AIBU but is Vegan Leather a con?

[Lincslady53]

We are looking a what our next car will be, and on looking at review videos on youtube a number of new cars have the option of 'vegan leather' upholstery. I google what this material is. Answer. POLYURETHANE! So instead of covering the seats in a natural, biodegradable product, it is a man made, from oil, that will break down into micro plastics, and take forever to totally degrade. AIBU to think that marketing companies take the public for fools?

It’s so weird people have plastic all over their houses and cars anyway but they only seem to be bothered about it when it’s got a vegan label.

Well exactly - it’s almost like this is a vegan bashing thread. I’m always amazed at how upset people get over other peoples ethics. It’s not like the OP was forced to have it

Yet here is the OP looking at a brand new car having a go about vegans not being environmentally friendly.

I think the bit that riles about vegan leather, is leather was always considered to be a superior product to vinyl or pvc or faux leather.
Calling any version of those things vegan leather is trying to making them out to be as good as actual leather.

Nobody things any car is really 'green' or 'environmentally friendly' let's not forget the plans for 4 new nuclear power stations in the UK to help run your green cars.
And let's not forget how the batteries are obtained.

The biggest issue with cars is the town planners who've spent the last 25 years making everything 'out of town' which really means impossible or multiple buses to get to. Making cars the only real practical option.

And as I’ve said several times now, veganism and environmentalism are two different things. Yea there is an overlap of people who follow both ethical frameworks but they are not interchangeable. Veganism is an ethical framework which seeks to prevent animals being harmed or used for people’s entertainment etc. it is about being against animal harm.

Environmentalism is about not damaging nature.

it really isn’t that difficult to understand, surely.

AHH yes all those unbias opinions on a forum for vegans 🙄

Also theres a video of them paying a man extra to skin a fox alive for one of their anti fur campaigns. And they offer him more money despite him saying that they kill the animals first.

They hate domestic pets. That's why they put so many down. Fuck peta and fuck anybody stupid enough to follow any group of extremists. When it's not plain awful it's embarrassing.

Posters replying like this - you sound like a smug twat.

Are you feeling ok?

Not the main issue, but does anyone know if leather made from the skin of animals killed for their meat? Or if animals are raised exclusively for their skin / leather? And if so, at what age are they killed for it?

Leather can be recycled too, can’t it?

With a bit more info about where the leather comes from, more informed choices can be made about the ethics of actual leather.

Most leather is a co product of the meat industry, just as bacon is a co product of pork chops, veal is a co product of the dairy industry (as is the exportation of Heffers to live in even poorer standards in Europe and the shooting of male calves soon after birth)

Im not sure about the point you’re making. If a cow is killed to make top side of beef it’s somehow more ethical to eat rump steak?

The ethics are, are you ok with animals being raised, often in terrible conditions - quite often with appalling impacts on the environment - needlessly - or not? Are you OK with ivory, dog and cat meat? Would you wear a dog fur coat if you also had a dog meat pie. Give a rabbits foot to a child for good luck because you had rabbit stew?Would you be ok for a puppy breeder to pull a 2 week old puppy away from its mother and shoot it in the head if it wasn’t as useful as its sister. These are the kind of ethical questions that matter.

Isn't Vegan Leather the same as pleather or faux leather? Why the sudden need to call it vegan leather? It's still plastic.

Leather is from cattle who are obviously breed for milk, and beef. Suede is Leather that's split.

Sheep and pig skins are also used. But items would normally tell you they are sheep skin, pig skin. Obviously their meat is also used.

Sheep skin jackets were a big fashion in the 70s and 80s. Really soft suede looking on the outside.

It used to be a thing to breed mink for their fur but I think that has been banned in the uk

Most cows 🐄 are artificially inseminated with female sperm. The days of male calfs being shot are over thankfully.

That said I have more issues with dairy and caves being removed from their mothers than I do with animals being breed and killed for their meat

Well, I think some meat is more ethical than others. I wouldn’t buy a mass - produced beef burger because I have no idea where the meat is from, and it could have been mistreated (as you describe) or it might be from Brazil where rainforest is being cut down and flown hundreds of mils to get here.

However, I happily buy meat from my local farm shop, because I know the cows have happy lives (I see them out grazing) and are slaughtered according to ethical guidelines with almost zero environmental impact from transport.
Given the world is not going to go completely vegetarian and cattle will always be raised and slaughtered, I would like to support this form of local farming, not mass-produced meat farms.

I don’t drink milk, and I buy cheese from the ethical cheese company (google them, they keep the calves with their mothers). It’s expensive, but worth it to me because, again, I wish to support this kind of farming.

I would be interested in making similar choices re. leather. As the hide is a by-product of the meat industry, I will make a point of asking what happens to the hide of the animals raised locally, and support the companies they partner with.

Well, I think some meat is more ethical than others.

Animals don't want to die. There's no ethical or 'humane' way to kill a creature or human that doesn't want to die. It's all 'marketing' to make you feel better.

Unfortunately, although you might think you’re choosing something more ethical and obviously a cow loving it’s life in a field is better than a concrete stall and with dairy farms keeping calves with their mothers is better, that animal will still be slaughtered or forced to be pregnant, will develop issues if kept constantly in calf/ milked

cows are often fed food made from soy grown in areas where there is mass deforestation (as opposed to the better quality soy for him consumption).

The type. Of farming you mention would not provide enough food for the wider population. It will not be the type of farming used in producing milk and other animal products that are needlessly included in foods such as certain crisps

do you have a vested interest in the meat industry by any chance?

They don't "hate domestic pets". They hate the suffering of animals and offer euthanasia for SICK, DYING OR SUFFERING animals FFS.

Like any responsible open-admission, socially conscious shelter, PETA provides a peaceful, painless release from life for animals who cannot be safely or humanely placed in a new home or who are sick, injured, dying, or otherwise suffering (physically or psychologically) and whose guardians often can’t afford the service at a private veterinary practice.

@Anotherparkingthread

And anyway the PETA discussion is irrelevant - the point I was making is the leather industry itself causes release of countless toxic chemicals into the environment which you chose to ignore because you dislike PETA.

Plenty of other non-PETA sources confirm the environmental dangers and toxicity of the leather industry:

https://www.collectivefashionjustice.org/articles/leather-is-not-a-natural-or-sustainable-byproduct

https://faunalytics.org/the-leather-industrys-impact-on-the-environment/

https://goodmakertales.com/is-leather-bad-for-the-environment/

https://www.deskera.com/blog/leather-chemicals-and-their-impact-on-the-environment/

According to recent statistics from the United States Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), the leather tanning industry is responsible for producing more than 600 million tons of waste each year. This waste includes chemicals, heavy metals, and other pollutants that can harm the environment and human health.

Care to comment on this without using the excuse of slagging off PETA to dismiss the facts?

Unbiased? I have worked in a slaughter house, vegans are not overreacting.
We need to reserve our judgement for the meat and dairy industry. I myself have more blood on my hands than anyone.
10 thousand chickens an hour and 9 thousand pigs a day would pass through the kill line.
We would hang the hens upside-down by their feet and plunge them to electrified boiling water.
I've stopped judging anyone who defends those animals.

Nobody cares. Stop being so hung up on something you can't and won't change. I'm not reading the links because I really have no interest and my opinion won't change.

No interest in the meat industry, I was vegetarian for a years (though never cared what anybody else did or ate) I only started eating meat after I worked with animals and realised they are dicks.

This^
Try harder OP.

On that basis we could probably eat most of the anti vegans, esp the ones who post “mmm bacon” in vegan pages

@Anotherparkingthread enjoy peddling the dirty meat industry propaganda. Some of us do care. You clearly couldn't give two shits about the environment or animals though.

I agree. And the sanctimonious opinionated vegans too. It's not morals that prevent me from eating people it's only the law.