Granny telling my son to keep secrets

[pizofaz]

We asked at the beginning of the year for the grandparents to not buy so many toys. This caused a massive row.

Now, granny will buy toys but tell my son 'shhh don't tell mummy and daddy'

I know this because my son literally can keep anything a secret, and tells me 'mum granny has bought me a big Lego toy but you have to pretend you don't know shhh' he just thinks it's a silly jokey thing. Which is obviously a good thing.

I say to him 'oh that's exciting etc' and I also say things like 'we don't need any secrets between us do we, I'm your mummy you can tell me anything you want to'

How else should I be dealing with this?

Frankly it pisses me off. I don't think she should be teaching him to keep secrets at all. She's also completely disregarding what we asked at the beginning of the year. I also find it fairly disrespectful to me.

Any thoughts or advice please?

so be it
I'd prioritise the wellbeing of my children.
I think the poster who describes the constant need to buy and give stuff as a way of showing affection is right- its a substitute for genuine emotional engagement and attention- encourage GPs instead to spend time with their DGCs, have experiences together- the world has too much stuff, we're drowning in it

I agree. Cooperation is the key fact and accusations will not help with this at all.

Stuff does not spoil a child. They can everything their wee hearts desire and be appreciative lovely people, just like they can have next to nothing and be entitled nightmares with awful attitudes.

I appreciate that housing the stuff can present a problem, so would ask that stuff does not come into my home, but I don't see the issue with granny's being full of toys if it pleases granny and child.

If we make it difficult for the truth, we get met with dishonesty. Create a space whereby grandparents can give treats that cannot be expected elsewhere. That will knock secrecy on the head.

In respect of those posters giving examples of saying it is our little secret when giving sweets to grandchildren and where is the harm in that, do you not think that is how many types of abuse by family/friends start, with sweets and testing whether the child says anything to mummy and daddy and then to toys and then building up to abusive behaviour.

My in laws would give my 3 year old handfuls of coins several times a week, in the end I said it is lovely you do this but he's now going straight to you asking for them. As he gets older I think it would be nice that he wants to see you for the books you read, games you play or time spent in the garden not just for pocket money.
I'd also explain about the need to give the message that secrets are not for a good idea for safeguarding and it's putting him at risk.

Have you much experience of safeguarding?

If they’re at her house, and she’s spoiling him, then you’re not and he’s not expecting things from you. He’s not “spoilt”.

I think (while it might be an excess) that it’s fairly harmless for her to buy him lots of legos if they’re all at hers.

I agree with others about being less controlling.

I’d say to her that “if the toys are left at your house and not mine, then that’s fine, but please don’t tell DS to keep secrets from me”.

I’d see a problem if she was going against you with his screen time or his diet, but some Lego isn’t so bad.

I would be having a quiet word with her about this. Let her buy him ludicrous amounts of toys that stay at her place for the most part - but keeping secrets is setting him up unwittingly as easy bait for any predator who comes into his life.

Love the assumption in at least 3 posts that it's the paternal grandparents. And therefore it's OK to "have stern words" and "tell her she's laying him open to abuse"

If you want to avoid the secrets thing do be very careful- it may well be an entirely new concept to her and she may well be very shocked and feel that she's being accused.

Definitely tell her that teaching a child to keep secrets from their parents is bad form for all the given reasons.

But also tell her she is teaching him to expect toys from her, she is setting that up a a major part of their relationship. If that’s what she wants and keeps them all at her house, go ahead bearing in mind his toys are going to get significantly more expensive as he gets older.

Everything is proportionate - this blanket approach does not work and shows how some safeguarding "advice" is just over the top. Of course there are times children are asked to keep secrets ie birthdays etc or visits or whatever and this case is one of those.

@Ilovetowander that’s a surprise not a secret

Not keeping secrets is not an hard and fast rule for safeguarding. Everything is proportionate - children are asked to keep secrets for many things, a birthday, Christmas, where a key is etc etc this is one of those cases. Some of the safeguarding training is disproportionate.

You sound a wonderful, sensible grandma cast very much in the same mould as my own. My dear granny was mock-appalled when she saw a caption reading 'if mummy says no, ask grandma'. In my family if my mother said no, then gran said no; there was no argument or ambiguity about it.

Strong boundaries and a consistent united front are known to be best for children. It provides them with comfort and security. I also had a great deal of respect for my granny, who showed love in all manner of ways aside from materially and was well-endowed with common sense. The respect a child has for a matriarch/mentor-figure like this in their lives is something which cannot be bought, no matter how many ice creams they're given for breakfast or secrets they're taught to keep.

Some of the grandparents on this thread seem to assume full parental responsibility and the right to do precisely as they please with other people's children. Attitudes such as the one described by the OP might set them well on the course for a rude wakening at some point.

Parents make the rules. They have parental responsibility until that child is of age. But it's a common attitude that some people would prefer to be 'right' than to have a relationship with their grandchildren.

I've no idea why some grandparents do this. Surely they must know this is a battle of wills they can never win.

@Biffbaff you're presuming grandparents are all old. I became a grandmother aged 37, and I have four grandchildren now and I'm 44.

Grandparents' ages can range from 30s-80s so hardly just the one generation.

this is a very good point
unless she's come across the notion professionally (unlikely by the sound of it) she may well respond with 'so you think I'm an abuser then????'
you'll have to explain very carefully that to keep DC safe its important that everyone, especially the people that love them, do the things we know help to keep them safe
a little story often helps - I know this sounds patronising, but I mean like- 'I read this story in the paper about this poor girl whose uncle - that everyone thought was lovely- had been abusing her for years and she never told anyone because he told her it was a secret and she knew you mustn't tell secrets'
If her mum had only told her not to keep secrets from her! It would all have been different and the uncle would have been caught straight away!

his is a very good point
unless she's come across the notion professionally (unlikely by the sound of it) she may well respond with 'so you think I'm an abuser then????'

Don't be silly. She is teaching him that when an adult tells him to keep a secret from his parents it's okay. That is not the same as saying she or anyone close to her is an abuser. But she is still undermining the OP and teaching him to lie, and opening him to manipulation by some other adult with worse designs.

But wouldn't be kept a secret if the mother just let the grandmother buy toys.

Google - good secrets and bad secrets. There's some great resources explaining to kids

@bananacreampie "
Don't be silly. She is teaching him that when an adult tells him to keep a secret from his parents it's okay. "

It is only very recently that this surprise/secret distinction has been routine. It is very unlikely that someone old enough to be a grandmother would have come across it. My children are young adults, and when they were small I wouldn't have thought twice about them having giggly secrets with grandma. So it needs to be explained very clearly so that the grandmother in this case a) understands so she does what she is asked to do and b) does not feel that she is being accused of something.

ahem
I have been old enough to be a grandmother for many years
its a very easy distinction and one that I have understood for many years

don't be ageist

I'm a grandmother, and I know this, BUT I know it through my professional life as a teacher. I'd put bets on DGD's other (lovely) GM never having come across the distinction, as there've been other subjects obvious to me, that have bemused her.
And that's no criticism of her at all, it's just that her world hasn't brought her into contact with these things, and she's not a big reader or internet user.

not her age then

Mumsnet is made up of people so people worry about this kind of thing so your point is daft. People didn't use to worry about wearing seatbelts, recognise coercive control/emotional abuse - things move on and we learn.

Exactly, if she says "do you think i am an abuser" she's either wilfully misunderstanding or a bit thick - both of which should give the op pause as to how much the child is exposed to the grandparent.

Oh here we go. Only took 3 posts to turn granny buying toys into child abuse !