To never sing "God save the king"

[boombang]

To be fair, I was never going to - I am a republican, and I did respect the late queen, so used to sing "God save the Queen". She came from a long gone era, and she fought in the war.

I have always thought the monarchy should end with her, I have always thought it was a horrible system, grossly unfair to those caught up in it, and very very annoying - I do understand the point about the prime minister using the monarchs authority though, and understand it would be hard to dismantle - not least because it would mean whatever prime minister of the day volunteering to have all that automatic power taken out of his/her hands.

But the events of the last two days have changed my mind, it is beyond annoying, it is an insidious evil

The media outright calling cancer victims "lesser mortals" - the description of someone putting on pretty clothes and waving as "the bravest woman in Britain" and the huge distress caused to thousands of normal people through this.

We shouldn't have a monarchy. We shouldn't have this system where someone is seen as a better, braver, more important person because they are part of the monarchy, and other people being publicly and firmly denigrated, because whatever their situation, however they are feeling, whatever their abilities and whatever their achievements, they are not good enough,

why? no reason, other than not being royal

Kate and Charles, if you read this, I have nothing but good wishes for you. Apart from obviously you are in the best possible position to access treatment and survive cancer, I feel sorry for you - I wouldn't want your lives.

But I have really for the first time taken on board how inherently damaging this system of having a royal family really is

What is it about these miserable joy sucking republicans who miss the whole bloody point of the monarchy? We are not living in a Brother’s Grimm fairy tale where there is a King and a Queen counting their gold, ruling the land over villagey type peasants who get locked in dungeons…

They live public lives in gilded cages which belong to the state. King Charles is the Head of State and has the job, whether he likes it or not, til he drops. He has no real power or life of his own. And all the twiddly parades, anthems, gold carriages are part of the rich tapestry and pageantry that speaks to a thousand years of heritage and ritual as a nation. All countries have a version of it. And whether it brings in tourists or not, it wields soft power in a way a presidential system would not.

Don’t sing the national anthem, really, no one gives a shiny shit. People say the monarchy is irrelevant, but on the contrary, in the UK I actually think republicanism is.

I'm not convinced it would make any difference. The media would still put, say, particularly rich people on pedestals and come out with the same twaddle.

Because she never fought in any war.

I used to be a royalist in that I didn't mind them but after all the public squabbling etc I think it's time we started talking about whether it is still relevant in this day and age. I don't think I will see the end of it in my lifetime but hopefully it will happen soon. Wasn't a massive fan of the Queen but I think Charles and William will see popularity decline especially amongst younger people.

'What is it about these miserable joy sucking republicans who miss the whole bloody point of the monarchy? '

You have nothing to back up your claim that republicans are 'miserable' or 'joy sucking'. What you mean is, we are saying something that monarchists don't want to hear.

'They live public lives in gilded cages which belong to the state. King Charles is the Head of State and has the job, whether he likes it or not, til he drops. He has no real power or life of his own.'

And you think it is OK for Charles to be forced into that role 'whether he likes it or not'? Some of us actually think that it is cruel to force this on everyone, and even the luxury and privilege of such a life cannot fully compensate. Much of the vilification of Prince Harry (regardless of what anyone may think of him) is due to the fact he had the audacity to walk away. Many ardent monarchists can't forgive him for choosing a different path....something the rest of us do all the time but monarchists want to deny the RF because they seem to think they 'own' them.

'And all the twiddly parades, anthems, gold carriages are part of the rich tapestry and pageantry that speaks to a thousand years of heritage and ritual as a nation.'

Wrong. Much of it originated relatively recently ie the Victorian/Edwardian eras to prop up their flagging popularity. And at least at that time there was a British Empire which (again, rightly or wrongly) provided some justification for the flummery & excess. What is the justification for it now? Frankly I am embarrassed by it & so are many other people.

'All countries have a version of it......it wields soft power in a way a presidential system would not.'

Define 'soft power' and how it benefits us as a country?

'People say the monarchy is irrelevant, but on the contrary, in the UK I actually think republicanism is.'

You wish. Republicanism isn't going anywhere & is set to grow.

I like the Royals but I don't think I've ever had to sing the National Anthem and I'm late 50s.
You talk as if it's a regular occurrence OP.

Work related ones. I worked in an independent school for a bit. They had it a couple of times a year at events. And some events I sang at also had both. You missed nowt (except me singing, obvs 🤣).

I've voted YABU because you crazily claim the late queen fought in the war. Once I'd read that I couldn't take anything else you said seriously.

Surely there is never going to be a situation where anyone is forced to sing the national anthem? So nobody cares if you sing it or not really. It's not exactly a big show of rebellion.

I do like the idea that Charles might be reading Mumsnet though 😂

This cancer patient doesn’t feel remotely less to anyone and thoroughly objects to people pertaining to speak for me either way! The cancer arguments is the lowest of the low to score points against the RF. Not interested in them at all but you’ve pissed me off probably more than they ever have!

It wasn't me that started this argument, it was the national press calling me and thousands like me ( and you) "lesser mortals" due to having cancer while being non royal

Being told we are not good enough, or brave enough, or royal enough, and we don't work as hard.

This is the attitude that shocks me. People feel it is ok to say this on national tv or in national press. Editors are fine with it.

This is what tells me we need to get rid of this system. How can anyone in this day and age claim that royals are better human beings? How can anyone think this is normal and acceptable sentiments to echo in the national press and on TV? How do we get this horrible mentality out of our society?

Many of the traditions go back much further than the Victorians. Trooping of the colour dates back to the 1600s during the reign of King Charles ll, Order of the Garter dates back to 1348 during the reign of Edward III, Changing of the guard goes back to the 15th century, the beefeaters at the Tower of London to go back to 1485.

I love all the traditions in this country and the history behind them. You may find them embarrassing (can't think why) but many people don't and tourists love watching them.

They should also give back all of their unearned cash and stop getting taxpayer handouts beyond normal benefits. There’s a really funny book by Sue Townsend called Queen Camilla where that does happen.

FWIW though, the “lesser mortals” comment came from a random journalist and not from the royal family.

It was one journalist!

OP, your choice as long as your response is to remain silent and not boo.

Where I do not want God Save the King to be played is where a sports team or group represents England only. Just as the Welsh and Scots have their own anthems, so should England. I'd choose Jerusalem.

The clue is in the title Royal 'Highness'.

Higher than what, exactly? There's no real answer to that one which wouldn't lead to a similar conclusion to that of Allison Pearson.

(And that's leaving aside the ironic observation that Andrew, for one, is lower than a snake's underpass).

It really wasn't. Granted, not everyone uses such crass language as Allison Pearson, but the attitude is pervasive and is subtly (and not-so-subtly) conveyed in a wide varierty of ways.

And for heaven's sake don't touch one of them! As soon as the cameras stop rolling they'll be reaching for the swarfega.

'It wasn't me that started this argument, it was the national press calling me and thousands like me ( and you) "lesser mortals" due to having cancer while being non royal'

It quite literally is you who started this argument. It was one vapid journalist, not 'the meeja', looking for click bait. To use her stupid little article as a stick to beat the rf with is silly.

No-one (probably including the journalist) thinks anyone is 'lesser'. It was a column guaranteed to have people wailing and gnashing on social media. Years ago readers would have rolled their eyes, possibly muttered 'silly cow' under their breath and moved on, being minded not to read any more of the particular journalist's codswallop, but in today's era of the culture war it becomes necessary to take to the Internet and start a feeding frenzy. Good work.

I'm sure most people receiving treatment for cancer have more things to worry about than some piddling newspaper column, and indeed most wouldn't have been aware of the column without the social media furore surrounding it, would have been able to avoid reading that one journalist sees them (or probably doesn't) as 'lesser mortals' which may have made their day a little bit more challenging. But thank you for bringing it to wider attention and giving the hack who wrote it a bit more publicity.

Pretty sure after reading your post, Charles and Kate will take on board your advice and act upon it 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

But this isn’t just something which happens with the monarchy. It happens with the wealthy, with celebs, with other titled people. There’s lots of people who think they’re superior to us mere mortals, or are put on pedestals by the media, but at least the monarchy bring us money and respect by the work they do, unlike the other groups I’ve mentioned.

If you read what I wrote you can see I stated that 'much' of the Royal traditions originated recently. I am aware that some had earlier origins; there is nothing to stop us holding on to any that still have value. Many ex-monarchies do so.

But much of the current Royal pageantry - the display of wealth and power in military processions - is of recent origin. Quite apart from the enormous cost of each event (the Jubilee, funeral and coronation in quick succession - and an annual birthday celebration - with no regard for the cost to the public during the cost of living crisis) it just looks like a hangover from the past and a crass display of power which many tinpot dictatorships would envy.

Not to mention the Royals using the military for their own PR purposes, wearing ranks and medals they haven't earned.

So yes I stand by my statement that it is embarrassing. I don't want the country to be portrayed this way any more.

Surely the issue is the media's constant reference to them? H and M are happy in the US, and although still using royal titles are living their own life, but the tabloids report every wind breaking. The piece about " lesser mortals" is tasteless and offensive - crap journalism who should be kicked out. Not what you expect from the telegraph.
Noone is required to pay fealty or worship them.
Interesting how the far left are the most vehement in their hatred.
Prune down property (owned by the crown estate). The civil.list is greatly reduced from what it was. There is room for more trimming, but what do people want " pound stretcher royals? You busy one you get one free?

The RF will be here longer than all of us will be. So my forlorn hope is that George's generation will not be too bothered with all the razzmatazz and bullshit surrounding the RF and will open it up to fun and frolics and a lottery. Be King or Queen for a year, tickets £50, all donations to X and Y charities. Which will save them having to pretend to be caring and involved.

Could be fun and innovative and involve the public. Then the REAL Royals can feck off to Norfolk or Balmoral and get pissed as farts. The lottery monarch will then tell everyone how little they do, and there will be a Revolution. Cake will be supplied for the peasants outside the gate.

It’s basically just another UK bashing thread. There are certain sections of our society that hates our country and its history and would like nothing more than to get rid of the royals and re-write the history books. If they hate it so much why don’t they just go and move to Iran?