this unequivocally.

The best thing would be to move school starting age to 6/7 like most other countries. But the best than can be achieved in the current system - you are correct - would be all summer born children being deferred so that rhe youngest are those born in April who would be 4 yrs 5 months when they start in the Sept. Still too young, but better for children than just turned 4.

Completelyjo · 01/10/2024 18:32

SunriseMonsters · 01/10/2024 18:15

All very well and good in primary - get to high school and suddenly it's a bit weird that there's a 15 year old in a class of 13 year olds. Your child is going to stick out like a sore thumb. Ditto when they hit university and they're the oldest by a mile.

Huh? They are a few days older than the Sept born kids in their class. 🤣

I think this poster could have done with being kept back, they can’t understand simple maths!

Jellycats4life · 01/10/2024 18:32

SunriseMonsters · 01/10/2024 18:15

All very well and good in primary - get to high school and suddenly it's a bit weird that there's a 15 year old in a class of 13 year olds. Your child is going to stick out like a sore thumb. Ditto when they hit university and they're the oldest by a mile.

Huh? They are a few days older than the Sept born kids in their class. 🤣

Exactly! It isn’t like that at all.

It’s more like “a just turned 15 year old in a class of mostly 14 year olds and a few with summer birthdays about to turn 14”.

I deferred my May born son (he is autistic) and no child gives a monkeys that he’s a mere 3.5 months older than the next oldest kid in the class.

Pottedpalm · 01/10/2024 18:33

Waitformetoarrive · 01/10/2024 17:53

I think it depends on the school. My DS was a late summer baby and started in the September so he had just turned 4. It was a small village school with a full time teacher and full time TA with only 6 kids. He thrived even though some people (the owners of the private nursery he attended ) thought he was too young. He is 20 now, it didn’t have a negative impact on him at all although deferring him, I think would have.

Edited

A full time teacher and a TA for six children!

Positivenancy · 01/10/2024 18:36

When I was in secondary (in Ireland) I had a guy in my final year (6th year) who was repeating the year. He was 19…nearly 20.We had a newly qualified maths teacher that year…she was 21. We thought it was quite funny.

HollyKnight · 01/10/2024 18:37

I probably would have waited a year I think. I was a summer child and the second youngest in my class. Got treated differently by my peers and there was a noticible difference in maturity level which impacted on making friends. I was barely 10 years old when I sat the 11+. It felt very unfair.

JumpinJellyfish · 01/10/2024 18:45

SunriseMonsters · 01/10/2024 18:31

Yes. That would be the ideal outcome within current legislation. As stated upthread, it isn't about who is the youngest in the class. It is about starting school so young being objectively bad for children. If all children in a class were born in August it would be better for them all to start at 5 than at 4. That is the reason for the policy because the data shows this unequivocally.

The best thing would be to move school starting age to 6/7 like most other countries. But the best than can be achieved in the current system - you are correct - would be all summer born children being deferred so that rhe youngest are those born in April who would be 4 yrs 5 months when they start in the Sept. Still too young, but better for children than just turned 4.

April borns count as summer for the purposes of deferral, so the cut off would be end March, with the youngest starting at 4.5. This is similar to what happens on average in Ireland - much more sensible.

pucelleauxblanchesmains · 01/10/2024 18:47

I have an early summer birthday and back in the day when I started school, you could start September or January, so I started January at 4 and a half.

Think that was a nice compromise. I found out later from my parents that there was talk of me skipping a year when I was 8 or so but they decided I wouldn't have been emotionally ready and that was 100% the right call since I'd have been nearly 2 years younger than the oldest children in my new class.

Tbh I don't understand why being middle class/pushy in this case is so bad! I know someone has to be the youngest but some children just can't cope at just turned 4.

AndSoFinally · 01/10/2024 18:52

I don't understand everyone saying you're holding them back a year.

Surely if you defer it just means they start school in year 1 and don't do a Reception year? They don't start reception at 5? Or do they start in Reception and lose a year around year 4 or 5 or something?

GabriellaMontez · 01/10/2024 18:58

HollyKnight · 01/10/2024 18:37

I probably would have waited a year I think. I was a summer child and the second youngest in my class. Got treated differently by my peers and there was a noticible difference in maturity level which impacted on making friends. I was barely 10 years old when I sat the 11+. It felt very unfair.

I don't know when this was, but nowadays, they account for age in the 11+.

Dimmies · 01/10/2024 18:58

My summer born child started school a year later then is usual over here. It was the best decision ever. The difference in their readiness and confidence at 4 compared to 5 was vast. I come from a country where the school starting age isn't so rigid. It was common to have an age gap of up to 18 months between the oldest and youngest in a year and guess what? It didn't create difficulties for anyone and we genuinely didn't notice anyone's age except when we went to birthday parties.

Parents know their own child best. For us, it was absolutely the best decision. For others, it won't be.

PumpkinPie2016 · 01/10/2024 18:59

It doesn't seem common at DS primary (though he is Y6 now).
He is a November birthday so never an issue but there are children with June-August birthdays in his class that are in the 'right' year.

I only know one family who deferred for their eldest child. She is now in sixth form so was a while ago.
She has a mid August birthday but was born at 23 weeks weighing less than a pound! As you can imagine, she spent a long time in hospital and they just felt she wasn't ready.

It means she will be almost 19 when she finishes 6th form but otherwise she would only have been 18 after 6th form finished and potentially going to uni a matter of weeks later.

DoloresHargreeves · 01/10/2024 18:59

Both options are normal in my circles, some august borns are deferred and others are not. My friends have made these decisions based on their children and whether they thought they would be bored or would benefit from another year at nursery before school. My own DS is on the older side of his class, but would not have been ready at just gone 4 and I would have deferred. We are blessed with council run nurseries that are covered by the 30 hours in my area though, so finances don't come into it.

Completelyjo · 01/10/2024 19:03

AndSoFinally · 01/10/2024 18:52

I don't understand everyone saying you're holding them back a year.

Surely if you defer it just means they start school in year 1 and don't do a Reception year? They don't start reception at 5? Or do they start in Reception and lose a year around year 4 or 5 or something?

No, in the majority of cases they start reception the following year when they are 5 rather than just turned 4.

They don’t lose a year later, they start in reception and carry on as normal.

HideTheCroissants · 01/10/2024 19:03

AndSoFinally · 01/10/2024 18:52

I don't understand everyone saying you're holding them back a year.

Surely if you defer it just means they start school in year 1 and don't do a Reception year? They don't start reception at 5? Or do they start in Reception and lose a year around year 4 or 5 or something?

No, the parents deferring ARE holding them back a year. Starting in reception the September AFTER they turn five. I understand why they want to but it can cause different problems as they progress through the school system.

My two were summer born. One was absolutely ready to go to school in the September - she is 10 months younger than her (still 22 years later) best friend who turned five that September. My second probably could have done with a little longer but he was fine after the first half term.

HollyKnight · 01/10/2024 19:04

GabriellaMontez · 01/10/2024 18:58

I don't know when this was, but nowadays, they account for age in the 11+.

The 1990s. It's good that they take it into account now, but that just shows that they know age makes a difference in education.

ISpyNoPlumPie · 01/10/2024 19:05

Thank you @Hecatoncheires. I have responded to SunriseMonsters no less than three or four times I believe. I pointed out the this is an equity issue (an issue of fairness) because even though on paper it seems that everyone has a fair and even choice to defer their child, the fact of the matter is that only certain groups of people do this, and those people are already more privileged (more wealthy, higher educational levels, less likely to be a member of a minority ethnic group). I made the point that keeping children in their age appropriate academic year (outside of exceptional reasons) would be more of a leveller than allowing more privileged parents to create more privileged circumstances for themselves.

SunriseMonster disagreed with that point. They said it was not a benefit that is only available to wealthy people (although an analysis helpfully shared by a PP demonstrates that this is not true). SunriseMonster did not want to engage with these arguments.

SunriseMonster, like yourself, also did not agree that sometimes people make decisions based on the greater good rather than on the basis of their personal capacity to benefit. I decided not to defer my August born child's school start. I did that in the full knowledge or what I could and couldn't do, and with the ability to make the decision without financial constraints - a position of privilege. There were no exceptional circumstances in my child's case, and I didn't think it was right - morally, so I didn't do it. I could also afford to privately educate my children, Again, I chose not to because I don't think it is right or fair. So yes, people do make moral decisions that they believe will not cause undue harm but would directly benefit themselves or their loved ones, but because we know that we don't exist outside of other people. Society only works to the extent that it works for the most vulnerable and deprived - that is, if you believe in society. Fundamentally, SunriseMonsters and I have different belief systems AND we enact those belief systems in different ways.

Subsequently, SunriseMonsters asked me if I would act abusively towards my children. If I would shout at them, or deprive them of love and affection because some children are deprived of love and affection. SunriseMonsters asked me if I would do harmful things on purpose to my children to level the playing field. They said not doing so gives them an unfair advantage. I still don't understand the logical steps between I don't want to give my children an unfair advantage and some children are abused so I should abuse my children and SunriseMonster could not explain this. They just repeated the same point and said they had applied my "exact stated logic to other parenting scenarios". This is when I realised I was wasting my time. How can one have a reasoned argument with someone who says you should abuse your children to level the playing field. But I didn't mention anything about levelling the playing field or dragging people down (that was SunriseMonster), I was making a point about equity, fairness, and how I act in accordance with my values. SunriseMonster clearly feels badly about their choices or they would not be quite so belligerent and rude themselves. Conversely, I feel good about my choice.

So you say I have deflected and that I have been rather rude. One could accuse SunriseMonster of the same. Perhaps you could mete out your criticism more fairly. Or perhaps you prefer, as many do, to reserve it for people you don't agree with. And perhaps you'll now agree with me that this WAS a waste of 10 minutes of my life!!

Completelyjo · 01/10/2024 19:06

@HideTheCroissants I understand why they want to but it can cause different problems as they progress through the school system.

What problems?

HideTheCroissants · 01/10/2024 19:09

Completelyjo · 01/10/2024 19:06

@HideTheCroissants I understand why they want to but it can cause different problems as they progress through the school system.

What problems?

As I said in a few places up thread, some secondary schools are difficult about taking children out of cohort.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/summer-born-children-school-admission/summer-born-children-starting-school-advice-for-parents

Summer born children starting school: advice for parents

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/summer-born-children-school-admission/summer-born-children-starting-school-advice-for-parents

ISpyNoPlumPie · 01/10/2024 19:11

Oh @Hecatoncheires - I also agreed with SunriseMonsters that there should be no rush to start the school curriculum (6/7 years is more appropriate as SunriseMonsters stated). But we don't currently have the good universal early years provision that would allow this for most parents. Until that is available and the compulsory school age changes, there will be this disparity that only a small number of already advantaged people capitalise on.

DoloresHargreeves · 01/10/2024 19:13

Donke9 · 01/10/2024 17:35

What happens when all these children reach GCSE and A level age? Are they able to start 6th form a year late too? I’d imagine that being held back a year seems more of a disadvantage when you are 15/16/17/18/19.

Why? Especially for boys, I'd imagine there is still an advantage to sitting GCSEs at 16 instead of 15, and A levels at 18 instead of 17. Advantages both in terms of maturity to take it seriously and in terms of brain development.

DoloresHargreeves · 01/10/2024 19:16

Redmat · 01/10/2024 18:15

Well logically if this trend continues in a big way our children's year groups will change from June to June year groups and May children will become the youngest.

Yeah, but that would be good. The point isn't to avoid being the youngest in the class, it's to avoid sending children to school when they're too little and not ready to go yet. If the youngest are born in May then all the children at school will be at least 4 and 4 months.