Buying house with DP… not sure what to do.

[cocunut]

Hi MN. I’ve been with my DP for a few years now and we are looking for somewhere to buy. We live in London/south east so expensive!
The problem is we are at loggerheads over what we are looking for. 300k max budget. I really don’t want to buy a flat - service charges, leasehold, not having your own garden or front door. But his income is much greater than mine (I'm a new graduate looking for an entry level job, he has an established career albeit self-employed).
He wants a flat purely due to cost. I feel like I have no say in this although I will be contributing to bills and some of the mortgage (with my contribution in proportion to his wages) once I’ve got a job. We’re looking for next year anyway but I don’t see myself on more than 20-25k by then. We are not married yet.
Im just not sure what to do! Does he have the overarching say in this? I want a forever home, don’t want to buy a flat to have to sell it in a few years when we have kids and I really want a garden. I just feel like I don’t have a leg to stand on as his income is the highest!!

Can anyone offer sensible advice on what property might suit us?

This

Standard procedure is to buy a "starter home" then gradually drag yourself up the housing ladder. Not even rich kids with inheritance, buy a "forever home" from the offset.
Also, living in a cramped flat is more romantic and fun while young. Having parties with zero space and minimal kitchen equipment.
Chasing "proper adulthood" feels like you are wishing your life away.

He doesn't get a final say and neither so you. Despite his salary you actually hold the cards as you have the deposit. This is a partnership. Like any disagreement, yu can both draw hard boundaries, such as you saying no to a flat, but you both have to be happy with the compromise.

Bad decisions are usually made when you are rushing so take time. His rental costs might be a reason to move but they do not dictate the timeline.

I want a forever home, don’t want to buy a flat to have to sell it in a few years when we have kids and I really want a garden.

Given the cost, time and effort of moving, I don't think yabu. If there is a housing crash, you may very well known stuck living with this man and any kids and this purchase. Have you spoken to him about your timelines for this stuff? Have you read mumsnet threads on the importance of marriage for financial security before starting a family? If not, I suggest you read them or ask on your own post and consider whether you may end up living with a man who keeps pushing marriage until you've moved in, then until youve had kids and then suddenly you're either unmarried with kids, limited income and no chance to leave if he plays up. Or you end up settling for kids and no marriage because you're worried about the clock running out.

Currently you hold all the cards. Don't rush because you're scared of having conversations that youre worried might make you seem pushy. It's perfectly reasonable to have these conversations before tying yourself to him in a property.

And make sure you're on the same page I.e. you're both planning a future, not trying to solve his housing problem.

YOU have the final say on what YOU do with YOUR money.

Don't be railroaded into something you're not happy about.

With a joint income of £80k I wouldn't be borrowing more than 3 1/3 times joint multiplier, so £280k. Maybe you need to save a bigger deposit.

You have champagne tastes and no budget, OP.

If he has form for railroading you into decisions you dislike then fair enough - time for you to leave him. If he's a kind and rational man then why not look for a job with higher pay and then you can look for a house somewhere.

You can still access parks and other green spaces. Your partner is being realistic and sensible.

@cocunut I will try and PM you- because I read your OP and thought ‘that sounds like my house’ and it’s in the area you describe!! Not that I’m selling mine but my downstairs neighbours are 🤣 and it’s got its own front door and private garden etc.

Honestly, you're behaving like a child. Your parents have worked all their lives to have a house like this. You don't even have a job.

Hi OP. I bought my first property in the broader area you're looking at. 2 bed flat with garden and parking for 285k in 2020. I was single at the time but liked that this had room if a baby came along. I got a DH who wfh instead so it's a study full of stuff now! I don't particularly notice the shared hallway and 2 of the flats where I am have their own separate front doors anyway. And my neighbours are great. Quite honestly you're fussing about things you can't completely control and won't actually know about until you look in earnest. You'll get used to the commute or you'll find a job that suits your situation better. Like everyone else does. Like plenty of my first time buyer colleagues have done.

You do have a point about leasehold but you could spend much more per year on a very expensive mortgage on a house than a service charge on top of a smaller mortgage on a flat. We are hoping to buy a house next as we are fed up of leasehold and are now ready to see what the future holds with ttc and we will be moving further out (which terrified me as I've lived in the town where I am since I moved out of my parents home!) to get better bang for our buck. Partly helped by having moved along at work as well- as many do. We're doing my flat up to try to make a profit on it when we sell, to help with the upsizing. Like everyone does.

Quite honestly in your position I'd move in with my partner first and check that we were compatible before giving up my savings. You also need to get over yourself wrt possibly living in a flat. Again, move in with your partner and try it. I grew up in an 18 room house with acres of garden and I've been fine in the flats I've lived in so your excuses don't wash with me, I'm afraid. I know I'll probably get a house again one day. A flat with your partner is also better than a bigger house but it being a many person house share in my opinion. More of a home and more "room" for yourselves.

Your partner is being much more realistic than you and is actually looking further ahead, in practical terms. I think you need to adjust expectations. I sympathise somewhat as I'm a rightmove snob myself- within my budget though!

fwiw I think the right nice airy spacious flat is much nicer than a pokey two bedroomed house. And lots of people in London have kids in a flat.

also, you need to cut your cloth accordingly!

Firstly - You are not guaranteed to make profit on anywhere you live. Sometimes prices fall in the short to medium term.
Secondly - There is nothing wrong with somewhere affordable today and then to 'trade up' after a few years. If your property drops in price - the odds are other properties will too.
To me taking this route shows financial maturity and responsibility.
Thirdly - With a 5% deposit in the current market you are at risk of negative equity if prices drop.

My advice would be as others have said to either get married (before any chance of getting pregnant) or at least have a watertight agreement around the house purchase ensuring that you get a fair % of the proceeds if you split up. I speak from experience where I did not go on the mortgage ( lower salary at the time) but had a large deposit protected with a declaration of trust . We are now splitting up and my lack of ownership is causing all sorts of issues trying to extract myself and my money from the house.. Please listen

Leaving aside the cost…

Why do you want to think about buying a “forever home” with someone who you have not yet lived?

You are putting the cart before the horse here. You don’t want to sink a huge amount of money into a house before you know if you are compatible.

For your budget and area you should be able to get a decent two or three bed flat: it’s highly unlikely you would lose money on it and you can try living together in a relatively low risk environment, potentially make some equity and improve your salary.

If it works out maybe that’s the time to think about a forever home.

First thing you both need to do is get a realistic idea of your mortgage potential and affordability.

10% deposit is the realistic minimum, 5% are harder to get and will have higher interest rates.

4x combined salary is high end of what you will be able to borrow so on an £80k combined income you'd be looking at £320k max but you may not pass affordability checks depending on your current outgoings and commitments for loans, and if children are in the plan you'd need to factor in potential of £1k+ a month childcare fees on top of your mortgage.

Slow down! You're trying to move far too fast with everything and you risk rushing into decisons that you will seriously regret down the line. I would never buy a property with someone who I had never even lived with yet, you could find you're seriously incompatible.

This is such good advice OP. Unless you get help from parents or have inheritance it's not realistic to go straight into your forever home. I had to buy 3 houses and do them all up to sell for profit before I got my forever home. This is how it works in an expensive area you buy a flat, live there up to 5 years, do it up, then sell for profit. By then your careers have moved on and you move up to a 2 bedroom house. In a cheaper area you buy a 2 bedroom terraced house often with a backyard, after 4 or 5 years and more savings you either progress to a 2 bed semi or a 3 bedroom terraced. It's usually only after this move you get larger forever home. Renting for 6 months and living together will show if you are compatible. You need to be saving a deposit.

I would not, at your age, be buying anywhere without living with someone first.
Having just gone through a breakup where we had lived together renting before we bought a house, I can't stress enough how much you do not know someone until you live with them, and that doesn't mean staying round at his place, it means being jointly responsible for the running and upkeep of a house.
I know renting in London is difficult but please don't buy without living together first - could you move into his flat?

OP maybe you should switch your focus on getting a job. Without 6 months pay slips you won't be considered for a mortgage anyway.

My partner and I are on £80k between us and I absolutely would not get a £400k mortgage. My first house was £100k and I’ve since moved to one which was £265k (with £75k equity from the sale of the first), so a £190k mortgage. I see this mortgage as pretty much the limit I was prepared to spend. You need plenty of money leftover each month for bills, commuting, days out, holidays, pets, house repairs, savings etc etc.

I don't think your deposit is realistic at all for a £300K-£400K house.

You will need about 6 month of payslips before you apply for a mortgage since you are fresh out of uni but your partner, who is self-employed, will need to submit 2 years of accounts showing that he has had a steady income in those years. If you want a good mortgage deal with someone who is self-employed you usually need to have a good deposit (15% or more). I don't think that a 5% deposit is likely to be available if the main earner is self-employed.

I did all of this a few years ago and it was a nightmare trying to get it sorted. Before you get too ahead of yourself (I think you already have) at least speak to a mortgage broker to see what you actually need to do to get a mortgage of that size.

Also agree that it’s far too early to think about marriage. It would be crazy to marry someone if you have not lived together.

Your salary is £20k, you're not married and you're looking at getting a joint mortgage of £300-400k??? Absolute madness!

I think you need to figure out a way to increase your income rather than badgering your DP into spending more on a house.

What degree have you done that you predict you'll be barely above min wage in a year?! In London too where I expect grad roles to pay better than up north.

You need to consider how you'd afford the mortgage if your DP is unable to work. £25k isn't going far at all!

We're looking for a house up to £350k (up north) with a £70k deposit and porting our current mortgage (at 2%) and payments are coming out at £1200 a month, yours will be more than that!