... to be over the moon that Trump has been found GUILTY on all 34 charges?

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Whoop whoop!

I really don't understand how anyone convicted of electoral fraud can be allowed to stand for election to public office in any jurisdiction.

We may have to get used to it.

Not so easy. You have to have many millions at your disposal to run for president. Election reform would probably lead to a wider field of candidates, but there doesn’t seem to be the impetus for it. I remember when I was a kid in the States, being President was seen as the ultimate ambition…now, not so much. That’s an interesting development.

@Nanaof1

"I condemn it from anyone. You don't have to like a candidate and heck, can even hate a candidate, but when you make threats, as has become commonplace over here, you need to be stopped before some nut job decides to get attention by fulfilling the threat."

But Trump's insistence that any election that goes against him is fixed, and that any court that rules against him is corrupt and illegitimate - saying it over and over again to his supporters, some of whom are right wing extremists and many of whom have been encouraged by believe in outrageous conspiracy theories about democrats. So, so dangerous.

@verdibird H Ross Perot spent a lot of money and (I thought looking from the UK) made a very good pitch for the job. He was similar to Trump in that he loathed government waste - which in turn made him distrustful of the military and the alphabet agencies.
Something I hadn't considered before the verdict is that in the US, a criminal record limits personal freedoms after a sentence is spent, probably half of the US electorate are close to someone in that situation. Many now identify strongly with Trump - they may not lend him their vote (if allowed to vote in their state) but they do understand the impact of passing through the US court system.

"He was similar to Trump in that he loathed government waste"

Is this code for 'he loved small government'?

You know - like the people behind the 2025 project who have plans to massively cut social security spending in order to fund enormous tax cuts for wealthy Americans?

You have to have many millions at your disposal to run for president

So true, @verdibird, and as said earlier I suspect the things they have to do to get it is one reason so many decent folk will go nowhere near politics

However hard it is I still think the Democrats are mad to have clung to Biden as their canidate though, since practically anyone else may have beaten Trump hollow and saved us all this farce

He was very much against Washington, its bloat and the way it granted greater freedoms to insiders than it did to ordinary Americans. Here, thirty years ago he was railing against the wealthiest being indulged at the expense of US workers:

Despite being up against George Bush Sr- who was weak and facing Bill Clinton who was at the peak of his powers of persuasion, he gained about a fifth of the national vote. I watched some of the old debates to find a good shortish clip - the quality of western politicians has dropped depressingly.

@baffld I remember Ross Perot and his flat task.

Yes, there are 2 million people in the USA behind bars, and I think 1/3rd have a criminal record. There are several states doing ‘clean slate’ laws for minor crimes as they affect one’s ability to get employement etc. Others are doing automatic expungement for instance for minor marijuana charges. Some of this was the legacy of ‘law and order’ governments in the past 20-30 years. Many people are in jail in the States for minor drug charges.

Ross Perot and his flat tax

Ross Perot founded EDS who used to pay employees and their families healthcare.

There are sound financial reasons for employers to fund employee healthcare in country where there is no provision of socialised healthcare. It's not an act of charitable largesse.

And flat taxes hugely benefit the wealthiest by redistributing the burden of taxation onto the middle classes.

Oh, I am under no illusion. But they did it in the UK too. I was impressed that this was one of the few cases of the whole kit and caboodle being shipped over. Usually with US imports, we get the bits the bosses like and somehow the good bits for the workers fall off over the Atlantic.

Amazon being a key example. Followed closely by all the parasitical outfits like Deliveroo, Uber, AirBnB and so on.

speyside · Yesterday 14:35

I repeat he never called to arms it was taken by the degenerates as they wished don't blame Trump for what they decided to do.

You can repeat it as often as you like and you'll still be wrong every time.

What on Earth do you think he did when he said “We fight like Hell and if you don’t fight like Hell, you’re not going to have a country any more.” ?

https://www.justsecurity.org/91904/dissecting-trumps-peacefully-and-patriotically-defense-of-the-january-6th-attack/

To the Proud Boys, ‘Stand back and stand by.’

He's done it again today, saying his followers won't be able to take anymore. He is being very careful to incite his maga loonies and intends to stand back and watch the fireworks

MAGA faithful call for riots and lynchings after Trump’s guilty verdict:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-guilty-riots-violence-b2554889.html

Trump on Truth Social, egging the mob on. You cannot reason with such collective psychosis.

Would my feeling that "lynching" has a different sense in the the US to UK be correct ?

@SerendipityJane - I don't think so, in both countries, to the best of my understanding, a lynching is an unlawful killing administered by a mob on someone they have decided is guilty without a trial.

Yes, that's what it means in the UK, as well. AFIK it is a term adopted from America.

I believe they invented it - Charles Lynch (1736–96), a Virginia planter who used it to deal with those loyal to the King. More recently applied to honour killings, the murder of civil rights workers and individuals.

I've broken the link as the image included is upsetting
https://www.britannica.com /topic/lynching
Statistics of reported lynching in the US indicate that, between 1882 and 1951, 4,730 persons were lynched, of whom 1,293 were white and 3,437 were black.

I blame the Republicans for not coming up with a sane, honest candidate who wanted to serve his country instead of a numbnut with dictator fantasies.
The Republican and Democrat parties used to have candidates that made you think about who you should choose because both had many good points. Now, it's more, "Ugh, who will destroy the country less?". I really think my country, like many people, has to hit rock bottom before it sees the error of its way.
Or, we'll end up like a third world country run by gangs with next to zero law and order and chaos.

In fact, neither party has offered a sane and honest candidate so I guess they want to see how low can they go?

Well I am still voting for Trump as is my entire family back home. We had four years of Trump and four years of Biden and I know which I prefer, if we’re being honest.

Honest question, @Bullpuckey: lots of us are concerned that Trump won’t ever leave once re-elected. Given that he’s told us that he wants to change the Constitution to remove term limits, I worry that he won’t ever leave and 2024 will be the last free and fair election. What is your take on this?

Given that he’s told us that he wants to change the Constitution to remove term limits, I worry that he won’t ever leave and 2024 will be the last free and fair election. What is your take on this?

I am not concerned about this. He’s close to 80 and I really doubt he’d stick it out for longer. He already looked very tired at his appearance at that MMA tournament the other day.

Although I wouldn’t be against the removal of term limits in theory, it was only put in after FDR’s three terms, since iirc two terms was always more of a gentlemen’s agreement in the first place.

BUT my preference is a two term limit since it kinda ends up handing power to the other team for a bit.