To wish Sir Keir and his wife would not hold hands when working

[BeaQuiet]

They've arrived in Washington DC on official business clutching hands like the Macrons, the Obamas and the Sussexes.

AiBU to find it a bit cringey?

And before anyone asks, yes I do have bigger things to worry about but I fancy a chat.

And yet here we are. Could it be because they’ve done nothing but good so far? That even if you disagree with some of it, it’s all in line with the manifesto and competently rolled out?

What do you mean “here we are”? Here we are on a non-political thread about hand holding?
My point was that there ARE no better arguments. I’m a Labour supporter. You sound a bit paranoid.

So I’d think mumsnet, which is a hotbed of supposed feminist and “feminist” activists and a well known source of crappy stories and trolling by the right wing press would be aware of the use and manipulation of public opinion to shape attitudes to government.

The UK (and the US) have the most virulent snd aggressive right wing press universe whose unrelenting goal is to secure benefits from the government —or end government restrictions on—for billionaires and oligarchs.

One of the things the press seeks is to keep center/left governments out of power. Another is to kneecap any such government whenever it gets into power.

Portraying Starmer as inauthentic, weak, “a boy about to cry” “wetting” himself “frightened” “uncertain” not really experienced, and (my favorite) not really a winner but simply the passive beneficiary of Tory incompetence is an absolutely bog standard set of right wing tropes.

Of course no individual poster here making fun of the new PM is doing anything other than “having a larf” its all just bantz, isn’t it? But its part of the torrent of delegitimization (the mummy party, the nanny state, champagne socialists, effete overeducated elites and “who do they think they are” outsiders” who “don’t know how to behave “ on the world stage that left wing governments have to face even as they also have to tackle the enormous mess that the previous government has left.

Whether you know it or not this stupid thread is part and parcel of the right wing ecosystem of insults which are dimply a form of politics by its other name: culture war. As Steve Bannon has always argued as he has employed these methods “politics is downstream from culture” and you get to the political by shaping the outlook of the masses.

As for all the supposed Labour voters who “just” feel uncomfortable with Starmer’s handholding A) obviously on the internet no one knows who is who. B) its possible to vote with your head but return to some pretty atavistic and non rational prejudices on cultural or aesthetic issues.

The whole tempest in a tea pot is expressly the absurd but significant charge that Starmer is inappropriate snd not behaving like “one of us” (not manly, not professional, not authentic) well: who is the implied “we” there? The implication from the poster and her supporters is “real” and “good” UK people. If the elected PM isn’t good and british enough for you who is? Surely the implication is that he and his voters are an error that needs correcting?

I don’t mind the hand holding. Lots of other leaders do it or have done it. All at work events. Anyone with issues about Keir’s wife attending needs to look at at the event generally and take issue there if you want. If spouses are invited, then she should attend. If she wasn’t there, people would be asking why not and criticising them for it. They look a happy solid couple to me. Hand holding can be romantic but it can also be supportive. I might need a hand hold if meeting world leaders and it also keeps them together. Others have been criticised for walking in front of or abandoning their spouse!

You sound a bit aggressive.
I was just pointing out how daft it is to criticise him for something all leaders do (except Trump, whose wife refuses to touch him) when nobody has raised it for any other leader in the past. It’s odd that suddenly it’s the worst thing in the world when an otherwise competent leader who is clearly moving on a plan happens to be a Labour politician. The thread is very political, incidentally -politics is a wide ranging topic and questioning the ability of a leader to function without handholding (when that’s clearly nonsense) is definitely political. I find it strange you, a Labour supporter, don’t understand that this is an attempt to undermine him by people who don’t like him (even if that wasn’t the OP’s intention, which I’m on the fence about)

I think you are going way OTT with this analysis in this context but the fact remains that it is abundantly clear that OP, a Labour supporter, did not start this thread in order to cause political damage to the Labour Party. At worst she has inadvertently done so.

I agree

I'd call it quietly confident. Why anyone has to mock his appearance or demeanor I do not know.

👏👏👏👏👏
@TimeandMotion this says what I was trying to say above, but much better.

Whether you know it or not this stupid thread is part and parcel of the right wing ecosystem of insults which are dimply a form of politics by its other name: culture war.

Or some of us just don't think adults should hold hands with their spouses while at work.

I simply don’t take life as seriously as you do. Sorry.

You have no idea how seriously I take ‘life’. I do take the constant delegitimising of elected leaders quite seriously though. As @pikkumyy77 has eloquently explained, that’s what this sort of discourse is about.

Also baffled how you get from “I find it a bit cringey” to “questioning the ability of a leader to function”. A wee bit of a reach there.

oh and edit to add “constant delegitimising of elected leaders”. You’re too much!

You have no way of knowing what OP’s intentions were just as none of us knows who she us or whether they are a Labour voter at all.

Maybe it’s Labour in gov the first time SM is really around. Does seem an overreaction and it’ll be a lot of mopping up if only pre approved lines are wanted.

Sure: but oddly this was never raised as a complaint before for any other world leader? Why this, why now, why here are always good questions to ask yourself.

I am sure people have been chatting about this stuff for decades. Are you 100% sure there are no Mumsnet threads about hand holding by Trump, Cameron, Johnson Macron? Were you keeping stats? It’s been mentioned now because (a) they are in the news and (b) one might have hoped for a more modern professional approach by a new Labour government.

I disagree with you. The only people I know to hold hands are in new relationships. I never see married couples do this.

I can only assume you go around not observing anything anywhere.

You can see couples of all ages holding hands down any high street, through parks, in airports, walking round shops, etc. in my experience.

And how would you even know the length of most couples relationships when out and about anyway. 🤷‍♀️

I'd be incredibly surprised to go a whole day out and about and not see a couple holding hands somewhere.

I get there via comments about him looking like a “little boy’ about to ‘wet himself’, looking uncertain, ‘clutching’ his wife’s hand, questions as to why he can’t manage without her etc etc etc.
You don’t think left wing leaders, whether in power or not, are constantly delegitimised by the press and other commentators?

I can say with certainty I’ve never seen one. Johnson was criticised for his relationship with a younger woman, for cheating on his sick wife, that sort of thing, but just holding Carrie’s hand? No, I’ve never seen it.

that wasn’t what OP said though!

I didn’t say it was. I was, and have been, mostly talking about how the thread went - and that it was predictable it would. I think I’ve only said about the OP that 8m not sure what the motivation was.

No but we are talking about the entire thread. If I leave the brake off my car and it rolls downhill is there no car crash because “I just left the brake off?” Sure: gravity did a lot of the work but leaving the brake off was a big part of it. This is such a car wreck of a thread!

I think you’re going to have an interesting time coming wrt SM plus politics, nearly everyone comments on pretty much everything. It’s more prevalent when you’re in power, so Labour have been more immune to how much it happens

FTR I am always slightly scathing about adults who hold hands!

Oh please! Labour immune. 🙄