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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To want to write to the governors about my DD's suspension?

265 replies

UndertheCedartree · 08/07/2024 11:47

I'm looking for a bit of help. Last week my 12 yo DD was suspended from school for half a day. She has autism and struggles. She didn't want me to leave her and was crying and clinging to me. I tried to get her to go with a member of staff for half an hour but she wouldn't. So the head teacher had to suspend her and send her home. They said I can write a statement to the governors. Does anyone know what I need to say? Is just that it was due to her ASD?

Also if the headteacher keeps suspending her can she be expelled? This is the one and only time she has ever been suspended but it just got me worried.

OP posts:
UndertheCedartree · 10/07/2024 21:52

BrumToTheRescue · 10/07/2024 20:56

I’m not the one who doesn’t understand the difference. I didn’t confuse the two. Section B of an EHCP is the section that sets out a pupil’s special educational needs. The SEP in F is to meet the needs in B. If B is poor, F will be poor too. The needs assessment prior to an EHCP being issued is not the same thing, although informs the content of B&F (and other sections).

Parents request an EHCNA, they don’t apply for an EHCP.

We know it is ASD and specialist equipment for this is not something for individual use

This demonstrates such a lack of understanding. Some with ASD do need specialist equipment such as sensory equipment, or tech/assistive tech/specialist software. Other examples of equipment may be a standing desk or an anti fatigue standing mat for e.g. DT or ear defenders.

If there is such problem with mental health that physically healthy child cannot attend school they address it in different way: homeschooling with the school support or specialist school

I haven’t said otherwise. Although if it is inappropriate for the provision in an EHCP to be made in a school setting (other than for a temporary period of ill health) case law dictates a school not to be attended must not be named in section I. Section aid should be blank for EOTAS/EOTIS (with or without a C on the end).

Edited

My DD has special science goggles that are comfortable for her. The school also gave her those type of ear defenders that go in the ear.

OP posts:
BrumToTheRescue · 10/07/2024 21:54

I did not say an EHCP would be issued ‘just’ for counselling or specialist software. They were examples of SEP that isn’t 1:1. DC who reasonably require either don’t require them in isolation. They require other SEP too.

Counselling is not always provided for free especially without a long waiting list. It depends entirely on the area as to what is available. It is similar to therapies such as OT, SALT, physio, CBT. They can also all be included in F of an EHCP.

The equipment as such is not for individual use but shared school property that can be allocated for specific pupil during his her stay at school.

Not always. There is some equipment that is specifically for a child with that specific equipment in F.

inexpensive sensory tools

Lots of sensory equipment is actually expensive and can mount up to thousands of pounds.

BrumToTheRescue · 10/07/2024 21:57

OP, if the LA agree to assess, you can request the LA seeks advice from a psychiatrist &/or a clinical psychologist as part of the EHCNA.

If DD is unable to attend school full-time because of her MH/SEN (the rules for suspension/PEX are slightly different) the LA is ultimately responsible for ensuring DD still receives a suitable full time education. On their website, IPSEA has a model letter you can use. Provision should begin as soon as it becomes clear 15 days (consecutive or cumulative) will be missed and provision should start by sixth day at the

UndertheCedartree · 10/07/2024 21:57

BrumToTheRescue · 10/07/2024 21:54

I did not say an EHCP would be issued ‘just’ for counselling or specialist software. They were examples of SEP that isn’t 1:1. DC who reasonably require either don’t require them in isolation. They require other SEP too.

Counselling is not always provided for free especially without a long waiting list. It depends entirely on the area as to what is available. It is similar to therapies such as OT, SALT, physio, CBT. They can also all be included in F of an EHCP.

The equipment as such is not for individual use but shared school property that can be allocated for specific pupil during his her stay at school.

Not always. There is some equipment that is specifically for a child with that specific equipment in F.

inexpensive sensory tools

Lots of sensory equipment is actually expensive and can mount up to thousands of pounds.

Edited

Yes, the ear defenders are just for DD and for her to keep. Noone wants to put something in their ear another DC was already using!

OP posts:
UndertheCedartree · 10/07/2024 22:00

BrumToTheRescue · 10/07/2024 21:57

OP, if the LA agree to assess, you can request the LA seeks advice from a psychiatrist &/or a clinical psychologist as part of the EHCNA.

If DD is unable to attend school full-time because of her MH/SEN (the rules for suspension/PEX are slightly different) the LA is ultimately responsible for ensuring DD still receives a suitable full time education. On their website, IPSEA has a model letter you can use. Provision should begin as soon as it becomes clear 15 days (consecutive or cumulative) will be missed and provision should start by sixth day at the

I have had a meeting with an Educational Psychologist and she observed DD today.

Right, brilliant, I'll sort that out too.

Once again, thank you so much for your invaluable advice!

OP posts:
UndertheCedartree · 10/07/2024 22:05

I think the reason the SENCo doesn't seem as involved as she should be is that she teaches as well so isn't available most of the time.

OP posts:
UndertheCedartree · 11/07/2024 22:24

I'm writing this in tears. So I got home from Open evening where DD had been showing families around the school. It really gave her self esteem a boost and she skipped all the way home.

I went on to the school app to check her subjects and they've given her 14 behaviour points - 7 for each suspension!! My beautiful, well behaved little girl who has never been in trouble does not deserve this. She's done nothing wrong! I'm going to have to try and hide this from her because if she were to find out that precious bit of self esteem will be destroyed 😢

OP posts:
Mumofoneandone · 11/07/2024 22:34

UndertheCedartree · 11/07/2024 22:24

I'm writing this in tears. So I got home from Open evening where DD had been showing families around the school. It really gave her self esteem a boost and she skipped all the way home.

I went on to the school app to check her subjects and they've given her 14 behaviour points - 7 for each suspension!! My beautiful, well behaved little girl who has never been in trouble does not deserve this. She's done nothing wrong! I'm going to have to try and hide this from her because if she were to find out that precious bit of self esteem will be destroyed 😢

Whilst I don't understand how the behaviour points system works, I can't get my head around the school!
They are suspending her but then think she's suitable for representing the school at an open evening?
I am not surprised you are in tears - your DD has clearly been given the opportunity to shine and it's really helped her. (And presumably the school!) Yet they are allowing her to get all these marks against her for something outside her control.

UndertheCedartree · 11/07/2024 22:46

Mumofoneandone · 11/07/2024 22:34

Whilst I don't understand how the behaviour points system works, I can't get my head around the school!
They are suspending her but then think she's suitable for representing the school at an open evening?
I am not surprised you are in tears - your DD has clearly been given the opportunity to shine and it's really helped her. (And presumably the school!) Yet they are allowing her to get all these marks against her for something outside her control.

It really makes no sense. She's never had a behaviour point before, she's never been in trouble. And yes, as you say she's gone and represented the school - I mean she's done them a favour helping out at open evening and then they do this! It's such a kick in the teeth!

OP posts:
Notamum12345577 · 13/07/2024 14:01

UndertheCedartree · 11/07/2024 22:46

It really makes no sense. She's never had a behaviour point before, she's never been in trouble. And yes, as you say she's gone and represented the school - I mean she's done them a favour helping out at open evening and then they do this! It's such a kick in the teeth!

I would question the behaviour points with the head or head of year

UndertheCedartree · 13/07/2024 20:28

Notamum12345577 · 13/07/2024 14:01

I would question the behaviour points with the head or head of year

I have emailed the head teacher and also the SENCo. I will be so upset if they don't remove these points. Why punish a child who is struggling due to autism? It's awful.

OP posts:
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 12:00

Update I had a call from the LA SEND team. My request for a EHCNA has been turned down! Despite the head teacher telling me she needs an EHCP asap as this is a mainstream school and they can't meet her needs, apparently the school has told the LA they can meet her needs!!

She said that there is no proper plan for my daughter and they should be making goals, putting provision in place to meet them and assessing every 6 weeks. She said they need to see them doing that and if it still isn't working then I can apply for an EHCNA again.

She also said she should not be being suspended or excluded from trips etc. She has suggested I contact Sendiass and then arrange a meeting with them and the school and she will also attend.

OP posts:
Mumofoneandone · 15/07/2024 12:22

UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 12:00

Update I had a call from the LA SEND team. My request for a EHCNA has been turned down! Despite the head teacher telling me she needs an EHCP asap as this is a mainstream school and they can't meet her needs, apparently the school has told the LA they can meet her needs!!

She said that there is no proper plan for my daughter and they should be making goals, putting provision in place to meet them and assessing every 6 weeks. She said they need to see them doing that and if it still isn't working then I can apply for an EHCNA again.

She also said she should not be being suspended or excluded from trips etc. She has suggested I contact Sendiass and then arrange a meeting with them and the school and she will also attend.

Sounds like some progress is being made.....but so much other stuff happening with different agencies that doesn't seem to add up.
Good to hear a plan is being put in place - hopefully all sorted ready for the start of next year!

fernfriend · 15/07/2024 12:29

Sorry if you have already answered this, but does your daughter have a My Support Plan in place?

fernfriend · 15/07/2024 12:37

With reference to your daughter's exclusion from school, and exclusion from school trip, it does not sound like either of those incidents are legal.

www.ncb.org.uk/resources/all-resources/filter/inclusion-send/school-exclusions-what-legal

Gardenschmarden99 · 15/07/2024 14:02

Save a lot of time and appeal this decision - three cycles of assess, plan, do, review is not a requirement. The legal test for an assessment is that they MAY have SEN that require a plan. There is also case law (precedent) that says even if a child shouldn't have to have an EHCP to make provision, if school show an unwillingness to provide the basics, then LA must issue an EHCP.

BrumToTheRescue · 15/07/2024 14:04

The school should be providing support and shouldn’t be discriminating against DD, but that doesn’t mean DD doesn’t meet the legal test for an EHCNA. She does. Request the LA formally refuse so you can appeal the refusal to assess.

My Support Plans don’t exist everywhere.

UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:29

Mumofoneandone · 15/07/2024 12:22

Sounds like some progress is being made.....but so much other stuff happening with different agencies that doesn't seem to add up.
Good to hear a plan is being put in place - hopefully all sorted ready for the start of next year!

I don't know when we'll be able to have the meeting but hopefully as early in September as possible.

OP posts:
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:31

Ellie56 · 15/07/2024 12:22

They can't just ring you up and tell you your request has been turned down. And while LAs may want to see what the school has been doing, this is not part of the legal test. See here:

https://www.ipsea.org.uk/asking-for-an-ehc-needs-assessment

The LA needs to put its decision in writing and inform you of your right to appeal.

https://www.ipsea.org.uk/appealing-to-the-send-tribunal
https://www.ipsea.org.uk/general-advice-for-all-appeals
https://www.ipsea.org.uk/refusal-to-assess-appeals

I have been sent an email and it put on the Hub too. But she rang me on top of that. It says they do not think she needs special educational provision. Then on the other hand the head teacher is saying she should be in a special school!

OP posts:
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:32

fernfriend · 15/07/2024 12:29

Sorry if you have already answered this, but does your daughter have a My Support Plan in place?

What is a 'My Support Plan', please?

OP posts:
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:36

fernfriend · 15/07/2024 12:37

With reference to your daughter's exclusion from school, and exclusion from school trip, it does not sound like either of those incidents are legal.

www.ncb.org.uk/resources/all-resources/filter/inclusion-send/school-exclusions-what-legal

I have made a formal complaint about the trip. The school tried to wriggle out of it by saying she wasn't eligible for the trip which was not the case. I have escalated it to the governors.

Hopefully when we have a meeting with the SEN department person they will tell the school they cannot suspend her and we can get a sensible plan in place.

DD was really anxious this morning about a Science assessment. I kept her at home as didn't want them to suspend her again. It's the last week so I though sod it!

OP posts:
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:38

Gardenschmarden99 · 15/07/2024 14:02

Save a lot of time and appeal this decision - three cycles of assess, plan, do, review is not a requirement. The legal test for an assessment is that they MAY have SEN that require a plan. There is also case law (precedent) that says even if a child shouldn't have to have an EHCP to make provision, if school show an unwillingness to provide the basics, then LA must issue an EHCP.

Thanks for the advice. From what I understand from the letter I have to go to mediation before I can appeal.

OP posts:
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:40

BrumToTheRescue · 15/07/2024 14:04

The school should be providing support and shouldn’t be discriminating against DD, but that doesn’t mean DD doesn’t meet the legal test for an EHCNA. She does. Request the LA formally refuse so you can appeal the refusal to assess.

My Support Plans don’t exist everywhere.

They have formally refused. I have to do mediation before I can appeal.

OP posts:
UndertheCedartree · 15/07/2024 16:50

Anyone know what the school is playing at? I've got the head teacher saying she needs an EHCP asap and saying we need a meeting with the LA to see if other school can meet her needs as we are a main stream school and we can't do anymore! Then apparently the SENCO is saying - we can meet her needs!! I'm so confused!

OP posts:
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