Dressage WTF

[OrkneyGirl]

I have just been watching Olympic dressage...a poor horse moving its hooves in time to 'Another one bites the dust'...surely this is done for human entertainment only. The horse wouldn't do this naturally. Commentator saying the horse 'clearly loves moving to the beat'. What a load of crap. Years of making the horse move unnaturally. Probably with a stick or whip. AIBU that this sport is about privileged humans dominating a beautiful animal. Makes me so sad...and angry!

A question for the experts - do the horses need a rider to do the dancing?

It's a fair point. And I know it's 'whataboutery', but in this instance it does seem to be necessary whataboutery.

The female competitor could, and did, withdraw participation in that event out of fear for her own safety. But it's my firm conviction that it shouldn't come to this, and that women's sport is being sacrificed to the extent that it will be killed off completely if common sense and good old-fashioned sporting fair play doesn't quickly intervene.

This is in no way a statement that cruelty to horses is a triviality by comparison. It's not. It's a very serious matter, and is being treated as such by the relevant authorities. Dujardin was rightly excluded from the competition and received a 6-month ban.

The presence of a competitor who's a rapist, and the inching out of women by males competing in their categories, is not. Humans deserve a similar level of fairness.

How could the horse whipped by Charlotte Dujardin opt to watch the triathlon instead?

No, that's not what I said at all

The vast majority of top-level riders don't do what Charlotte did - there's a bloody good reason why she's been slammed across social media and dropped by all her sponsors - because what she's done is disgusting and the vast, vast majority of equestrians wouldn't be seen dead behaving that way.

Whipping, kicking and beating horses isn't okay at any level. That's my point. The fact that Charlotte did/does it doesn't mean everyone else does.

they need someone to give the instructions for the movements. I've not done dressage myself, i was a trail rider, but i assume its done the same way with a mix of reins/knee/foot commands.

If you look at wild horse behaviour and body language within a herd, lots of the dressage movements are the natural movements that they make. Trainers, much like dog trainers, reward these natural movements and refine them.

Obviously if the horse is beaten to do do this that’s awful, but I do believe there are horses that are particularly good at it and enjoy it, and trainers who are good at getting the best out of the horse.

I’d say the dancing dog stuff at crufts is far more unnatural, but generally the dogs love it.

I totally agree @SerafinasGoose - both are awful.

Have you heard the expression ‘you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make it drink’? It hasn’t come from nowhere…

This seems like a sensible, balanced response.

I’ve not been able to bring myself to watch it this year either. Used to love it.

DH and I were just saying that surely this "sport" has had it's day.

MNHQ doesn't seem to agree with you.

She was "slammed" because it's bad PR, pulling the veil back.

Let's not forget that whoever recorded her was also happy to let her continue to abuse horses for years before timing the release of the video.

i'm not convinced Dressage needs to be an olympic sport tbh, and i'd not be bothered if it were dropped, but insisting the horses must be unhappy is bollocks.

Turned it off- the whole Dujardin carry on is the tip of the ice berg. She clearly was very familiar and comfortable with her whip but she won’t be the only one. The sport is tarnished much like cyclists excelling are automatically assumed to be dopers.
Not sorry to see the demise of the horse riding part of the modern pentathlon either (albeit not until LA 2028) after the disgusting episode in Tokyo - that was a tough watch 🥺

Yes and no
They do the movements naturally in the field (probably not as perfectly!) but the rider has to give the instructions as it's a certain pattern

You find if you ride a certain test too many times then they start predicting. I had been practicing a test that was entering in canter and had a bit of a battle to convince the horse we were not doing that for the next test!

Nope, there'll always be a demand to allow failed athletes whose mummy and daddy can afford horses, stables and trainers to pretend they're athletes.

IMO all competition which involves animals should end. There is no way animals naturally enjoy dancing, or running with a crowd of humans on the sidelines, screaming at them to win.

Yes and no.

If you watch horses in the herd, they do perform a lot of these movements naturally - but a rider can refine the movements and put them to a rhythm - ideally by matching the natural beat of the horse to music, rather than forcing a horse to move to a specific beat.

It's the same as working dogs, really. Collies, for example, will "herd" naturally without input from humans, but a farmer will refine that ability and teach their dogs commands, where the sheep need moving to and what the dogs need to do in order to move the flock safely.

I hope you’re right and it’s not that others just haven’t been caught. If it is possible to train a horse for extremely high performance without the use of a whip, why did she use one?

Thank you.

I do not disagree that horses are beautiful, intelligent and sensitive to music. I get the relationship between horse and human. It is magical

But...dressage is about humans...not horses...it's about controlling or enhancing their natural movements and I can imagine that more than one person has found tough ways to do so.

Just a shame we have to do this to such beautiful creatures...mainly for our pleasure, not theirs.

There are so many other ways to stimulate horses' natural intelligence and incredibly varied personalities.

No they don't. A lot of movements can be done using long lines with handler at foot (with voice/clicker or lunge whip to create the click - NOTHING like Charlotte's disgraceful use), but are generally technically better with a rider.

How many horses do you think you are going to see roaming around in fields if they can't be ridden, for fun, entertainment or racing? Some people seem to think all the animals we wouldn't use anymore 'because it's not natural' would be let loose to live a natural life. Very few people would be willing to spend money to keep them and most domesticated animals wouldn't survive in the wild even if anyone was willing to give up land for them to live on.

@mrsdineen2 you ever ridden at that level? Dressage riders are incredibly fit, they train in the gym, the core needed is insane and the dedication and precision
To make something so hard look easy and like they're not moving or doing anything

Sitting trot on a big moving horse is hard!
They're not failed athletes at anything because that implies they tried another sport when most have been on a horse since they were tiny

I, too. I was a willing admirer of Dujardin, who appeared to use gentle methods wtih her horses and in fact sold herself on precisely that basis. She was about to become our most decorated female Olympian. These are the sorts of achieving women who 'should' be setting the bar as female role models.

To say I've rarely been this disappointed in anyone is an understatement. I don't, however, believe she is the only one and hope the FEI will extend their investigations fully beyond CD and into the sport as a whole.

go and look at the thread in Tack Room