DC’s teacher didn’t go to university.

[RabbitWedge]

Two of my DC’s are at the same secondary private school. It’s a small private school, not a well known name, but costs a small fortune nonetheless. An interaction with one of my DC’s English teachers at the end of term has made me feel uncomfortable.

‘Mrs Jones’ has worked at the school for a number of years. She is a very well liked English teacher; the children love her and she’s given high praise on the parents WhatsApp group. At the end of term, I was having a casual chit chat with ‘Mrs Jones’ and the topic of university came up. I asked ‘Mrs Jones’ where she went to university, and she stated that she had not gone and didn’t have a degree. I must have looked very taken aback, as she quickly added that she had an impeccable educational record (apparently all A’s and A*’s), she’d been tutoring for a number of years and working as a TA, at which point the school promoted her to teach English. I didn’t ask for this explanation, but she perhaps felt the need to justify her teaching.

I was under the impression that all teachers had to have degrees at the very least, and whilst I don’t doubt her popularity and delivery of her English lessons, I am concerned. I was aware that teachers in the private system didn’t need to be qualified teachers, but to not even have attended university seems unsuitable.

Would you raise this with the school in my position?

*best

Judging by her track record she sounds like an incredible teacher.

A degree doesn’t guarantee intelligence or gumption.

I have heard of teachers in private schools in England not having a teaching degree, but they usually have a degree and experience in their field. Unless it was a learn on the job apprentice or degree I am with you they should have some sort of a degree to teach in a school. Not sure if you can do that in a private school in Scotland.

I agree. Most of the teachers at the schools I worked in did not have degrees since until fairly recently there were two routes to teaching. 1 Take a degree. Until 1972, when a PGCE or equivalent became required, simply having a degree qualified you to teach. 2. Attend a teacher training college for 3/4 years and get a good grounding in teaching plus input on your chosen main and subsidiary subjects.
A third option was to take a degree in Education, which came with the right to teach, but this was quite rare.
State maintained schools must employ suitable qualified teachers (though they do not have to teach their own subject!). Private schools can employ whoever they like, but places like Eton only employ suitably qualified teachers (to a high degree) and most reputable private schools will want a PGCE or a degree in Education/Teaching degree - which is the route which has replaced the teacher training colleges.
No point raising this with the school. They employ the teacher. Does she teach English well and enthuse her pupils? If so, why worry?

I know loads of people with degrees who I wouldn't want anywhere near my children's educations. Common sense should be a factor in who teaches not a degree this lady deemed to be a good teacher? If so what's the real problem here?

I imagine she probably became a teacher through on the job training and/ or a teaching certificate, before degrees became compulsory.

Similar to nurses (my field), it was only 2013 that it became compulsory to have a nursing degree. Many senior nurses, ward sisters/managers and matrons do not have degrees, nor do they have to.

I understand you may not be happy with what you perceived to be paying for, however, a degree does not mean a better service/knowledge.

During my own degree and since training new student nurses, I've met plenty of students who would be excellent nurses and really knew what they were doing, but failed modules as their essay writing was not great. Whereas there have been others that are quite frankly a serious incident waiting to happen, but got a 1st because they can write great essays.....

Teaching degrees dont work that way. I completed mine at post grad level and it was useless, nothing but a formality. Other than being required to complete probation and gain registration, I have never used a single thing from it in the classroom. And I am a bloody good teacher.
I learned from my mentors, colleagues and CPD. Even picked up ideas from social media. Absolutely nothing from uni.

Same here. I have three degrees, none relating to education, and did my PGDE and it was completely useless!

Shock horror private schools don’t require qualified teachers. The irony 🤣

Id be quite happy knowing that's she's a good teacher and well liked by parents and children. As someone said earlier, she's successfully completed an apprenticeship.

They need a degree to complete a PGCE to teach in a primary or secondary school.
Private schools are not bound by the same rules and often employ unqualified teachers.
State schools can employ unqualified teachers but that would be an exception and usually someone who has some time from a PGCE or SCITT still to complete for whatever reason. I have never come across someone employed as a teacher who had no degree in a state secondary school.

If her teaching is good and her results are as excellent as she claims, why on earth would you be bothered?

OP, you don't believe anyone should climb the ladder, take the hard route and be rewarded and promoted based on merit. Doing a degree and pgce top up does not make you a teacher either

Did you not know that private schools don't have to employ qualified teachers?

Well. Go to a state school then. Teachers there do have to be qualified and registered. Why are you paying for this?

Shock horror, someone without a degree being capable of doing the job that we are told you must go to university to be capable of doing!

Oh well! Shit happens.

It's a well known fact Private School teachers don't need a PGCE to teach or any qualifications whatsoever

Obviously a lot of them do but the school can hire who they want

I'm sure the top academic selective schools hire the best on offer but your bog standard local independent school not so much

Why does this myth persist? You only need QTS to teach in local authority schools in England. This is not most schools! To get QTS, you do not need a PGCE, but you do normally need a degree. To teach in an academy (most schools) you don’t need QTS.

Though O understand your surprise and concern, it seems she is considered to be a good teacher. That’s all the matters. Who knows why she did not go to university, but even if she had, that in itself would be no guarantee of her having had a high level of education, being exceptionally able, or being a good teacher.

One of the most brilliant and well-read people I have ever met never went to university.

Of course she should have a degree. She is undereducated to be a teacher.

…..how is that ironic?