To think that workplaces should be less accommodating of personal lives?

[HangryDenimBird]

I’ve noticed workplaces bending over backwards to accommodate personal lives. AIBU to think that employees should keep their personal issues separate from work?

For small companies it can be difficult as there just isn't the cash flow to support people, to give them the total flexability they want and still get the work done.
Maternity leave has been a big issue for us, when out of a workforce of 10, three got pregnant at the same time. It was very hard to cover their payment and employ someone to cover their work at the same time. Plus having to cover other personal issues within the rest of the team.
I used to work in a bank and they were able to cover the full salary for someone having treatment for cancer for a year, as much I would love to be able to do that with my current company, I just couldn't afford it.

This is the argument people use when they say they shouldn't have to offer maternity leave or buy adapted equipment for disabled employees.

It is absolutely the employer's problem to treat people fairly and decently, we have legislation to ensure employers don't hide behind the "it's not my problem" excuse.

It is also in the interests of the whole country not to lose the input of huge swathes of our population to the workplace.

When my DS had sepsis and pneumonia as a baby, which developed into an empyema (which required surgery 2 weeks before christmas) my husbands boss was shouting down the phone at him about his Christmas bookings. He didn't care that my DS (who was 1 at the time) was dying at that one point and was in resus. 4 days later my DH returned to work once DS woke up from surgery and the Christmas bookings were fine. It soured the relationship and he left not long after.
The company my DH is with now is much better. When I had an aneurysm 2 years ago, they let him have as much time as he required (he worked from home as much as he could). As soon as I was stable, he returned to his role. The company valued his position and the fact he had a family.

I agree with this in part as long as people deliver.

What I don't agree with is when someone is clearly running businesses on work time, work know about it and do nothing.

If it’s reciprocal then great, employer supports their employee with flexibility and vice versa. Sadly in all my years and years of management it tends to be expected that employer will be flexible and it doesn’t always come back the other way. For example one employee (not my dept) wanted to change days to do a hobby course which my company facilitated even though it was tricky to organise. When that employee was asked to help out to cover unexpected bereavement leave they refused (without reason). When they were pulled up on it they threw a very unprofessional strop and then left to find another (much worse pay/conditions) job. I always wondered what their problem was. Once you’ve pissed someone off they are not going to do you any favours back. Reciprocity is pretty much the glue that holds human society together, it surprises me how many people don’t get that.

In the words of Inspector John Rebus...FYTP.

Ridiculous to not show any compassion to employees and their home lives which can impact their working lives. DH has been off sick with stress for long periods due to lack of empathy from management. He just couldn't carry on. Occupational health now involved and things are improving. Reasonable adjustments are being made.

Saying that, my DH has to be VERY ill to take time off. The only time he's been off work (with his current company) was my SAH and when he was hospitalised with Flu.

unfortunately, I’ve witnessed very similar. team members totally taking the mickey and then bring pissed off when the favours and perks dry up. Sadly, everyone misses out.

I manage quite a big team of people and I give them total flexibility as long as they do their work and don't decline work meetings during reasonable hours (I call reasonable 10-3) without a good reason, like a hospital appointment. Some work 10-6, some 8-4, some pick up their kids at 3pm then do another hour in the evening when their partner is home; they come to the office 1-3 times a week, but I let them choose when so it suits their life, because why on earth not? I choose my office days based on what nights of the week I'm going out on, and how heavily it is raining (obviously according to what I have going on at work too).

We have very little sick leave in my team, and targets are met - and staff turnover has decreased. I work in public sector so I can't exactly give people a payrise, so this is a way to make their work/life balance better and their overall wellbeing higher. Work should not be a punishment.

In fairness to the OP it sounds like "bending over backwards" is happening for normal life occurrences, not for the exceptional out of the blue occurrences. Obviously shit happens and when it does, things can fall apart a bit and sympathy/accommodation is required. It's when it becomes mainstream that you have to worry more about the impact on the business and other colleagues. An accommodation to collect children from school, say, cannot be made for one individual - it has to be extended to all parents, and once it has been, it's hard to keep it contained at just children - it would be to care for elderly parents etc., and before you know where you are, people leave early to get a shop in. So it really all depends on keeping it reasonable. I feel like some workplaces (incl. mine) have gone beyond the reasonable. In fact we know from anonymous feedback surveys that this is causing huge resentment.

You really understood my point, and I appreciate that you read my post carefully instead of jumping to conclusions. It’s definitely a tricky balance for workplaces to strike.

Your post was fairly devoid of context and detail to be fair.

Your post had the bare minimum info, you can’t moan at people for not understanding you.

Me too. I disappear for 2 hours during the working day to see my personal trainer once a week

Do work know? Yes. Do I travel at weekends and log on in the middle of the night to join a meeting with people in a different time zone? Also yes. Would I be prepared to do either of those if I worked somewhere that expected teams to be green 9-5? No I wouldn't

I have skills and experience that my company needs, I deliver and I am an adult. I expect work to treat me like one.

Yes. We have a woman at our place who regularly takes "mental health" breaks the day after posting her drug fuelled antics from the night before all over social media. She has managed to wangle WFH every Monday...even though she can't do her job WFH and has no internet at her new place even if she could.

She often sits doing bugger all and management won't do a thing because she has pulled the mental health card, so is now "protected". She broke up with her partner and took sick leave. This is a 25 year old woman who had been with her partner for a year max for crying out loud! Drives me insane!

If they weren't still making a profit off of their labour, then they wouldn't.

I have worked in a number of places. I have had good and poor manager's. The reality is that people have lives beyond work. At times workers need some flexibility re taking time off or using some holidays to deal with certain things. If you have health issues, a sick child or partner or elderly parents you may need some time off and some bosses then can show a bit of flexibility. Then at later stage this worker can be more willing to work extra hours or cover when someone else's is on holidays.

One of my friends recently refused to apply for a role the boss wanted them to apply for.
They knew the boss delegates a lot of their work to this role. The same boss had shown no flexibility to my friend when they asked for a certain thing. This was despite my friend doing extra hours and days when the business was very short staffed.

My friend is planning to leave this job in the next 6- 12 months for a number of reasons.

:-)

That is bad. The issue must be addressed.

My daughter works in a place where they treat their employees like their own family !!
it’s a very good company to work for they have staff that don’t leave and they have rounds of interviews so they get the right candidates in !
I have never known a company like it !! And from what I see it woukd do other companies the world of good to treat there staff like this my daughter loves her jobs and works really hard so tbh it’s a win win all round

An accommodation to collect children from school, say, cannot be made for one individual - it has to be extended to all parents

No it doesn't. Flexi working arrangements can be given to one team member if it has no impact on the team - we have one team member who doesn't start until 9:30 because he drops his kids at school, it can be a bit of a pain at times because overnight issues need handled first thing in the mornings. I wouldn't ask for/or be allowed the same because it would leave us without cover at times and as I am a grown up I can accept he got in there first with his request.

We (ab)use it to the teams benefit and if anything needs watching after 4pm he picks it up instead of us hanging about - it means at times he gets stuck with late nights if something happens late afternoon as he is the only one left in, so it all evens out and works for the team as a whole.

Also flexi working should not only be extended to parents, it is supportive for anyone with any caring responsibilities, or anything else, as long as there is strong management and a good team ethos it should not be a issue.

If there are issues with resentment that needs dealt with, removing the flexi working option might feel like an easy fix but it is no guarantee those feeling resentment will not move onto something else to complain about.

things like that are the same as schools use to justify not accommodating childrens needs. "IF we do it for one, we have to do it for everyone"

Its a fallacy and patently incorrect. Employment law, like school guidelines, allow space for reasonable accommodations to be made on a case by case basis in special circumstances.

The resentment is the other employees issue, and quite honestly, as long as the employer is being fair and Sue has negotiated time to leave early to collect her kids due to lack of childcare, or because one is disabled, then it's between Sue and HR and no-one elses business.

You really understood my point, and I appreciate that you read my post carefully instead of jumping to conclusions. It’s definitely a tricky balance for workplaces to strike.

Wow. You are accusing people of not reading your vague, two-sentence OP correctly?

And the sum total of your engagement with hundreds of posts is “it’s a tricky balance to strike?”.

Talk about entitled.

I agree.

But my experience is this. Flexibility on an individual basis works really great when your employees are natural responsible people who want to do a good job.

When they aren't, or when some aren't', it makes it more difficult for everyone. Because often you can't say, oh, I know Adam there is a piss taker, or has a poor work ethic, or even that he struggles without direct management, so I won't give him flexibility. But I will for Marie because she is a great responsible employee.

People like Adam will call that out as favoritism or discrimination in an instant.

Or you get less resilient people always needing small, maybe not unreasonable accommodations, so when others need them occasionally there isn't any flexibility left.

This IMO is one reason a lot of workplaces have pulled back from WFH. It's great for those who have a good work ethic and can manage themselves. It's less good for those who are por at self-management, are still learning the ropes, or are a bit lazy. And most workplaces have such people.

Especially in public or non-profit types of settings, a huge deal is made about treating people equally. So the culture and often management don't allow a lot of differential decision making.