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Original poster

To feel really gutted for England tonight?

210 replies

Acapulco12 · 15/07/2024 01:28

This Euros tournament has been quite a crazy ride for England and it’s a tournament I’d rather forget (partly because of the way that Gareth Southgate and the team have been treated by the British press and their own fans).

I think that whilst the team has loads of fantastic world-class players, they haven’t consistently played well as a team, either in the run-up (e.g. in the Iceland or Bosnia games) or in the tournament itself.

I really feel that the team only managed to get through to the final because of moments of individual brilliance (Jude Bellingham’s goal, Ollie Watkins’ goal, Pickford’s absolutely top-notch goalkeeping).

I’m also quite disappointed with elements of Gareth Southgate’s management even though I still really admire his leadership style, his achievements as England manager and his attitude. Southgate has - undeniably - produced consistently excellent results with this team, but they haven’t yet won anything with him, and ultimately they will be judged on winning. They have got close to winning on two occasions now with him, and he and they obviously care for and respect each other, but I don’t think that’s enough anymore (feels harsh to write that).

I think it’s time for the team to find a new manager and go in a new direction, but equally I think it will take time for a new manager to find their feet with England and I worry that the new manager will not be able to create the same sort of culture that Southgate did, which I think really helped to shape this current team and make them so successful.

I know that there can only be one winner in the Euros - just like in any sports competition - but I just really feel for the England players. I’ve followed them for a few years now, they come across as a really nice team and I feel really sorry that it didn’t work out for them tonight.

Focussing on the final tonight, Spain were clearly the better team tonight - and throughout the Euros. Having said that, I do feel quite sad that the England players couldn’t achieve the win they wanted. They obviously really really wanted to win, and I think the team’s performance has overshadowed the individual achievements and excellence of the England players that I mentioned earlier in the post.

I know there will be many more tournaments to come, probably for most players in the team as most of them are still very young and are full of potential, but they had so much expectation riding on them and they came pretty close to winning, having got to the final.

They should feel really proud of themselves for getting to the final and coming close to winning, but I know that they would rather have won than been runners up.

OP posts:
SupportRobin · 15/07/2024 08:03

It was disappointing, but Spain were the better team. I doubt the FA will sack Southgate, but I would not be at all surprised if he resigns, as the commentary from the pundits has become increasingly tedious. Yes, it would be nice to see us play more flowing attacking football, but that comes with the risk of getting caught on the break, especially if your passing is not absolutely top notch, and your midfield and defence aren't 100% focussed. Given how good Spain are, we probably would have just lost 4-2 instead if we'd gone with the suggestions of Lineker and co.

UtterlyOtterly · 15/07/2024 08:07

I know nothing about football but presumably when you do it for a job you realise you might not always win.

If they are "gutted" or whatever they need to build some resilience. They are certainly paid enough.

DanielGault · 15/07/2024 08:08

UtterlyOtterly · 15/07/2024 08:07

I know nothing about football but presumably when you do it for a job you realise you might not always win.

If they are "gutted" or whatever they need to build some resilience. They are certainly paid enough.

If they weren't gutted they'd be in the wrong job.

thegrumpusch · 15/07/2024 08:10

They clearly weren't the best team playing last night

Zanatdy · 15/07/2024 08:13

I don’t know a lot about football but England has some top class players, they just don’t gel that well as a team, and that falls to the manager. They were bloody lucky to get to the final and Spain 100% deserved to win, best team in the tournament.

tigger1001 · 15/07/2024 08:15

UtterlyOtterly · 15/07/2024 08:07

I know nothing about football but presumably when you do it for a job you realise you might not always win.

If they are "gutted" or whatever they need to build some resilience. They are certainly paid enough.

I disagree with this.

If you are not gutted when beat, then your heart isn't in it and you shouldn't be there.

Sports people take that gutting feeling when beat and use it to hopefully turn it into a win the next time. Gives them fire in their belly. And shows the desire to win. When they lose that, it's a sign they've lost heart.

maudelovesharold · 15/07/2024 08:15

I don’t know a lot about it, but does anyone think Spain’s football success is anything to do with their strong ‘Academy’ structure? I was hearing last night that Yamal has been with Barcelona since the age of 7 and at their boarding training school from age 12.

Noosnom · 15/07/2024 08:17

We did really well. Coming second shows how hard they've worked.
I think our old demons are long behind us, hopefully we'll be consistently up there with the top teams from now on. We'll win again one day.

PianPianPiano · 15/07/2024 08:17

GPTec1 · 15/07/2024 07:15

England lost, they have never won a major tournament in the modern era, compare to other European nations who have multiple world and Euro cup wins.

Someone said "we have plenty of world class players" do we really? one or two perhaps.

We have to face facts, we are (relatively) poor at football, a large nation, huge number of people to pick a team from, yet we cannot win, regardless of the manager (Southgate is a world class manger) or the players.

I think its the arrogance that we think we invented the game and have some sort of "right" to these tournaments, then there is the money in the game, football, seems to attract kids/families who love the idea of becoming millionaires rather than being the very best.

Show quote history

Someone else has already pointed out that second out of 32 hardly equates to "poor at football", but I also wanted to pick up on "large nation"! We're a small island - far smaller population than France or Germany...

goodkidsmaadhouse · 15/07/2024 08:18

KnickerlessParsons · 15/07/2024 02:28

England didn't lose. They came second out of the 20 (?) teams in the tournament, not to mention all the others that didn't make it that far.
If your child won a silver medal at the Olympics you'd be delighted.

It's all the media hype and the "coming home" crap that winds everyone up that makes you feel like a loser. Coming second is brilliant. If Wales came second I and the rest of the Welsh nation would be over the bloody moon.

Agree! Spain were the better team but England put up a really good show against them. There was some brilliant football on both sides in last night’s match. The players should feel really proud of themselves but there was such a ridiculous amount of pressure on them.

Rosie7475 · 15/07/2024 08:19

Far too much hype for the England team in every tournament. Every radio station playing that stupid 'it's coming home' song, living on past glories, the players have a huge amount of pressure because they're all individually good and paid X million per year so therefore that should translate to a winning team etc.

I watched every game and they just don't attack enough. Too much faffing around passing the ball back to the goalkeeper and looking for the perfect opportunity to score rather than just going for it and attempting to create chances. We have a defensive style of play in the main and it doesn't work well!

I think we were very fortunate to have got so far tbh and if we had been on the other side of the draw I doubt we would have progressed very far.

The best team won last night and that's all there is to it

rewilded · 15/07/2024 08:22

I agree OP. We have many talented individual players but not the flair of a team. Spain's set pieces were outstanding and some of their players - Nico Williams being one looked totally unfazed by our team.

They did well but need to lighten up. Jordan Pickford is the only team member who looks like he is enjoying the match and he is probably the main reason we have got as far as we have.

If Southgate stays he needs to build a team not a collection of amazing players. The Spanish team didn't even play their best game last night.

That being said we came second which is brilliant! Well done to all our team and Palmer, Shaw and Rice were exceptional.

chocolateisavegetable · 15/07/2024 08:24

Let’s take comfort in the fact that England won the Euros in 2022

DanielGault · 15/07/2024 08:25

maudelovesharold · 15/07/2024 08:15

I don’t know a lot about it, but does anyone think Spain’s football success is anything to do with their strong ‘Academy’ structure? I was hearing last night that Yamal has been with Barcelona since the age of 7 and at their boarding training school from age 12.

Absolutely. They've had it for quite a while. I think Messi was brought over to Barcelona very young.

Miley1967 · 15/07/2024 08:31

Yes I feel terribly sorry for them especially Gareth and Harry Kane as it's likely the younger ones will get other chances.
Also think it's time for Gary Linekar to go.

DanielGault · 15/07/2024 08:34

Miley1967 · 15/07/2024 08:31

Yes I feel terribly sorry for them especially Gareth and Harry Kane as it's likely the younger ones will get other chances.
Also think it's time for Gary Linekar to go.

I didn't see any Lineker at all, what's the story there?

maudelovesharold · 15/07/2024 08:39

Also think it's time for Gary Linekar to go.

I was watching BBC coverage, but didn’t see anything amiss. What did Lineker do?

Bloom15 · 15/07/2024 08:40

LoudSnoringDog · 15/07/2024 07:07

Agree Southgate shouldn't be sacked.

He needs to stop with the loyalty to players like Kane, Walker etc. utter dross to watch.

If putting the likes of palmer, Watkins and Toney on and the game accelerates then start those players!!

Completely agree with this - some of our plays just aren't good enough and Southgate needs to stop playing them

Original poster
Acapulco12 · 15/07/2024 08:41

EmmetEmma · 15/07/2024 06:37

Who might be better at the job - Southgate has been the best England Manager in decades if we are going by results

I find this dissing of him odd and unpleasant

I’m not sure if your post was aimed at me but I don’t agree that I’m dissing him at all. I admire him so much for so many reasons and he has done an absolutely outstanding job with the England team, but he has been in the role for 8 years and I think it’s time for someone new to do the role now.

OP posts:
Anothershapeofapple · 15/07/2024 08:42

Zanatdy · 15/07/2024 08:13

I don’t know a lot about football but England has some top class players, they just don’t gel that well as a team, and that falls to the manager. They were bloody lucky to get to the final and Spain 100% deserved to win, best team in the tournament.

Edited

I have read / heard in the media that Harry Kane caused Tottenham to feel disconnected as a team as well. So maybe there’s some truth to that after all. Not good for a Captain!

Anyway! Here’s to next time 🥂

barnefri · 15/07/2024 08:47

PianPianPiano · 15/07/2024 08:17

Someone else has already pointed out that second out of 32 hardly equates to "poor at football", but I also wanted to pick up on "large nation"! We're a small island - far smaller population than France or Germany...

Show quote history

England has a population of 56 million… that’s not small. England may be quite small geographically, but it’s densely populated.

Of all the European countries, only Germany, France and Italy have a larger population than England (83M, 64M, 59M, respectively).

GPTec1 · 15/07/2024 08:48

Cheeseandpickleroll · 15/07/2024 07:31

Poor at football coming runner up twice at the Euros? Under what definition does that count as poor? When our rugby or cricket teams come second we, rightly, praise them to the hilt for doing so well!

Show quote history

Hence why i used the word "relative" which you appear to have missed....

Hardly anyone plays Cricket or Rugby (to a decent level) and we regularly win major trophies in these sports.

Spain has won the Euros 5x, Germany 4x times, european countries have multiple WC's between them, all in the modern era, we have none.

England is a major football nation, with one of the richest leagues in the world, we have a large population and football is our no1 sport, yet we do not win finals, this is something we should be ashamed of, not be proud of.

Professional sport is about winning, its not about coming 2nd, might as well go out in the qualifiers.

Original poster
Acapulco12 · 15/07/2024 08:49

PianPianPiano · 15/07/2024 08:17

Someone else has already pointed out that second out of 32 hardly equates to "poor at football", but I also wanted to pick up on "large nation"! We're a small island - far smaller population than France or Germany...

Show quote history

We haven’t actually got a far smaller population than France or Germany (unless you’re being sarcastic?!) England has about 55 million people, whilst France has around 67 million and Germany has about 83 million.

OP posts:
Caerulea · 15/07/2024 08:51

As someone who hasn't missed a Euros or WC since Italia '90 (apart from that game against Holland in' 96 when we won 4-1 & I was in a pub having dinner with my nan in a different room) I don't want Southgate to leave. Every tournament is the same & it's the Press & the pressure that causes the most problems imo.

National teams in other countries are treated like heroes from the get-go.

Another aspect is that we are truly hated by everyone else & I have never understood why cos no English team has ever been arrogant or agressive. We dive & whine FAR less than virtually every other country (Italy, Spain & Portugal I'm looking at you! Not to mention the South American teams), players rarely lash out & we generally have a good attitude. Even down to the whoever the coach is at the time.

Some of our fans... Well.. It doesn't help 😬

I think that combination of our press & others attitude towards us is too much & often our undoing 🤷🏼‍♀️.

This tournament was uninspiring for us, the cohesion wasn't there. Although the journey was theoretically easy they were all teams who play in a way we've ALWAYS struggled with, never found easy though on paper we should.

End of the day - Spain were better for the entire tournament & better on the night. We didn't get trounced, our goal was from open play & not a pen or a set-piece. Decisions went both ways, we weren't robbed & had Spain lost to the team who only had 30% possession that would have been tragic & unfair.

DanielGault · 15/07/2024 08:57

Caerulea · 15/07/2024 08:51

As someone who hasn't missed a Euros or WC since Italia '90 (apart from that game against Holland in' 96 when we won 4-1 & I was in a pub having dinner with my nan in a different room) I don't want Southgate to leave. Every tournament is the same & it's the Press & the pressure that causes the most problems imo.

National teams in other countries are treated like heroes from the get-go.

Another aspect is that we are truly hated by everyone else & I have never understood why cos no English team has ever been arrogant or agressive. We dive & whine FAR less than virtually every other country (Italy, Spain & Portugal I'm looking at you! Not to mention the South American teams), players rarely lash out & we generally have a good attitude. Even down to the whoever the coach is at the time.

Some of our fans... Well.. It doesn't help 😬

I think that combination of our press & others attitude towards us is too much & often our undoing 🤷🏼‍♀️.

This tournament was uninspiring for us, the cohesion wasn't there. Although the journey was theoretically easy they were all teams who play in a way we've ALWAYS struggled with, never found easy though on paper we should.

End of the day - Spain were better for the entire tournament & better on the night. We didn't get trounced, our goal was from open play & not a pen or a set-piece. Decisions went both ways, we weren't robbed & had Spain lost to the team who only had 30% possession that would have been tragic & unfair.

Well, it's that attitude right there tbh! I doubt you're truly hated by most people. Most people are more bothered with their own teams. The press is major bugbear here when it comes to England, rather than the teams. And the 'it's coming home' shite.