To feel really gutted for England tonight?

[Acapulco12]

This Euros tournament has been quite a crazy ride for England and it’s a tournament I’d rather forget (partly because of the way that Gareth Southgate and the team have been treated by the British press and their own fans).

I think that whilst the team has loads of fantastic world-class players, they haven’t consistently played well as a team, either in the run-up (e.g. in the Iceland or Bosnia games) or in the tournament itself.

I really feel that the team only managed to get through to the final because of moments of individual brilliance (Jude Bellingham’s goal, Ollie Watkins’ goal, Pickford’s absolutely top-notch goalkeeping).

I’m also quite disappointed with elements of Gareth Southgate’s management even though I still really admire his leadership style, his achievements as England manager and his attitude. Southgate has - undeniably - produced consistently excellent results with this team, but they haven’t yet won anything with him, and ultimately they will be judged on winning. They have got close to winning on two occasions now with him, and he and they obviously care for and respect each other, but I don’t think that’s enough anymore (feels harsh to write that).

I think it’s time for the team to find a new manager and go in a new direction, but equally I think it will take time for a new manager to find their feet with England and I worry that the new manager will not be able to create the same sort of culture that Southgate did, which I think really helped to shape this current team and make them so successful.

I know that there can only be one winner in the Euros - just like in any sports competition - but I just really feel for the England players. I’ve followed them for a few years now, they come across as a really nice team and I feel really sorry that it didn’t work out for them tonight.

Focussing on the final tonight, Spain were clearly the better team tonight - and throughout the Euros. Having said that, I do feel quite sad that the England players couldn’t achieve the win they wanted. They obviously really really wanted to win, and I think the team’s performance has overshadowed the individual achievements and excellence of the England players that I mentioned earlier in the post.

I know there will be many more tournaments to come, probably for most players in the team as most of them are still very young and are full of potential, but they had so much expectation riding on them and they came pretty close to winning, having got to the final.

They should feel really proud of themselves for getting to the final and coming close to winning, but I know that they would rather have won than been runners up.

You're missing the point as previous PP have said. We'd rather they had played some football and gone out earlier. Winning isnt the be all and end all. In fact if they'd won it would have been the hollow of hollowest victories.

It's been this way for the last 20 years at least. Build them up and then kick them when they're down. Media frenzy of its coming home, public buy in to that, then indignation when someone has the cheek to beat them. Southgate and the team don't seem to buy into that but media/lots of fans do.

I definitely don't expect to consistently win, we never consistently win anything 😂 and this is exactly why.

They've chosen to make all those "sacrifices" to earn millions and then lose the Euros, so I don't feel massively sorry for them. They're not heroes, they're footballers and not especially good ones, we give Southgate an OBE and he hasn't managed them to victory- that's exactly what I mean by rewarding losing

Yes they were. Having said that I don't think the team selection always helped.

My H (who is more knowledgeable than I) said he was trying to fit everyone in, regardless of whether they actually fitted together in a coherent system. Like he was afraid to bench a big name.

Well Im sure they can drown their sorrows in their overinflated pay cheques and egos.

For the amount of money they make they were rubbish plain, the only reason they were in that final was pure luck of the lowest skilled teams in their previous games.

I don't think any money will make them feel better about the disappointment. They weren't as good as Spain but I don't think it's fair to suggest that money and ego tripping will make it easier for them to be on the losing side.

I don't think Southgate is a particularly good manager. England have had remarkably favorable draws for each of the major tournaments he had been manager for.

Spain had to beat several big teams on their way to the final (Italy, Germany, France and Croatia).

The only major team England had to play was the Netherlands.

It was similar at Euro 2020 (where England also benefited a lot from home advantage).

I'd ascribe England's recent relative success (compared to previous tournaments) more to luck of the draw than anything else.

Southgate has managed to avoid any hugely disastrous results, which is something, but I think various prior England managers have been at least as good as Southgate but that stars have aligned perfectly for England in recent times.

You say "lose the euros" as if it's yours to win. It's not.

We were totally outclassed.
The Spanish are a sporty nation. I used to work there...they have the climate on their side, they are very outdoorsy and fit and have fire in their belly.

Agree!

Kane needs to retire from international football...walker and trippier; they're nearing the end of their international career too.

I love GS. The most successful manager of the England team for years but his loyalty to Kane is ridiculous. So many younger players that play harder and better than Kane but GS doesn't seem to have the confidence to play them from the start. He keeps putting on Kane like a pair of old slippers. 🤣

It's anyone's to win, just we never do 🙄

My mistake! Thank you 🙃

Come to Ireland, enjoy never even qualifying 😂

😂 Fair enough

I think Southgate should carry on (although obviously I don't think he should be forced to carry on if he doesn't want to). The team are not bad at all. They're the only team to make into the finals two tournaments in a row, they're officially the second-best in the whole of Europe, and that includes not only the countries we saw in the televised part of the tournament but all the countries that didn't even qualify. Lots of other teams have never even come close to winning anything. Most of the players seem good enough - I agree Kane and Walker seem tired/off form or something, and only time will tell whether they just need a good rest or whether they're completely past their best now. Pickford, Stones, Shaw and Saka played well and definitely need to stay in the team, and we need to see more of Watkins and Palmer.

I do dislike the attitude from some fans and journalists that if you don't win the whole tournament, you have "failed." Why can't we just celebrate what they did achieve? Plenty of countries would have been thrilled to get that far.

Exactly. The hype is ridiculous. They were second. Second is the next best to first.
I find it prideful to the other teams to show so much angst about becoming second. Like you say, there are teams that would give their eye tooth just to get into the tournament, let alone free to the final.

We were missing slab head and grealish definitely!!

Who’s slab head? 😂😂

Agree with what's been said in this. Impressive what Spain did. Just kind of annoyint how when Rodri went off it looked like could be a sign that England had a better chance and then minutes later not the case

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/cv2gvreml2ko

Be intresting to see what he or the FA do now..dont think he'll be sacked by maybe walk and feel.hes taken them as far as feels he can who knows..

Sorry l, as much as I love Kalvin as a person, he has barely played for 3 years.
On loan at WHU he was not good, looked terrified everytime the ball was passed to him and was too slow and was subsequently dispossessed

I was gutted but am used to that feeling having watched England play since the mid 1980s.

I think Southgate has achieved a lot and lifted our international team out of the doldrums that were apparent before his tenure. But he’s taken them as far as he can and 8 years is a long time as the head coach of an international squad.

His tactics are too defensive and deep and at international level you don’t win trophies on playing a defensive game. You have to constantly attack, run forward with the ball and cause problems for the opposition.

We got lucky breaks and moments of brilliance that led us to the final but Spain deserved to win.

I think Southgate will resign and think it’s time for someone else to build upon what he has achieved. But winners win the silverware and sadly he didn’t achieve that. I’m sad he didn’t. But these other countries win Euros and World Cups. We can’t just celebrate being in 2 finals. You actually have to win the game. He knows this and said prior to the tournament that we had to win for him to stay.

His legacy will still stand and he will be remembered for what he’s accomplished with the team. He will always command respect for that, but on a world or European stage you do have to win in the final as we did 58 years ago.

Just back from Berlin. Great trip, best team won.

Having lived through periods when we didn’t even qualify for some World Cups and European Championships I can’t get too upset at reaching consecutive Euro finals.

I felt really sorry for Gareh Southgate last night

I think hearing the criticism of the English team throughout the tournament it's hard to say we love a loser