To think that with over 1million pensioners in poverty, removing the WFA makes Labour the nasty party, who tell blatant lies?

[TealTraybake]

And hypocritical lies at that. Just a few months ago Labour ‘vowed to be the party for pensioners’

‘Nearly 1 million people aged over 66 in the UK are living in deprivation, according to government statistics, the highest number since comparable records began.
Labour, which analysed figures from Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) records, has vowed to be the party for pensioners, with plans to insulate millions of homes and reduce energy bills. It has also “committed to retaining” the triple lock which guarantees annual rises to the state pension’

I understand the WFA should be means tested - but the current threshold is far too low. Food prices have gone up. Energy prices have gone up. Some pensioners need that WFA 🥺.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2024/apr/16/nearly-1m-uk-pensioners-deprivation-official-figures

The world according to Lucy25
And what makes you think I care about your opinion?
The last time I looked at the rules of MN, this was an open forum, or am I wrong?

Thats just the point though.
The millionaires and very wealthy don’t need it. The very poor will still get it. It’s those who are a few pounds over The PC threshold that will suffer.

That’s the tricky bit but there has to be a threshold drawn somewhere. To do anything like means tested or a sliding scale would be enormously expensive to administer and much slower to roll out.

Exactly this. It is not sustainable to give the WFA to all pensioners. I mean, think of all the famous/rich people of pension age. Do you really think they should be getting it?
And apparently, people of pension age (as a proportion of a demographic) are well off.

The trouble is the line. It has to be drawn somewhere. It is like someone wanting to claim UC that has £15995 in savings. They can claim (but it is tapered at that point). Someone who has just a fiver more can't claim at all. They can rant and moan, but there is that line.

I am not a fan of the language used around all this anyway. People saying they are being "punished" for having savings, assets, private pensions etc. And that people who don't have those things are being "rewarded" with Pension Credit etc.
No... just no. Why should the government give you more money when you have accrued enough of your own? The government/welfare system steps in to help the people that have not been lucky or privileged enough to save/buy houses/have a private pension to ensure they don't actually starve and freeze to death. But many MN posters seems to think the people who were not able to accrue assets, in whatever form, should be left to rot on the streets, and the government hand out money to the people who "did the right thing" like it is a fucking gold medal in the Lifetime Financial Planning Olympics.

It's going to be means tested, those who really need it will still get it.

Labour are clearing up the mess of the last 14 years of Tories, there is no magic money tree, the Tories stripped it dry already.

That's the thing, there will be pensioners just over the credit threshold who have not accrued any assets.

It is those people who are actually on less than those on credits who will really struggle.

Politically it's a mistake for that to happen. I think the HoL were saying similar today

I see you describe yourself as 'We'. I'm struggling a bit to understand how two people have reached retirement with no knowledge of private pensions. They have been well known and advertised since the 1980's.

Yes, the difference between those who can get PC and those who can't is ridiculous But to properly means test it all will cost money too.

Not everyone had private work pensions, I worked somewhere that had no pension until the government made it mandatory to have one in 2012

You do realise that pensions were available from banks etc? You didn't have to rely on your workplace supplying one.

Private work pensions are none of the government's business.

The clue is in the word 'Privare'.

It was food manufacturing so low paid factory and warehouse jobs, I had a temporary role there as QA, I doubt many would have been able to afford to get a pension at a bank or it would be even on their radar, It didn't matter for me as I wasn't there long and had other pensions from previous workplace, I'm quite well provided with pension.

Well, since it's mandatory now, the government has made it their business.

I made a comment, which you said you disagreed with, fair enough, you put forward your view, instead of leaving it there, you went on with, I need to live experience, to warrant my glib remarks, which means, apparently, l’m being insincere.
I don’t understand, why you’re carrying this on, you’ve said you disagree, it is an open forum, however it’s not necessary, to keep bringing it up, being confrontational.
Everyone has a right to an opinion, however it’s unnecessary, to push an opinion on another person.I won’t be responding to any of your other comments.

How would you know that? How did you know that? I am doctorate level educated and in a professional role. I’m not stupid. But I have only just come across this information as I’m hitting my 50s.

My family were poor. We didn’t talk about money other than if we could afford this, that or the other. We lived hand to mouth. No savings. Certainly didn’t hear any talk about pensions.

The only reason I have a pension is because when I started my job in the NHS a friend who worked in a bank advised me to go for it. I wasn’t on a high salary and I struggled to make ends meet so the bit that got put into my pension would have made a massive difference month to month at that time. Without my friend I’d have probably opted out and only be thinking about it now in my 50s.

Because it just wasn’t part of my context. I still feel pretty green when it comes to finances. Just random luck I met a financially savvy mate who was happy to give unsolicited advice.

In order to plan for your old age you also need to feel like you deserve good things in life. I work with under privileged kids and families. Lots wouldn’t have the knowledge some wouldn’t feel deserving, some don’t have the means to save etc.

Check your privilege.

Can you imagine a world where someone on minimum wage who didn’t earn nearly enough to pay their bills and eat well and raise their children would have gone to a bank and asked about a private pension? It’s preposterous. I wouldn’t have had a clue where to get a pension back in the day. They were for other people with good jobs. I wasn’t worried about retirement, I was worried about surviving day to day. A pension would have been a ‘nice to have’, along with insurance, car servicing and other sensible things that are out of the remit of most poorer people.

Luckily things are different now. My DCs made big pension contributions from the age of 18 when they started work, because I impressed upon them the importance of it. I was mid-thirties by the time anyone even mentioned the word ‘pension’ to me.

This isn’t my generation though. I have a home. I could sell it to release funds when I’m old. I am privileged and I recognise this.

I was sarcastic because young people have it really hard and acting like older generations (myself included) lived a scrimping and saving lifestyle is patently untrue.

You are doctorate level educated' in a professional role, and nearly 50, and you didn't know that you can take out private pensions for when you retire?

You have GOT to be kidding! How can you not know that?! 😆

And I am not 'privileged' and I came from a working class background.

This is basic entry level life knowledge!

I know many people who worked in factories and low paid jobs pre 2000s, who had private pensions (because some workplaces didn't offer them.) Not all of them were huge, but many people had them. I find it unfathomable that some people are claiming they didn't know you could take out a private pension ... AAAAALLLLLLLL the way back in the 1990s and the noughties!

Private pensions were the rage then. Scottish Widows advertised all the time, with Amanda Lamb as the face of them. Back in the early 1990s.

I find it hard to believe that people didn't know you could take out private pensions.

.

How did you learn that? Who told you? If someone doesn’t know something it’s not a sign of stupidity.

Had I not had an NHS pension I may have done some research at some point I guess. But it’s just not been something on my radar.

Lovely snotty and condescending tone to your post BTW.

Tell me how you knew. How did you pick up that knowledge? I have never taken any notice of these things. It’s just never entered my world and I’ve never gone looking. I had an awareness of them somewhere in my peripheral mind but just not something I ever thought about.

Private pension companies have been advertised ALL over the TV for about 4 decades now. How can anyone not know about them? And I didn't say people were stupid - YOU said that! I just don't see how anyone can claim they never knew you could take out a private pension!

Calm down!

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I would imagine the point wasn’t that they didn’t know but that they were earning such low amounts that it would have been a struggle to pay into a private pension, while trying to survive day-to-day

From what you describe as only finding out now entering your 50's, I suspect we are very similar in age. No privillege whatsoever. Far less education than most, as I left school to all intents and purpose at around 14. My first full time job was in hospitality. It was extremely poorly paid.

Adverts for pension plans were all over newspapers, magazines, tv advertising when I was a teenager into my 20's. Took your wages into the bank, and they always had posters and staff promoting pensions.

Some may have been incredibly unlucky and missed all those messages. But I suspect it was choice not to invest rather than not having knowledge.

My point is, and why I used myself as an example, is that you can’t assume everyone has the same knowledge and understanding as you. Working with under privileged people, any advertising around financial services would be ignored because when you live hand to mouth you know you can’t save.