To think "genuine concerns about immigration are irrelevant?

[MrsBennetsPoorNerves]

I fully accept that people may have genuine concerns about immigration. Some of those concerns may be 100% valid. Some may be based on misinformation or poor understanding. Regardless, I can accept the fact that some people have concerns.

But if people do have concerns, there are ways of expressing and addressing these properly. Peaceful demonstrations. Lobbying MPs. Or even standing for election.

But as soon as people make the leap from expressing legitimate concern about government policies to intimidating and attacking innocent individuals who have no influence or control over those policies, that is when "concerns" are no longer relevant and common or garden racism takes over. If people weren't fundamentally racist, why on earth would it even occur to them to do this?

If I am unhappy about decisions affecting my community taken by my local council, my first thought isn't to go and beat up my neighbour in order to make a point. Most people would recognise that such anger was utterly misplaced. Why is it that people don't seem to recognise that the anger towards migrants/asylum seekers/ethnic minorities/muslims etc is equally misplaced. Why are so many people saying that they understand the reasons for the violence ever though they don't condone it.

I don't think it's at all understandable that someone with grievances about government policy would think that throwing bricks at a mosque or setting fire to a building full of people will help to resolve the issues that they are concerned about. The people that they are targeting are not in a position to change anything. There is no logic to this thinking, so why do people's minds go there? As far as I can see, the only possible explanation is racism, pure and simple. The "genuine concerns" are nothing but a cover for thuggery.

@HighlandCowbag thank you for your answer.

Fantastic post

You don't have to vote Reform to care about immigration. Plenty of reasons not to vote for Reform (they didnt stand in every constituency for a start). Why..are you saying people cant trust Labour's promises that they too care about reducing immigration? I suppose on the basis they ramped up immigration before being voted out last time we probably can't rely on them.

In fact immigration is now Number 2 in a recent poll of people's priorities. Behind the economy and ahead of the NHS. I'd say the government now needs to see it as a priority.

I suppose it takes all sorts but I had hoped on this thread we were avoiding that sort of language. So I won't respond to you again @Sugarlily

Why are you concerned about people who felt so desperate that they risked the lives of them and their kids to het here on a boat?!

Where is your empathy?!!

Ffs

If you're poor it's not because of other poor people! It's because of 14years of Tory government and the rich elite who don't pay tax.
FFS stop being manipulated by people who seek to spread hate and divide us.

GIVE YOUR HEAD A FUCKING WOBBLE!!!!!

I think there's a better way than enabling trafficking profits and associated misery

I don’t understand why my post was deleted? I said the rioters were racist. Is that not a fact? Didn’t Keir Starmer say that? Not sure why that was reported or removed.

As the most important part of my post has also gone I pointed out that immigration is only a top issue for over 65 ‘leave’ voters where 61 and 66% agree respectively. For younger voters only 19% consider it a main issue.

I don’t think it was the facts and figures that was the problem , it was the last line that you wrote that I don’t intend to repost

I don’t think it was the facts and figures that was the problem , it was the last line that you wrote that I don’t intend to repost

that the older less tolerant generations will eventually die off and that will be better for society? I mean older people do die and I don’t see how it’s a mumsnet crime to allude to that. Bizarre

That was not how you wrote it, the words sooner the better are more accurate

I don't agree with the riots at all.
I do believe 100% that people should be concerned about the huge numbers of unknown young men we are letting into the country. On the other thread, a poster claimed that she knew of a doctor who was on the boat and that most of them are professionals waiting to work and enrich the UK. Yet that isn't the case.
Immigrants coming over here who want to integrate and contribute? Great.
Those coming over who want to destroy our way of life and not contribute in any meaningful way is very different. Many users on MN can't make the distinction and call you racist or bigoted for suggesting that not everyone coming over here is doing it for the right reasons or that they aren't a threat to the UK.
I will say it again. MN I suspect on the whole is made up with plenty of middle class people who don't really experience what others do in terms of the negative effect immigration is having. Such as those living near hotels where migrants are being housed to make just one example.
If debate keeps being shut down and anyone opposing immigration is called racist then the problems will persist. People are fed up.

@misty64 oh ok. Thinking about that I guess it could be misconstrued as aggressive. I just meant - for me - the sooner that naturally happens the better, not anything malicious

So what you are saying is you would prefer it if the older generation dies of quickly because they don't have the same opinions as you.

@EasternStandard in an ideal world yes! But the tories have blocked all legal routes!!!!

Labour are not introducing those legal routes. They are in power now what’s stopping them from doing it as a top priority?

In fact no country will deal with this by simply putting in legal routes, it’s not viable

So it’s what we have now - rising numbers, maybe riots but also just general tension and every day discord

Or put in a better system and get some calm. I’d suggest looking at Aus

Labour have been in power just over a month yet some posters expect them to have resolved problems the previous government failed to in fourteen years.

Have they indicated anywhere they will introduce safe routes as a way to resolve problems?

At the King’s Speech?

Why not do you think. And since we’ve had costly riots now and safe routes are presumed to be the answer you wouldn’t hang around would you

There was a radio program that looked into this, they spoke to protestors and yes there was a few who just hated migrants of any colour & the criminal/shit stirring elements but the journalist said the majority view she got was that these people were fed up of poor schools, poor nhs, low wages, employment, housing, cost of living and they were looking to blame someone... much like Brexit - & its all the EUs fault!!

I think that if Labour don't make significant inroads into these issues, then voters will turn to the extremes at the next GE, they won't look to the Tories.

I won't hold my breath.

Or put in a better system and get some calm. I’d suggest looking at Aus

Which large remote Island have you suggest we send migrants too?

...bear in mind Rwanda could only accommodate a few 100 each year.

1000s of migrants have drowned crossing the Med and even the channel, yet it does not deter them from coming.

It’s cheaper if you have a Rothercard, a discount scheme for people on low incomes. £10 for up to three items. But even £10 can be hard to find if you’re trying to feed your kids and pay the difference on your private rental which is higher than the local housing allowance.

I agree with your posts, I know the area, and its decline.

I understand the grievances people have over the volume of immigration, but like you, I don't understand the actions of the rioters.

However, you could ask the same question about the recent riots in Leeds, because children were removed from a Romanian family, or why some people commit murder, rape, child abuse etc, etc. Answering these questions would require a deep understanding of human behaviour.

Unfortunately, we don't live in a utopia where everyone shares the same values and moral code. People's behaviours are shaped by various factors upbringing, environment, genetics, intelligence, and personal experiences. This diversity makes it unrealistic to expect complete uniformity in thought or action.

@Alexandra2001

"There was a radio program that looked into this, they spoke to protestors and yes there was a few who just hated migrants of any colour & the criminal/shit stirring elements but the journalist said the majority view she got was that these people were fed up of poor schools, poor nhs, low wages, employment, housing, cost of living and they were looking to blame someone... much like Brexit - & its all the EUs fault!!

I think that if Labour don't make significant inroads into these issues, then voters will turn to the extremes at the next GE, they won't look to the Tories.

I won't hold my breath"

A really good post and I would add a lack of manufacturing and industrial employers that traditionally hired large numbers of poor working class men, drug and alcohol addiction, lack of stable two parent households, lack of secure social housing and most importantly a lack of hope and feeling especially amongst white working class males that not only does no one give a shit about them but they are actually a problem in society.

By calling those who express their opinions peacefully, racist fascist thugs you simply push them further to extremes.