Are we BU to move kids to NI from SE England?

[Putyoursunscreenon]

I am from NI originally and DH is English. We live in the SE due to DH's work in London. We have 2 x dcs who are 7yo and 9yo.

We've always been keen to go back to NI for a few reasons. Dh has been going over there to visit since we were 19/20 yo and loves it as much as, if not more than, I do.

DH is planning to keep working in his current job and flying back to go to the office. Possibly every week (!), but I'm really hoping he won't have to do that.

DH is especially keen to do it. I think the pressure of the cost of living here is getting to him which I absolutely understand.

Pros are:

1. nearer my family and old friends who dh likes a lot
2. we would be mortgage free after selling our house over here and buying something bigger, near the sea in NI (which is nuts)
3. dh, dcs and I love it there

Cons are:

1. further from dh family
2. dh would have to travel for work
3. I won't have a job there to start with. I can't work remotely and don't have the sort of skill set where I'd walk into another job if we moved. However, we could afford for me not to work for a while (or at all, but I wouldn't choose to be a SAHM long term)
4. dcs are well settled here and have some nice friends at school. I'm worried about disrupting their lives

I'm in England now, but that's my area too, I take the kids back regularly to see family. I'd do it too! So much going on for families and a great education system. I bumped into old school friends in a park last time and it sounds like loads of people have recently moved back and English accents are more common now. I assume you've checked property pal? (Though I hear agents are boycotting them now?)
Only consideration is the weather is always colder and wetter than England. It's hardly ever warm and often rains...

As PP suggested do a trial run before deciding if you would make it permanent.
People are friendly on a surface level but also in ways close-minded. That may just be a cohort who have never wanted to venture outside of NI. If you have lived elsewhere for a long time that could be something you encounter though in fairness there are similar people in England too but I didn’t socialise much with them.
The healthcare is an absolute joke.
But yes, you will get more house for your money.

Have you thought about keeping your house in England? And renting it out? Especially if you're not working, the tax would be a lot less and you would get tax relief on your mortgage.

I say that also as it's very hard to buy back into the market once you've left it. And your property won't go up in the same way in NI. So you won't be tracking in the same way should you want to move back.

Or if your children want to work in SE England later, they might wish you kept the house if it's possible?

Also the trial move sounds like a great plan.

Your kids are the perfect age to move in regards to education.

I would check out the exam results for the grammar schools in the area you are looking at as some are very high, even not taking all pupils with the 1st banding (I'm thinking sullivan upper)

There is a seag support group on fb which has all grammar schools lowest marks in this year's papers ranked. Just something to maybe look up and be aware of.

Also look into the provisions of local high schools, it seems from talking to friends that those who go to a traditional high school are doing OK, but the newer academies are like the wild west.

But the education standards here are nothing like we read about on threads on MN.

Even if your job isn't available here, I'm sure you have transferable skills.

It is amazing being so close to the sea, then nature within minutes from home, I'm on the other side of the lough. Belfast is 10 mins away, the North Coast less than an hour.

Buying a house if obviously less expensive, I think our utilities rates are lower. Insurance is more expensive. Belfast has just been named recently as the most expensive weekend away in Europe.

The NHS is a disaster, waiting lists are unfathomable, if you can get private health care but our few private clinics have waiting lists now, a few years ago you could phone and been seen that week. Now their waiting lists are months.

Politics are shite, always will be, they get nothing done and prefer to fight with each other than spend public money for good.

And the weather can be a bit crap

In spite of all that, I love NI. The people, the communities, the craic, the traybakes. Comeon home!

Points I want to raise.. Employers there don’t treat you as well as employers in SE England. Changing job is interesting there. What happens if your partner changes job? It’s a great place to have a job in civil service, education or health. For the private sector, it is very different.

Health services are very different. Much worse. You cannot access a private A&E department or out of hours clinic as these don’t exist. Out of hours waits there (when you need to see a GP) could be up to 3.5 hours, stuck in a room of coughing and vomiting people. Obviously there are waiting lists then too.

What percentage of young people leave NI when they are 18 for education and career opportunities? What is the likelihood that your children are moving when they are 18? Yes, there are universities and they might be happy staying there and going for a public sector career. Also, lots of people do leave.

It is very hard to move back if you don’t like it.

Being in SE England gives you and your family opportunities they won’t have in NI.

Yes, lovely beaches. Nice to see relatives more frequently. Nice to bump into people you have known all your life. The downsides are pretty big too though.

Also, afterschool childcare bill. My bill there was almost three times what it was in England.

I think when you pop over somewhere at Christmas or the summer, it is very different from living there. It’s easy to get the holiday vibes and it seems so tempting to move back when you are in holiday vibes. Somehow it feels different on a cold, dark day in October. Weather is definitely better in SE England.

It became difficult to move back once I had left SE England. :-/

If your child is going to grammar school, they will be privileged. If your child doesn’t make through the grammar school system, there are a lot of young people who leave secondary school without much in the line of qualifications at all.

If you move to SE England there is a constant stream of people who need to make friends and are up for doing things and going places. People in NI who have lived there for years have their wee friendship/family situations already. They have their social life and family life. While friendly, they are less likely to be actively friendly and socialise when you are the blow in.. simply because they don’t need to.

I could list other things which are quite behind SE England. Nursery education standards, racism, xenophobia.

IME a lot of people in NI look at it through rose coloured glasses and it didn’t stand up to these, once I had lived away.

Trying to get DH to do the same although we have absolutely zero connection to NI beyond enjoying the scenery on holidays. We currently live in a very ugly semi in the Home Counties. Dh is a pilot, his airline has a base in Belfast so you’d think it would be an easy enough move. I’m such a homebody so for me having a large house with some land is the dream. Dh thinks I’ve lost it and apparently is disturbed by me “giving up”. Whatever that means.

I need to get off of Rightmove. Too many nice houses close to Belfast centre. Our current town is hideous.

Following!

@Cowbag77 raises some interesting points. I am from NI originally too and now live in Surrey. Have also toyed with moving back to NI at various points for the same reasons as you. I can see the attractions. The main things that put me off (for now at least!) are the lack of job opportunities, the point around people being friendly but not actively friendly and that my dc would be quite likely to move to mainland uk for uni/work later on. If you can live with those negatives, then I would go for it!

Thanks for all these comments!

Yes, dh is more on board than i am. I think he's incredibly stressed here and wants to move out of our house but doesn't want a huge mortgage (which a bigger house here would definitely involve). I can see the downsides more than he can I think.

The politics definitely a big one!

I did always find it too insular when I lived there, but agree there are a lot more English accents there now and nobody bats an eyelid. Not like the bad old days!

But also - I've honestly found some towns in the SE very insular too. Not keen on blow-ins or new houses being built etc. Cannot understand an accent from further afield than Essex etc.

That certainly doesn't apply to the whole area of course, but it does exist here.

London is a little different I think but we can't afford to live there realistically without another mortgage

This.... If you have family already here then you are off to a good start. Might check and see if the primary schools you want to attend have spaces ? Afterschools can be expensive and lots of kids go to England for uni so might want to consider that there are fewer places available here. yes the NHS is woeful here. It can feel a bit far away, holidays are more expensive.Job opportunities are way behind se england and wages are lower.. I have friends whose husbands commute, they are getting a bit bored of it but there are no comparable jobs here. Weather is not great.. Amazing countryside and local amenities. I think come with no rosey glasses on for a week and really see how it might work. It's a lovely part of the country but has some downsides.

@Putyoursunscreenon we went to ROI op, but I have not had one single regret. Well, maybe I regret not having more choice in the house we bought, but a housing crisis is going on in the republic so overall we’ve been very lucky.

in my opinion:

1. You and DH go over for a trip and 1) identify the area you want to live and 2) look at schools, talk to all the head teachers and see how that goes.
2. If there is a similar housing crisis in NI, identify the house you want to buy, buy it from where you are, and move straight in. Renting is very very difficult and stressful
3. Quality of life is so good where I am. Sure it’s expensive, but it’s beautiful, real family feel, and at least the food/most other things are good value for your money.
4. The schools are so well looked after where I am - it’s lovely to see the kids blossom.
5. FYI weirdly furniture and building supplies are a lot more expensive than in the UK so don’t get rid of anything you like and think you’ll buy new - you’ll be broke! Just bring it with you.
6. Theres a good Facebook group for returning Irish expats which is useful for info on practicalities
7. finally and most importantly, don’t think of it as going ‘home’ - it’s a different place than it was, and you’re a different person now. Think of it as moving to an entirely different and new country, and as an adventure, and expect it to take 18m to 2 years to fully settle, and you’ll be grand.

My parents moved from SE to another part of the UK - 8 hours away from London
it was awful. I was 8 and I never settled in to school or made proper friends
I wouldn’t do it.

https://www.propertypal.com/36-kensington-park-bangor/952461 This is available for rent...

I would disagree with people not being actively friendly.
I have made friends with lots of different groups of people through many situations, beyond the old school/uni friends.

In the street we live, through school (I've never had the school mum drama that's often posted here), through the rugby club my husband and son play for, through the GAA (even though I'm a prod it doesn't matter to a lot of people any more)
Through meeting in groups for hobbies or interests, I met a good friend in hospital during a stay.
Obviously the area you live may be important but you seem to be coming over with enough equity to buy in an area where you can guarantee people are (I can't guarantee all) looking forwards and not backwards for a better future in NI

Yes you will always go on a night out and end up chatting to strangers that's the way NI is, but there are many ways to make active friendships.

There is also a private a&e in Holywood, possibly also one in Belfast.

I have worse news though, dalriada our version of 111 only opens when GPs are shut and for them to call back can be 8+ hours.
A&e waiting times at the Royal are often over 12 hours, and at the children's hospital I've waited 8 or 9 hours with a very ill child. Breathing problems do get sorted quickly....and obviously emergencies are dealt with ASAP.
Ambulance times are woeful.

Though the NHS has been like this for years here.

We don’t have any true private A&Es (nor does anywhere in the UK really), they are only for minor injuries and are very limited in what they can treat. I tried to use one the other day for DD and they were fully booked up 🙈 Had to go down the out of hours NHS GP route instead which to be honest I was quite impressed by. Call back within 2 hours and antibiotics prescribed.

Thanks all. I'm going to speak to DH again tonight as he's mad keen.

I don't think he understands that dc1 will need to do the transfer test very shortly after moving, even if we went right now. She'd be going into P6 in September, so would only have a year to prepare. Might look at prep schools to see if that would help.

Our younger one also has some SEN and is on his primary school register. We do have private health insurance so think we need to get a firm diagnosis for him first (suspected ASD).

Honestly, I think if I lay out what we actually need to do to make it work, dh might be a bit more realistic.

He isn't a dreamer - that's usually me! But he's really keen about this.

I've just spoken to my dad about the possibility that we might be able to move home. We are close and he is good for advice! Omg his reaction has really made me feel as if we should do it, as he was so happy I almost cried. He's a widower in his 70s. Honestly, he was as happy as when we told him we were getting married / having babies 😂.

Aww.. how sweet - bless him. You’re going to make me cry too OP!

😂 aw thank you! I'm in a coffee shop a little bit teary. He's offered us his house, car and right arm (think he's joking 🤔) to make it happen 😂

Bless him.. or should I say "wee dote" to get back into the way of it??

Some serious research needed here, but I'm feeling really hopeful about it.

I agree with PPs re:NHS. 6 years for hernia repair and bladder surgery, at least 4 for hip or knee replacement and cataracts. 12 hrs at A&E often, lack of medical staff part of the issue and delays in treatment at holiday times. I know someone who decided not to return here based on the waiting lists. No private care for cancer I read on MN. Late to diagnose for several people I know. The cheaper houses was the only plus but that’s changing now, much dearer than 2 years ago even.
We’re still a bit behind as far as attitudes to other people go but much better than before. And lack of good job opportunities, many of my peers didn’t return after uni in GB and went on to have better careers consequently.

Rural areas have brilliant GP practices - same day appointment for everyone.

That's interesting re cancer care - I have a few medical friends working in NI, so will ask them about the state of things.

We do have private health insurance but definitely need to research on the whole system. Trying to keep a level head (somewhat failing obviously, but I will have a word with myself)

You can get a private diagnosis for anything in NI if you can pay.

Are you sure your child will have to do the transfer test? If they'd been out of the UK they'd definitely be eligible for another form of assessment but I'm not sure.

Schools in NI are very good if you're prepared to factor that in when moving.