To think the penalties for term time absence is ridiculous..

[JKbowling]

I got this in my email inbox today, sent to all parents and guardians.

"Failure to safeguard a child's education" appearing on your DBS, really?

As for term time holidays. If a family can't afford to pay for their one measly UK break per year to be had during the 6 weeks holidays (because the prices are hiked right up and become unaffordable) how does school suppose said family is going to pay the fine?

Life is all about choices. Including choosing to decide what's good for my family and children. You're also right about accepting the consequences, what people are arguing is that the consequences are arbitrary and unequal. The 'consequences' could be anything, the principle is still that it's a stupid system.

I'm also not anti-government but for people who have time and again shown themselves to make poor and selfish judgements, I'm inclined to bend the rigidity of 'must follow the rules blindly just because' and avoid have someone else tell me how I should experience my family life and my children.

16 weeks? Tell me you privately educate your kids without telling me… 🙃

It’s 13 weeks for us mere mortals.

It 13 weeks. Looking at this school year we currently have a grand total of 1 we can both be off together & that’s Christmas, which is lovely but not ideal for getting away for the week whether in the U.K. or abroad and generally a pretty busy time of year.

My children who have SEN (dyslexia just being one) were in school. I think they were out for a week, maybe two, when lockdown first happened and they were scrabbling around.

They still suffered. But if they had to be educated at home - while I worked - I really don't know where they would be now. Their little brother, who has no SEN and is very capable, didn't go into school, did set work but obviously not to the level he would have done in school. He's still flying through school in the top of set 1.

So yes, for some children a few days out can have an impact. Having said that we took ours out for a funeral for two days. It was approved though, not sure that makes a difference to what they missed!

@twentysevendresses I did not say ‘massive’ discounts. The fact remains that prices are cheaper in term time and that’s why people take term time holidays. It’s hardly surprising that companies have a pricing structure that changes when demand is less, to encourage take up, just as organisations have sales to shift unwanted stock.

Whether you approve, disapprove, or are indifferent, that’s what happens. To some people, having a holiday or holidays, is more important than other considerations, so they make decisions based on that.

Unless every education authority makes its own decision about when to have holidays and staggers them, so that there are school holidays throughout every month, people will always choose to go when it’s cheaper.

If fines or custodial sentences were such that it became a deterrent to take children out of school during term time, that would change things, but it won’t be feasible. Nor will staggering holidays comprehensively. Parents often have children in schools with different holiday schedules as it is.

Parents decide what the priorities are for their own family. For some, education, even as things are now, is a priority. For others, a family beach holiday, a trip to see family, an adventure holiday or Disney, are more important.

Apologies, it's 13 to 15 weeks according to Google, my mistake thank you! Still a lot of time to have holidays within parameters. 😊
My kids have left now, been through all the expenses of flying during holiday periods, rellies abroad meant we couldn't avoid it.

This is the go to comment for everything in this country. Mostly based on jealousy and ignorance.

You're in a similar situation to I was as a child. Obviously no fines back then, but my term time holidays would have been recorded as an unauthorised absence.

I could only go on holiday in term time due to respite care for my sibling only being available term time.

Thankfully my head teacher was an angel of a human. My DM would phone him to let him know our holiday plans and he would inform her what the most common illness of the moment was, that would keep me off school for a week "sick".

I think the new fines are going too far, personally. I certainly never suffered in life because I had one week out of school each year.

In @JKbowling 's case I would suggest that the procedures for Authorised absences needs to be fairer too for specific circumstances such as hers (and what would have been mine).

I used to be a governor of a primary school in an area with a very high migrant population. The absences there were crazy. Families would rock up on a Friday in October and say "we're going back to [insert country here] tomorrow. We'll be back in December."!

We were on holiday in Las Vegas a couple of years back and got chatting to an American family that were celebrating their son's 16th birthday.

I asked them if it was the school holidays as I had researched it before I went and hadn't seen any listed holidays. The mum said no. I asked if they got in trouble for taking the kids out of school and she looked at me like I had two heads and said "why would I? They're my children".

I explained about the absence policy and fines in the UK and watched her jaw drop lower and lower!

Now, obviously, the US school system isn't perfect by any means, but there are as many successful grown ups there as in any other country.

This is an interesting list of countries and their rules - https://www.euronews.com/travel/2024/08/05/travelling-during-school-time-here-are-the-fines-parents-could-face-across-europe

I haven't read the full thread.

My thoughts: The fines are effectively a fine on the working class. Also, forcing separated parents to pay for their ex's decisions is appalling and will only result in conflict which will harm the child.

Just not true wrt the US. Most states have truancy laws, fines are not uncommon, and in some places prison is a possibility (albeit not a likely outcome). As with most things it will vary state to state and even within states different cities may have different rules.

Americans get 10-12 weeks off in summer, so parents are more focused on filling in childcare gaps than adding an extra week that you will have to cover later.

It's also giving no agency to the parents to tailor the upbringing of the child. There are children whose learning gets disrupted more or less if they miss a week. But for the majority of children, it has no negative impact at all.

Those children are penalised because of their peers learning patterns. I come from a country / culture that just doesn't get this box-ticking way of thinking. The educational standards in the UK are low. Rather than looking elsewhere for inspiration, it's becoming more and more insular and doubling down on terrible practices.

That isn't the norm sorry. Most SEN children aren't getting anywhere near the support they need.
Parents aren't 'not taking up the support when it's there'
We are banging heads against brick walls and being refused even the essential support the child needs.
For some families moving schools means adding lots of travel to their day. Not everyone lives with several options in their doorstep

We did move schools but child still couldnt cope.

Their needs are too much for mainstream but apparently doesn't meet the criteria for the special school.

This means child can not attend school
We have been forced to home Ed. Which we didn't want but was preferable to a suicidal child.

Holidays are nice but no one ‘needs’ a holiday, your children do need an education though. You can still have family time in your own house in the school summer holidays.

But I don’t care if you take your children out of school and they don’t do as well as my children, who have good attendance, then that’s a leg up for my kids, isn’t it 🤷‍♀️

my secondary school kids definitely had lessons to the end of term.

Our education authority are skint SEN wise. School can call Senco in, they come and go nothing changes. School budget here reduced by 15% we can't afford any more TAs even

I suspect the % of children taken out of school because of circumstances described in the OP is tiny (only holiday of the year, family needing charity funding, charity funding amount not allowing any possibility of non-term time holiday) is tiny.
Avoiding crowds can be done by 1) not leaving on the 1st weekend of the holiday 2) choosing a less popular destination and where local schools are not on holiday)
Realistically the large majority are choosing to term time holiday to either save money or afford a better holiday on the same budget.

@PfishFood I would suggest that the procedures for Authorised absences needs to be fairer too for specific circumstances such as hers (and what would have been mine
Yes!

Fines for unauthorised absence have been in place since 1996. I was prosecuting parents who failed to send their children to school in 2002.

There is no reason why you couldn't have been aware of this "draconian absence policy" before you had children.

Prices for UK self catering during school holidays literally double. It's akin to dynamic pricing. If they can call it out for gig tickets (see Ticketmaster Oasis mess), they can surely apply the same parameters to holidays and put paid to it there too. It's profiteering. Nothing more, nothing less.

Holidays are a nice luxury but if kids don’t go abroad, it’s really not going to harm them. Missing out on education, however, will. If you can’t afford to go abroad during the school holidays, have a holiday in the UK- plenty of lovely places to visit. Consider saving up to go abroad once every 2-3 years rather than every year. Pay for the holiday in instalments. Figure something out that doesn’t involve your kids missing school.

Know. Your. Place.

I would more go down the line that you choose to have kids. If the law of the land is that your kids require education and that is law, this becomes an obligation and not a choice.
Bit like speeding, speed limit is law whether you agree with it or not. You break the law (by choice) and then the consequences are for you to suck up.

I haven't Been abroad for 17 years
UK break,s also double in price during school holidays and this might blow your mind but manyy people can't afford then either
Should children never have a holiday?

Missing a week of school once a year does in no way equate to 'not having an education'.