To not go on the residential?

[Youthiswastedontheyoung]

I've just started a new p/t teaching role. Towards the end of the academic year the whole year group go on a residential which is about 3.5 hours away, for a full school week.
I have a just-turned 4 yo and other academic commitments outside of school.
AIBU to say I can't attend the residential?
As an aside, my mum (love her) thought teachers got paid for any additional hours regarding this. She was surprised to learn I'd just be getting my standard pay!

The legal entitlement to paid holiday is 5.6 weeks per year in the UK. No one should just be having 4.5 weeks.

I was utterly grateful for the teachers at DD's primary school to make residentials possible.

She did one overnight stay in Y4 in school, 3 nights in Y5 in an outdoor center and a full week in Y6.

The teachers definitely went above and beyond their normal duties, her Y6 teacher had a pregnant wife at that time and it was a bit of a wobble if another teacher would have to come and was on standby. I know that at least 2 teachers had small children.

I do hope that teachers are aware that there is extra work involved, unpaid and more often long hours when they choose the job. But I hope that they chose the profession because they utterly believe in their jobs and making a difference.

When I see DD's drama teacher at secondary now, they spent 3 months of weekends and evenings preparing for a huge musical which is the highlight of the year and one reason for the school's popularity.

Of course they bloody don't.

I was a teacher for 30 years and never went on one.

I think the only reason people are making the comparison is because the OP asked whether there was any other profession where people were expected to put in extra hours for free. And of course there are. Most professionals are paid a salary rather than an hourly rate.

Re the usual comments about teachers working hours above what they are contracted for, and suggestions they are the only profession that does this. Actually most salaried jobs require you to work above the contracted hours, especially well paid roles, in public and private sector. My job is contracted 37 hours per week but I usually work between 50 and 60.
Some teachers give the profession a bad name by relentlessly presenting themselves as the most put upon and hard done to.

It certainly is within our local authority. And I’d question the sense of anyone who would think it is okay to drink when you are responsible for 60 kids. If something goes wrong, regardless of fault, the fact staff had been drinking would be highlighted all over the reports/ investigations/ press.
Im glad to hear some people are thankful to staff for doing these trips. For many of us, the return is marked by not so much as a thank you or a kind word.

Just say No you can't do it.

I used to work in a school as a TA and some of the team used to volunteer for these sort of residentials. Not my cup of tea but some staff members like them and have the set up at home to make it easy for them to attend residentials.

No pressure on anyone to attend who didn't want to.

LMAO. Are you for real?!?! I don't know any professionals who don't work extra hours for "free".

I'm a teacher.

I think some posters have missed the fact that you are part time. In all the schools I've worked in, it hasn't been expected that part time staff will go on residentials. Part-timers are generally expected to come in for parents' evenings on their non-contracted days (in one school I worked in, you were paid 'additional hours' for this, but not in the others), but school trips involving overnights have not been part of the expectation for part-timers, unless the teacher is eager to go.

Try corporate law! Then you get to work round the clock and through the night too!

Ah but it doesn't involve teaching so it's not the same and not as hard

Negotiate all day draft all night whilst with jet lag! I was practically hallucinating. Fun times!

And get well paid for it which is the deal you make when you choose that profession.

Teaching does not have that level of expectation and is not as well paid.

Are you the poster who was a HLTA and was planning to a masters in psychology or something? Teaching really isn't the career for you, you seem to really resent it. Why can't your DH, look after your child instead of your elderly mother anyway?

Teacher for 20 years. It has always been expected that you attend the residential ( which is always part of the year5/6 curriculum) . You applied for the role, interviewed and took the job when offered it. What did you think would happen with the residential trip? Were you hoping that someone else would take the children ? If it's okay for them to do it then it's okay for you to do it.

I'm pointing out that your assumption that the OP will be grateful for teachers taking her child away in a few years time is a big leap. I feel no thanks to the vile woman who watched my child being terrorised. I feel no gratitude to the Head who put pressure on us to encourage her to go. The money wasn't an issue for us but I know parents who just couldn't find the money and their children must have felt left out if they wanted to go and I know parents who went without to save the money for the trip. When my GS told us who'd just been promoted to a senior leadership role at my son's old school my son laughed and said he remembered the night when he was in year 7 and that teacher was newly qualified and slept in a drunken stupor in their dorm one night as he was too drunk to find his room. Yes I was so grateful he went on that trip.

I have no idea why a residential needs to be a 3.5 hr journey away, in what way would a residential an hour away mean they can't have all that bonding and cementing friendships? Another nightmare for one of mine was travel sickness, really bad travel sickness which wasn't helped with popping a pill or wearing a wristband. Wouldn't it be cheaper and less intimidating for some children if they knew that they were closer to home? Wouldn't it be better for the OP who could attend daily to support her children and colleagues on her working day and go home to her own child.

Two of my children experienced their first residential "camping" out in the school hall for a weekend. They did lots of games and activities, it cost the princely sum of the money for their trip to the local fish and chip shop on the Friday night and a bit of money towards foods. Every child could attend, every child was happy to attend, they all did their bonding without long journeys, expense and issues for teachers as it was easy for them to swap round over the weekend.

I know local primary and senior schools are doing their residentials abroad, the junior schools seem to go to France, Belgium or the Netherlands. Why is that necessary? The senior schools I've known of doing trips to the Amazon, Colorado, South Africa plus of course the skiing trips to France/Switzerland or wherever. Huge costs in a coastal town with lots of deprivation.

In short yes I'd be perfectly happy if residentials were stopped or controls put in place e.g maximum costs.

I’ll start by saying I don’t think teachers get the respect and appreciation they deserve. I’m very grateful for all their (your) hard work and find the recruitment and retention crisis very worrying.

On the subject of the residential whilst you wouldn’t be unreasonable to say no, I assume if every teacher had the attitude of ‘why should I work extra and stay overnight’ then residentials wouldn’t happen. Would you want your own children to go on residentials where teachers gave up their time to take them? I’m guessing you would.

Edited to add there are loads of jobs where people regularly work outside of their contracted hours, in fact most professional roles.

how much are teachers paid? on average

Definitely don't go, you're setting boundaries. It isn't compulsory and it isn't paid.

I mean FGS whose meant to look after your 4 year old....and who is going to pay for said 7 day 24 hour wrap around care? Certainly not you as you don't even get overtime.

Good for you if you don't go ... It's a ridiculous expectation.

How to tell us you nothing about teaching without telling us you know nothing about teaching.

You really don’t have to go @Youthiswastedontheyoung These are volunteer roles, and given the attitude of some PPs on this thread, I’d not be putting my hand up. Many parents have no idea and little gratitude for what teachers do on residentials.

They would happen because a couple of teachers would be contracted to go, say, once yearly, on a specific set length trip as an expectation. You don't need more than 2 teachers usually. That's how my place did it when I worked at a college. We got some benefit, can't remember what, I think it was some teaching hours reduction (not paid overtime) but it was fine and not hard to prep for as we knew months in advance the few days each of us had signed on for. I remember a colleague had 4 kids and never went, she took on extra teaching instead as I remember.

I'm in Teaching.
Yea others jobs are harder bla bla bla.

I don't give a shit. I'm not doing residential.
The parents can expect what they want.
I'm not putting myself through that.

I am guessing it depends on:

a) whether this was highlighted at your interview
b) what your contract says re your part time hours
c) whether you made them aware of family circumstances (it may be that they have no expectation of you attending week long residentials at this stage, but will expect you to do other out of hours events such as the school discos/end of term late nights instead - ie you will pull your weight in other ways)
d) whether you have been ‘invited’ to take part on this occasion or told it is expected of you.

Every teacher I know fully understands that they will run at least one unpaid extra curricular club using their expertise in a hobby/special interest (ski holidays, bike maintenance, cookery etc), they accept that playground/lunchtime/homework club duty is require even if it falls during lunch hours.

Whilst unpaid, the point is that it shows you can participate in a team and support your colleagues; it evidences the vocational commitment to the profession/school/pupils; and it provides the experience that supports promotions to higher level roles (pastoral care, year head etc), so there is a return on investment, even if it is not in your salary. If child care responsibilities mean you cannot do the residential, then I would speak to your staff mentor/dept head about other ways you can contribute to school life while your child is young. If you have no interest in participating in other ways, then you may need to explore whether teaching is actually for you because you will quickly lose the goodwill of your peers and management team in the long term.

You are paid for your 5 week summer holiday, Easter & Christmas breaks & half term weeks though, aren’t you??

Are you for real 😂 you’re easily into six figures even on qualifying these days.

it’s not a relevant comparison. Nobody goes into corporate law expecting a 9-5 and the pay is commensurate.

OP — as a new part-timer with a young child, no I wouldn’t expect you to go.