To not go on the residential?

[Youthiswastedontheyoung]

I've just started a new p/t teaching role. Towards the end of the academic year the whole year group go on a residential which is about 3.5 hours away, for a full school week.
I have a just-turned 4 yo and other academic commitments outside of school.
AIBU to say I can't attend the residential?
As an aside, my mum (love her) thought teachers got paid for any additional hours regarding this. She was surprised to learn I'd just be getting my standard pay!

I’d read through your posts, if I were you, Procon. You are making no sense.

A teacher works and gets paid for 195 days per year.

A FTE in any other line of work it’s 260 days per year.

If teacher was to take a day of unpaid leave it would be calculated at 1/195 of their salary (as they don’t get paid for 13 weeks of the year, or 65 days).

If a FTE office worker takes a day of unpaid leave it would be calculated at 1/260 of their salary.

PP’s saying that it is irrelevant how many days you work and get paid for are wrong. It matters to your pay if you leave midway through a year, start mid way through a year, go on mat leave, all sorts…

(I’m not a teacher by the way)

Given that you do not understand teacher's contracts, I really don't want your help.

And there you go, spoiling their fun with actual facts, ffs @Pookerrod 🤣🤣🤣

Entitled!

When I was a teacher (37 years) I saw that kind of trip as part of my vocation. Teaching was never all about money but providing the best for the children in my care. And yes, I did trips every year with my class and was happy to do it and proud to see them develop. Obviously if your children are too young, as head I wouldn't have expected that staff member to go. But it's a shame that sense of passion seems to be missing here.

Yes, having first spent 4 years training and in many cases, running up thousands of pounds of debt to student loans that is then deducted at source from their salaries until it is paid off. It took my son 10 years to pay off his loan after financing part of his training (his father and I paid the tuition and living costs).

If you’re part time , presumably another teacher works the other days , so can’t you both do your part of the week?
Lots of jobs involve extra unpaid hours , nurses staying on when busy/ emergency or the person taking over the shift is delayed/ doesn’t turn up.
This is only once a year ? You have a lot of time to arrange childcare ?
You have an annual contract to cover teaching times, classes, parents evenings etc ? trips? not paid hourly ?
You sound like you begrudge the job already and it’s only September.
Some of the parents are probably in jobs in health and social care and leisure industries , who regularly have to work over their hours regularly.
it’s a couple of days a year ?

"Vocation" and "passion".
Two of the words to guilt teachers into doing ever more work.

Yeah, but residentials were more fun then. The weight of responsibility is one hundred fold worse than 30 years ago, as someone who can compare both.

Oh no . I feel for you . I used to work in a school as non teaching staff . I felt like the staff that were parents were not valued at all ! If you ever mentioned you couldn’t do something because you had young children they would look down on you . Those who left by 3pm ish would be gossiped about disparagingly by other (usually female ) members of staff . It was a given that people had to forget their own kids in order to dedicate themselves to all activities that fell during the evenings / weekend and holidays. Yes teachers have long holidays etc but people do not realise that in term time they are bound to the school , they cannot take a day off , even if you have a an appointment you must get it cleared by the head teacher . As a parent myself I appreciate what staff at schools do and I wouldn’t expect someone to be working for free !

I have been teaching for ten years and always attended until this year I have a just turned one year old and told them I wouldn’t be attending.Usually, I would do things like this for the students who I care so much for but on this occasion,I am thinking of my own child and the fact I dont feel comfortable. I don’t think you doing the same is unreasonable.my work do not offer any additional pay for this either (not that it would convince me anyways )You’re a teacher but a mother first.

The contract is irrelevant. Teachers earn a certain amount over a year and get a large number of weeks’ leave. That’s the end result.

Do carry on complaining.

When did I complain?
Are your comprehension skills not as good as you thought?

Ultimately residentials are not compulsory - teachers cannot be made to run/attend them.

When I lived by myself and had pets there was no way I could go on one as I had no one to pet sit and I wasn’t going to pay anyone to do this anyway.

Pets aren’t the problem now but I do have DC. I have attended a couple of residential since DC and they were fine but can’t get over how few parents said thank you.

When my DC goes on residentials I always thank the teachers and send a box of biscuits in - it’s not a lot but a small gesture to say thanks as they gave up so much of their time.

Residentials are great for kids but I always think teachers should get a couple of days off for all the extra time they give freely.

OP, with young children, you have the perfect reason not to go on a residential.

Vocation" and "passion".
Two of the words to guilt teachers into doing ever more work

It's the way we used to feel about our work. And we had a lot of fun.
As ht I always tried to be fair, didn't expect people to work unreasonably, allowed flexibility, it depends who you work for I suppose. But I think I got more joy and satisfaction out of my career because of those two words. It wasn't about counting every pound. You get out of a job what you put into it.

No! I work part time and do not go on residential trips for that reason and also have my own children to consider. Another teacher ( who wants to go does) and I usually cover there class on my work days.
if you do decide to go, it’s completely reasonable to expect to be paid for the extra days or have the time off in lieu. Remember you will be working days which you aren’t paid for and full time staff will be being paid for the 5 days so for me, you either don’t go because you don’t want to and can’t be expected too ( can’t legally be made to work on non working days!) or you go if you wish to, but are paid for the extra days.

It's the way we used to feel about our work. And we had a lot of fun.

It did use to be fun. You wouldn’t like it now, it’s unrecognisable. The actual teaching/vocational/joy of being with children bits are ever shrinking.

I did a week long residential to Spain last year with my special needs school. Didn’t get paid any extra had a great time but wouldn’t do it again 😴 😂

Its the way you used to feel about it, I have no doubt that others do too.

But they are used far too much to push teachers in to doing more and more.

I got the greatest joy from teaching when I saw pupils understanding a concept, showing pride in their work and getting the grades that they worked so hard for and knowing that I was a part of that.

And yes I have organised trips, week residentials and curriculum based activities outside of school hours, I have even organised free trips for those that took part in the clubs that I ran. So I also know how much you can get out of a job in relation to extra effort.

And I also know that the memory of HTs is short lived and only on a 'what have you done for me lately' basis.

Schools should be run for the benefit of the pupils, but management needs to realise that they are legally require to look after their staff as well and that means not emotionally blackmailing them in to doing tasks that they don't have to do.

Residentials are voluntary. I have just returned from an overseas trip today and am exhausted.
It is a no fun in the park. We do it to give the learners the experiences that sometimes, their parents will never be able to give. We had a few first time fliers in our group.
You cannot be forced to go on a residential. It is good will...

When I was younger, child free, I loved going on the trips abroad but they were in term time.

For a residential during half term it is different and a big ask. Having your own children means a whole week arranging childcare for them while looking after a group of other parents' kids. It's so difficult to be put into that situation and yes these events are worthwhile but exhausting, having to be responsible and alert 24/7 with young pupils who are missing home, have fallout and dramas.

I think it's more than reasonable to explain you have your own children to look after and when they're a bit older then it would be more practical.

For those posters expecting you to do it, do they have to take a week unpaid and pay for childcare? In an ideal world we teachers would love to have that extra time outside of lessons to establish a deeper relationship with them but it's not practical when you have your own kids to look after is it really?

It's a job we chose of course, but everyone needs a work life balance.

There are unpaid hours, which teachers do a hell of a lot of, then there are unpaid hours of 24/7 being responsible for a large group of young children when you need to look after your own. If a SP, how can that be expected? Xx

Oh so this! Got my own kids to look after so happy to do it when they're older. At that stage burnout and no longer teaching! Xx