How do you think schools should punish children?

[MaryMaryVeryContrary]

A lot of ‘school refusal’ and problems in education is associated with poor behaviour from other pupils on here. Yet whenever a poster’s child is reprimanded they seem outraged and feel the teacher is picking on their DC for no reason. They often think the (perfectly reasonable sounding) punishment is too harsh, or their child should’ve had more warnings.

So I’m interested in how you think schools should actually discipline pupils, taking into account this also means your own DC?

They should start permanently excluding the very worst offenders. If you show that as a school you are willing to take the ultimate sanction then the 80% of ‘badly behaved’ kids who mess around as they know that they can get away with it would think on. And hopefully the children who cannot behave will be taken to a place where resources can be flung at to help them properly, rather than leaving them to sink or swim in the current environment.

I live in Scotland where schools have no scope to permanently exclude any child. Violence is absolutely through the roof and why not when nothing ever happens to the perpetrators. Where is the incentive to behave? There is a reason why the once great Scottish education system is rapidly disappearing down the plug hole and this is a big pet of it.

I think they should be able to exclude/expel peoples for repeated violence be they 15 years old or 7 years old frankly. Insolation work used actually be used more too.

The disruptive children should actually be placed together, if they continue to be disruptive then move to detentions, isolations and eventually again expelled.

As Part of detentions they should actually have to write why they did what they did, what they thought their actions would actually accomplish and reflect on it.

The problem is that the most vulnerable children end up excluded. 1 in 5 excluded children is adopted. Most of the rest have experienced trauma or have unmet (possibly unidentified) need. Then they are put together and tbh if you were in a building full of traumatised kids many of whom are easily triggered to violence, wouldn't you be tempted to truant? I would and I never skipped school as a kid! This means you end up with a sub section of society that are disengaged, disenfranchised and uneducated, which is a breeding ground for gang violence.
Trauma informed discipline strategies would be a good place to start, increased resources, and spending them in a way that has strong evidence of success (don't know what that would be!)

Bring back shaming and the ruler. Yes I'm serious.

I think the punishment that is currently dished our at DS school and my current work place is absolutely fine. They get 3 warnings, if they don't follow instructions they are removed from class to isolation. More serious infringements, like swearing or violence are automatic removals. I can't remember what warrants an exclusion from school but they do happen quite regularly. Luckily I don't have to deal with the students most of the time.

My biggest issue is the complaining parents who insist their little darlings haven't been warned before being removed 🙄 (most likely they bloody well weren't paying attention). They have in fact, some teachers are soft and give them extra chances.

I’d actually go as far as starting it in preschool tbh 🙃

I don’t care why your child is violent. My child is not your child’s punishing bag, chew toy or other.

How social services / school support those children should not be to the detriment of children just trying to get an education.

School should be able to say no to pupils. And send them home if needed.

There should be more spots for children needing special attention. Keep them away from making trouble.

Schools are falling apart because of rough children.

Also tangent. Send the nitty kids home fuck sake 😂

Letting those that want to leave ft education at 16 would probably help. It’s not as if they’re learning anything, just disrupting those that are trying to learn.

Our school has got quite tough, we now have a very big isolation room. The kids are sat well away from each other and are given lines to copy.

In fact the same lines each time. They are learning the GCSE English text. This has also taken the burden off the teachers to provide individual work for each student in isolation. Which is what they used to make them do. This actually feels like proper punishment to me.

My ds attends a small independent.

The rules are 1st instance of bullying, witness statements are taken in writing, but it is dealt with in house, parents are informed.

Second instance of bullying, more written statements are taken and parents are called in. It is explained very clearly to parents and child that this is their last chance. 1 or 2 day suspension.

3rd instance of bullying - more written statements are taken. Child is no longer welcome, no exceptions.

There is almost no bullying. In five years I know of only three occasions.

Any incidence of violence or threatening behaviour towards a teacher, or any child caught with drugs or a weapon, they are asked to leave immediately. Even vaping is rare. It is a happy and successful school.

@MumChp we have started doing that to, the really naughty one's are getting sent home. So it's an inconvenience to the parents.

They brought back after school detentions as well, so parents have to come and pick the kids up (we have a lot of buss at our school) it's then an inconvenience for the parents as well. The parents have complained but that's the point.

Totally can agree with this .

A lot of disruptive pupils are looked- after children or have SEN)ECHP and their parents defend some quite outrageous behaviour by finger -pointing the teacher for not doing XYZ. It is extremely difficult for schools to permanently exclude these children.

More Sen / Referral units too.

Th it s exactly. I don’t care about the child that is being violent. Not. My. Child’s. Problem. Well behaved children’s education and mental health should not be jeopardised by children with unmet mm needs being flung in mainstream schooling.

Plus if they see no consequences for children who swear, misbehave, refuse to work, walk out of the classroom , why should they behave?

A lot of disruptive pupils are looked- after children or have SEN)ECHP and their parents defend some quite outrageous behaviour by finger -pointing the teacher for not doing XYZ.

The first effort needs to be meeting the needs of those children who are just not coping, as opposed to actively misbehaving. The reality is if teachers did do XYZ, school would be a less challenging environment and those kids would cope better, reducing challenging behaviour. Provide proper support, with a range of alternative education provisions for kids who aren’t able to manage in a one size fits all mainstream setting. No amount of discipline will change ASD/ADHD or developmental trauma.

Then look at discipline within the school, focussed on those kids who are messing around.

My problem with the punishments is that they always involve being silent and sitting still.... detentions, isolations etc.

I think a lot of these kids are fizzing over with energy and anger and actually some form of punishment that involves physical exertion would be more useful.

I have no idea what form that would take in all honesty.... perhaps some sort of running drills or actual chores to do.

There's more than one issue with behaviour.

They would need different strategies to tackle.

I'm fine with the fairly typical ladder of warning, isolation, detention, suspension, exclusion

As long as the intensive support for SEN or really crap life is in place too.

I’m a little concerned about this ‘meeting the needs’ narrative, does it prepare children for adult life to teach them their every discomfort should be mitigated by those around them? Severe special needs notwithstanding obviously.

Military type drills for those fizzing with energy. 50 lap, 100 push ups.

can’t see parents going for that. And basket ball or football would be seen as a reward.

Also this. Would running laps be remotely tolerated on here?

So many children with mild ASD just need - and deserve - a calm mainstream schooling environment. It’s the constant disruption that they find overwhelming.