Council have asked me to move my keysafe, for the carers round the back of the block of flats.

[patsy999]

Does anyone know if the council are in the wrong here. I have a keysafe for the carers, which i was given permission for when i moved in 6 years ago.
Next door keeps complaining that it makes a noise and they have written to me asking for it to be moved round the back.
The back way isnt very safe in the winter as there is a very dim light round there, but the councils answer to that was the carers can use the torch on their phones.
I cant get the new keysafe fitted till fri the 2nd, so the carers cant use the keysafe till then.
Its a block of flats, with a communal back and front door.

Some have a cover that covers the buttons but it's still secure minus the cover

Email the councils anti social department. Ask them for them to put in writing what they have said to you. They need to include that the noise from the key safe meets the criteria of anti social behaviour and that they have instructed you, someone who is unable to do it independently, to move it due to the distress caused to others.
Ask them what evidence they have that a keysafe being used at a maximum twice a day causes undue distress to others.
Ask them as they have advised female carers to use the torch on their phone to stay safe will they be liable if something happens if the phone torch is not working etc.
At the end ask for their complaint department details as you would like to check if this instruction is in compliance with the Disability Discrimination Act as the carers may withdraw if they don't feel safe and you feel that a keysafe noise - that is needed due to your disability- would not meet the noise level needed for anti social behaviour and is causing you distress now every time a carer comes to support you.

Phew - that was long. Can you tell I've been an advocate? sorry this is happening to you

Well the neighbour is saying it is, yes it probably isn’t, but it is obviously causing the OP some stress

What Is the context? Have you been neighbours for the past six years? Have either of you complained previously?

Christ on a bike. Of all the batshittery I have read on here over the years this doesn't just take the biscuit it takes the whole supermarket aisle of them. OP I am so sorry that you need a key safe for the reasons stated at all, and that you have a neighbour so mean minded and pathetic to make such a complaint. As to the council - well fuck me, given that every council in the country is wailing about lack of funding, staff time and resources for big issues, it beggars belief that they didn't laugh the complainant out if the building.

Antisocial behaviour my arse - you have my sympathy. What next? Breathing too loudly? Sneezing after midnight?

What the hell is wrong with people these days?

I hope you get it sorted and I'm so sorry you have to give this even a moments thought.

This is nuts!! I’ve used loads of key safes, there are none that would be considered noisy enough to be under that anti social people.
You should have just said no.

No only that your keys are is more vulnerable to attack surely.

repkace it with a quiet one I the current position

@wheretoyougonow the disability discrimination act was replaced by the Equality Act 2010. However, that’s by the by.

OP, you’re being taken advantage of. There is absolutely no reason for your key safe to be moved and it definitely won’t be an anti social behaviour.

As others have said, write a letter of complaint (the council’s complaint process will be on their website, or we can help if you’re able to give the council name).

Copy in your MP, if you don’t know who it is, again there is a list here https://members.parliament.uk/FindYourMP

Make it very clear in your letter, you will not be moving the key safe, you’ve had it 6 years without problem.

Strongly suggest you contact your MP, and adult social services and object hard. Given it's been smashed and the claim is ridiculous, you are entitled to take the line this may in fact be verging on a hate 'crime' that the ASBU is now assisting.

There is either more to this and the issue isn't the actual key safe - such as carers on their phones loudly at the wrong times of day &night?
Or Mr ASBU has let the job go to his head/ stopped evaluating before leaping to action, when faced with an unhappy resident complaining.

When I first came out of hospital after a long stay neighbors were up in arms that it wasn't acceptable to have a stream of carers able to access a key to open their (our) front door to access my flat door, and I had 'too many visitors coming and going' as there where also nurses, frequent phlebotomists, and secure drugs deliveries. They were also unhappy that they wouldn't answer demands for information about me to them, and it was them being shut down that caused an escalation of their complaints.

I'd have more sympathy for them feeling insecure, except they were buzzing in all sorts of delivery folk, meter readers, kids mates, and whatever dealers their older kids had found online day and night, and are large families thundering up and down the stairs with no normal hours. I hear most of what they say at all times.

Suddenly they could hear people talking to me, and my existence and presence was no longer invisible to them, and other people were witnessing what they felt to be their private lives. Ie all their stuff in the communal areas and who they had visiting. They are hugely territorial and expect to never be affected by living in places with communal spaces and doors, and will pick up their mail from the floor but leave mine on the floor and trample and kick it around, instead of putting everyone's mail on the side to be claimed like normal people do.
As long as I'm silent and invisible I'm not an issue to them, but they feel I have less 'rights' than them because ablest hierarchy tells them that.
Check what is actually going on here and that your carers aren't being unacceptably loud.
Don't allow yourself to bullied just because your neighbors 'hijacked' an idiot in authority. Challenge it.

I am so sorry, patsy. I think your neighbours are mean. Your carers can't be arriving in the middle of the night and the keysafe cannot make that much noise, surely. I'm glad you are getting a new keysafe which will put an end to this issue but it costing you £80 is a bit much :-(..

Are you sure you spoke to someone from the council, it seems very odd that they called you then a letter was pushed through your door rather than sent by Royal Mail. If you are in a secure building, someone would have to ask you to buzz them in to deliver a letter, the council don’t just have key fobs for very flat block.
It all sounds a bit odd to me and if I were you I’d contact the council.

I would escalate. It’s bonkers that your care is being compromised on somebody else’s whim.

Go directly to your local councillor and give the reasons you have given to us here as to why it isn't appropriate to have the key safe at the back. Ask the councillor to mediate with the council department, they need to consider the risks of what they are demanding. Also regarding the cost you are incurring for this.

being woken up everyone day with the same noise particularly if you have health issue yourself and struggle to sleep until the early hours with pain is awful and could really be impacting on your neighbours health. For the complaint to be upheld there must be a significant amount of noise, either from the carers slamming the key safe or the noise of the carers. It's likely the council had a camera to record the noise levels.

@Anewuser - my bad. You are right. Think my brain went back in time.

The carers come at 10 30 in the morning and 7 30 at night so within normal hours. He was from the council.
Thanks everbody for all the ideas. Will sort it all out on monday.

Make a complaint to the helpline OP. If the carers are refusing to come in unless it's moved it's reasonable for them to move it at no cost to you.

As others have said, this is something best handled by your local Councillor.

https://www.writetothem.com/?gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjwtZK1BhDuARIsAAy2Vzuj2tvkgciGfK8j-DV8mt7VJmTaivF0jcr7PBZO4i-3b61oDdJpEnwaAk3VEALw_wcB

A lot of a Councillor's work is supporting residents with negotiations with the Council and their intercession carries a lot of weight.

Quite! Perhaps the most ridiculous thing of all is that the key safe hasn’t been used for months. The last time it was opened was a one off in early May!

Unless kids on the estate are pounding it every night with a metal pole then there’s no way the keysafe is causing anti social noise disturbance.

Here's an extract from the Age UK fact sheet on antisocial behaviour in housing (these fact sheets are updated regarlarly so are accurate). It states that the local authority can "deal with residential
noise that exceeds a certain permitted level between 11pm and 7".
It sounds highly unlikely that your local authority would take this complaint seriously. I would speak to them and check if they have actually got involved, and if so challenge them on the basis described.

The first contact I had from the council wasn't a phone call or letter.
It went from neighbors having a go at me, to I just came back to a warning notice of potential prosecution for noise nuisance taped to my flat door if I didn't desist with immediate effect from this date.
They'd visited the complainants who'd let them in, and it was real.

A friend's mum had a neighbour who put in complaints about using the toilet at night and a squeaky wardrobe door. The council were taking it seriously and was bullying the old lady to keep quiet and she ended up having a fall which led to hospital and eventually care. The neighbour had a reputation locally as being a nasty piece of work to the point that no one would help her during lockdown

I can see why this is stressful. Id complain to the council if I were you. So many care contracts are handed back to the council these days as they become uneconomic / undesirable. Carers are (rightfully) paid from the start to end of their shifts these days. If it takes longer for them to do their job or the conditions are unsafe you could be left with no carers at all.

Next door keeps complaining that it makes a noise and they have written to me asking for it to be moved round the back.

Exactly how noisy is it and how are next door hearing it? Is it near an open window?
Surely it can't be any more than say a clunky letter box, or someone jangling their keys as they open their door.

I wouldn’t move it- that’s ridiculous. Also it might be worth highlighting in writing to the council you only have two calls a day within reasonable hours and given they are insisting it is lived to an undesirable location they may want to consider upgrading lighting as it is their land and their responsibility that it is safe for use. A carer is not required to carry a mobile phone at all times. I am so angry for you!