To think the judge was right to throw the book at Just Stop Oil?

[StripedPiggy]

Five Just Stop Oil activists, including leader & XR founder Roger Hallam have been sentenced to up to 5 years in jail for blocking the M25 & other main roads.
Their intention was to cause gridlock on roads in the South East. The disruption they caused resulted in people missing medical appointments, flights & business meetings.

Well done to that judge. The criminal justice system is right to pass serious sentences on these fanatics which will act as a strong deterrent to others who might try to cause mass disruption, and put people’s lives in danger, to further a political agenda, whatever it might be.

No it was too long a sentence. People get less for violent crimes. A big sentence here is making it seem like violent protest is better legally (less severe punishment). Also we're letting people off jail time because prisons are so full, but not these people? I think the judge has given an inappropriate sentence

It is peaceful in the context of peaceful and non-peacful protest, whether you agree or not, and the amount of disruption caused doesn't change that either.

Weirdly I don't remember there being the same outrage and accusations directed at farmers when they decided to block roads earlier this year, I wonder why that is? 🤔

Maybe the police should be encouraged to round the organisers of those protests and cart them off to jail too, after all 5 years prison time is apparently the justified punishment for those actions.

I, for one, am incredibly grateful for Roger's and other climate activists' tireless work.
Extinction Rebellion's peaceful activism shifted the Overton Window in the spring of 2019, and we owe so much of our current discourse on the climate to this.

So many of the asylum seeking families I work with share what is currently unfolding in their countries of origin ‐unprecedented heat, droughts during seasons which would normally be wet, freak weather events, crop failures, resource scarcity and resultant conflict and displacement.

I agree. I don't necessarily disagree with a short sharp prison sentence (say 3 months given that someone COULD have died (but didn't)) but the length is ludicrous. I've posted before about a guy who got drunk and ploughed into two girls on a pedestrian crossing, killing them both. He got six years, for taking two lives. That was a stupidly short sentence and this is stupidly long.

As an aside, they need to stop having a go at ordinary people and blockade Farnborough airport and other places where you have the twits with their private jets.

I agree with this as well.

The climate crisis denial has to stop.

I am by no means perfect when it comes to the climate but at least I don't fly in a private jet or run marathons in the Antarctic. People have to accept that they have to make changes to their lifestyles (and companies need to do a LOT more to protect the environment).

I am sure this will be appealed and I do think the sentence will be reduced.

If they were let go with a slap on the wrist, their next action would be even more spectacular. And all those laughing at those idiots daring to put their livelihood or hospital visits over the Cause, might change tack if it's their mother denied a lifesaving operation or their child unable to get a heart transplant or just take their exams, or their house gets robbed in a continuing blackout because of a "peaceful protest" disrupting a power plant operation, government networks, or some other lifeline services deemed a worthy target by JSO

As a pp pointed out, doctors' strikes cause a few of those things too. And I wonder how many people have road accidents when there are rail strikes or how many miss or are late for exams and appointments.

Dear Cressida Trust-Afarian. So you think it is acceptable to bully working people and stop them going about their lawful business? Why don’t you target rich polluters and private jets instead of preventing minimum waged workers getting to their jobs.
I suppose you support the blocking of ambulances too.

How is preventing people from getting to work helping your cause?
Labour is planning to concrete over the greenbelt with Barrett boxes and non recyclable solar panels and yet all the XR anti-nature loons have no problem with the desecration of wildlife and nature this will involve.

Perfect28
"if a tree falls down and blocks a road... It's just tough. You aren't guaranteed to be somewhere on time just because you drive, there are always risks of delays."
I think a tree falling down is considered to be an 'Act of God' (insurance terminology). Presumably efforts would be made to clear the tree to get the traffic moving, etc
In this case, they were deliberately attempting to cause as much disruption to ordinary people's lives as possible.
But 'disruption' comes in many forms. The news item stated that one person missed his cancer appointment at the hospital. if you are having a course of cancer treatment this could make a difference to one's long term prognosis.

It is the CONSPIRACY. It is a very serious offence.
I am also assuming that you have never been stuck in traffic on the M25.

I think everyone who has ever driven on the M25 has been stuck in a traffic jam.

M25 has been notorious for traffic jams for years

Valerie, I thought the judge's use of the word 'conspiracy' sat awkwardly in the context; it is technically correct usage of course, but he could have phrased it using a verb form as opposed to the noun: "you have conspired to x, y and z..." instead. Conflating, through selection of vocabulary, the climate emergency with 'conspiracy', when an increasingly concerning fact is that science-deniers tend to consider anthropogenic climate change a hoax, or a 'conspiracy'.

WTF Where have you lot been or have you just got short memories.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/in_the_news/738408-114-campaigners-arrested-for-planning-protests

"Dear Cressida Trust-Afarian. So you think it is acceptable to bully working people and stop them going about their lawful business?"...
Come on, Greek. Do better. Why do you presume a woman is no more than the sum of her background? Odd to extrapolate that a daughter of musicians somehow isn't also of "working people" stock?
Even if she was the epitome of privilege, she is still right: we are in grave danger as a result of an ever worsening climate emergency. Fact.

Completely disproportionate in the same week that the killer of an 11 year old girl gets a suspended sentence after being convicted of manslaughter. But then economic crimes always seem to attract more serious sentences than crimes of violence against women and girls.

A Royal wedding or other event which caused a disruption to roading is known in advance and people know to take a different route. Have I got that right?

Maybe the UK is different to where I live, but when there are strikes by doctors emergencies are still dealt with - there are contingency plans in place beforehand. While it is inconvenient for others they are advised beforehand what is going to happen. Rail strikes are also known about in advance, meaning people have the opportunity to plan. It's completely different.

you’re missing the point of my post and it’s tiresome trying to debate with people who don’t / can’t engage in critical thinking

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/article/2024/jul/19/just-stop-oil-tactics-prison-chris-packham

In the Guardian this morning

@Lopine oh i completely agree They shouldnt be in prison
They should be helping to provide care and or monetary recompense to this lady instead!!!

https://www.joe.co.uk/news/mum-paralysed-by-stroke-after-m25-protest-delayed-trip-to-hospital-by-six-hours-289722

Totally

The point is that we are a society and so things like policies and rules have to be decided upon, and in a democracy that happens through the people. What you are suggesting is that as long as people feel it is important enough they can force the change they want. This is just low level terrorism in the end.

The fact is that while these protestors like to claim some kind of moral high ground, they don't have more realistic or achievable ideas about how to solve the problems of consumption any more than the rest of the world/

That's the real elephant in the room holding back action - there are serious roadblocks and no one knows how to deal with those without sending us of the rails in another way.

TempestTost: The fact is that while these protestors like to claim some kind of moral high ground, they don't have more realistic or achievable ideas about how to solve the problems of consumption any more than the rest of the world.
That's the real elephant in the room holding back action - there are serious roadblocks and no one knows how to deal with those without sending us of the rails in another way.

You're right, the climate activists who have protested with both XR and JSO aren't necessarily offering ready solutions -they are calling on the UK government to act in the best interest of its people, in the words of the early XR rebellions, to "Act as if the truth is real". They are saying: the climate science is conclusive, anthropogenic climate change looks set to cause untold damage in the decades ahead. What is our government, who are elected to act for the good of its citizens, doing to safeguard us and prevent harm?

The climate activists are asking the government to listen to the science and to act on it. In the case if JSO, a plea specifically to not issue any new licences as this would contravene sound climate science. People seem to think climate activists have, or should have, all the answers. That's not the point: it is for our government to take courageous action now to prevent future harm. If they were serious about this they would mobilise to fund research, commission new technology and draft policy which would reflect the urgency of the climate crisis.

To suggest that you can only campaign about a perceived wrong if you are simultaneously able to serve up a solution to said problem isn't helpful. As a SEND campaigner, I don't have all the answers, I just point to what is glaringly wrong and suggest someone whose job it is to be held responsible for Education take responsibility and attempt to fix it.

I would have given longer…..