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... to be over the moon that Trump has been found GUILTY on all 34 charges?

692 replies

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 30/05/2024 22:11

Whoop whoop!

OP posts:
Thread gallery
35
Sleepydoor · 31/05/2024 14:04

Begsthequestion · 31/05/2024 13:50

It might be better than being a known sex offender in general population like Trump would be. But it would not be "good", you'd soon find yourself losing the plot a bit, no matter how many books they give you.

I'm very introverted, so I doubt this, but maybe I've already lost the plot. 🤑

Wallaw · 31/05/2024 14:07

WomensRightsRenegade · 31/05/2024 13:55

Any serious person who looked at the details of the charges and the trial would not be celebrating. Far from it. I can’t stand Trump but this is a very dangerous precedent. All those celebrating should be aware that it will massively backfire.

Every other agency of law and government (all anti-Trump) passed on this case as they thought it was absurd. The DA, Bragg, used ‘get Trump’ as part of his election campaign. No one has ever been charged with paying hush money EVER in NY, where soft on crime policies mean rapists and violent criminals go free every day.

It’s not illegal to pay hush money. Rich men have been doing it forever. There needed to be an underlying crime. And no one has specified what that was. The jury was given 4 different options to pick from. And Trump wasn’t told what they were until Wednesday. The defence didn’t get to speak last, and they hardly needed a prosecutor, the judge was so nakedly biased. The trial should never have been held in Manhattan, the most anti-Trump place in the US.

This trial would never have happened to anyone who wasn’t called Donald Trump, and would never have happened (just before the election) if Trump wasn’t a presidential nominee.

Rejoice all you want, but you’re not on the right side of anything here. Biden only escaped charges recently because he was labelled a ‘confused old man’. He showered with his pubescent daughter against her will, and has enriched his son and other family members to the tune of millions. A supine press has given him a free pass on everything - including his history (and v recent, some of it) of egregious racism. He is currently circumventing a ruling of the Supreme Court who told him he couldn’t wipe billions of dollars of student loans (pass them onto working class people).

The worst thing is that this has crossed a rubicon in a country already fatally and divided by a clearly senile Biden and his whipping up of hate towards people who don’t vote for him. Just the other week he told black graduates they had no chance of succeeding in America that white people hated them. EVERYTHING is about hate, division and cynical identity politics (see also ‘trans’ obsession and the elimination of women’s rights under Title IX - which I wonder how many UK women are even aware of)

Now watch and see Republicans think ‘fair’s fair’ and bring charges against Obama, Bill and Hillary for matters such as Afghanistan, deleted emails and so much more.

Only those with a very basic grasp of American politics (and that is most people in the UK) and those who can’t see past their own ‘orange man bad’ blind tribalism could be celebrating this.

I'm sorry, but almost eveything in your post is factually incorrect or is lifted verbatim from right wing spin media. The defense closing first is New York law, based on the theory that the burden of proof lies with the prosecution. The judge, who executed that law in a fair and impartial manner, is powerless to change it.

izimbra · 31/05/2024 14:10

@zoom1982 "My God,what a horrible thing to say. You'd deprive his innocent 18yr old son of his father just because you don't like him? Disgusting,and yes,unhinged."

Trump's son is a hugely privileged adult who very likely already spends very time under the same roof as his father.

Of course it's worth remembering - Trump is the politician who ramped up the policy of separating migrant children from their families at the border and who is planning mass internment and summary deportation of adults who were illegally bought to the US as very young children and who have lived almost their whole lives in America. Many of these migrants will have young children themselves who are US citizens. Obama gave them protection under the DACA programme, Trump wants them rounded up and deported.

(by the way - can we not rehash all the fake news claim made by Trump that Obama had exactly the same policy of family separation at the border? Some of us use fact checkers, and you should too).

FWIW - for those shrugging their shoulders about a Trump win, really suggest you do some reading about Project 2025, because it's terrifying. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025

Project 2025 - Wikipedia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025

Wallaw · 31/05/2024 14:21

@WomensRightsRenegade

There needed to be an underlying crime. And no one has specified what that was. The jury was given 4 different options to pick from. And Trump wasn’t told what they were until Wednesday.

And this one* *🙄
What are you even talking about?

The underlying crime was specified in the charging documents. That's what the entire trial was about. Trump knew exactly what he was charged with and what the counts were. The jury was not given 4 different options. That's just... made up?

I think it's possible you're too confused to even relay the Fox News lies accurately.

In case you'd like to read the jury instructions?
https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/29/politics/read-the-jury-instructions-from-judge-juan-merchan-in-the-trump-hush-money-trial/index.html

Maybe you're referring to this?
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/false-right-wing-reports-trump-trial-jury-instructions-fuel-threats-ju-rcna154678

izimbra · 31/05/2024 14:22

@WomensRightsRenegade "The trial should never have been held in Manhattan, the most anti-Trump place in the US."

Trump's defence team were able to select the jury out of hundreds of applicants. They employed the services of hugely skilled jury consultants to exclude anyone where they could find even a hint of anti-Trump bias in their social media feeds or under questioning.

And nearly 40% of votes in New York went to Trump in 2020, so the idea that it was silly to expect Trump to get a fair trial in a NY court is illogical. It only needed one juror to go against the opinions of the majority for Trump's trial to end in a hung jury or verdict of a mistrial.

speyside · 31/05/2024 14:30

I know all that but you don't think they all have something to hide - there are 34 charges against trump not just the 1 for the "legal bill" possibly the lady had her revenge to coin a phrase in court and what happened to the charges against Biden for storing files at his home - be good if that goes to court too
It's a witch hunt 34 charges - people in high places determined to oust him I wouldnt be surprised if this makes him more popular in america especially with the blue collar workers

izimbra · 31/05/2024 14:31

"Now watch and see Republicans think ‘fair’s fair’ and bring charges against Obama, Bill and Hillary for matters such as Afghanistan, deleted emails and so much more."

If they've broken the law they should be charged.

It's only Trump supporters who believe their leaders should be above the law.

zoom1982 · 31/05/2024 14:32

Thanks. The Atlantic wants me to sign up for a free trial which I don't want to do and NBC are the bunch who went utterly ballistic over the hiring of the former chair of the RNC so I won't bother myself with that either. 4/10 for effort though.

izimbra · 31/05/2024 14:35

speyside · 31/05/2024 14:30

I know all that but you don't think they all have something to hide - there are 34 charges against trump not just the 1 for the "legal bill" possibly the lady had her revenge to coin a phrase in court and what happened to the charges against Biden for storing files at his home - be good if that goes to court too
It's a witch hunt 34 charges - people in high places determined to oust him I wouldnt be surprised if this makes him more popular in america especially with the blue collar workers

It would be a 'witch hunt' if he was innocent of breaking the law and had been framed, or if evidence was fabricated. But he's not innocent and he got a fair trial.

Wallaw · 31/05/2024 14:35

zoom1982 · 31/05/2024 14:32

Thanks. The Atlantic wants me to sign up for a free trial which I don't want to do and NBC are the bunch who went utterly ballistic over the hiring of the former chair of the RNC so I won't bother myself with that either. 4/10 for effort though.

But whether you like the outlets or not, these are actual, provable, demonstrable facts. All of them. If you google around just a little, you'll find other primary sources corroborating them.

And The Atlantic gives you access to several free articles, so either you're accessing it a lot or you didn't click through properly.

Adding: you asked me for facts to back up my assertion. I provided them. You've decided to discount them because they don't fit your narrative. That's the whole problem right there.

Wallaw · 31/05/2024 14:37

speyside · 31/05/2024 14:30

I know all that but you don't think they all have something to hide - there are 34 charges against trump not just the 1 for the "legal bill" possibly the lady had her revenge to coin a phrase in court and what happened to the charges against Biden for storing files at his home - be good if that goes to court too
It's a witch hunt 34 charges - people in high places determined to oust him I wouldnt be surprised if this makes him more popular in america especially with the blue collar workers

The Trump-appointed special counsel, who Biden left in place despite the fact he could have gotten rid of him, investigated this thoroughly and found no crime. It's long, but I recommend a read through.

https://www.justice.gov/storage/report-from-special-counsel-robert-k-hur-february-2024.pdf

speyside · 31/05/2024 14:39

I respectfully democratically disagree a "witch hunt " exists when a person is being hounded by the law as he is, furthermore juries do not always get it right eg oj simpson
johnny depp in uk then innocent in america
all I can think of right now
its about law and how its interpreted

izimbra · 31/05/2024 14:43

@speyside

So if there has been one wrong verdict or conflicting verdict in any case ever, then we have to assume that Trump is innocent of the charges against him?

Not just Trump I assume, but anyone convicted by any US jury?

izimbra · 31/05/2024 14:45

No point arguing with Trump supporters.

They're not political supporters. They're cult followers.

Chatonette · 31/05/2024 14:46

speyside · 31/05/2024 14:30

I know all that but you don't think they all have something to hide - there are 34 charges against trump not just the 1 for the "legal bill" possibly the lady had her revenge to coin a phrase in court and what happened to the charges against Biden for storing files at his home - be good if that goes to court too
It's a witch hunt 34 charges - people in high places determined to oust him I wouldnt be surprised if this makes him more popular in america especially with the blue collar workers

It was discovered that Trump had classified documents offsite—he was given warnings to return them and refused. Documents were shown to Mar a Lago country club members as a way for Trump to show how important he is. His lawyers signed off that all documents had been returned—untrue. There is CCTV evidence in Mar a Lago of staff members moving the boxes around the site. They were instructed to lie. This all resulted in an FBI raid.

In light of this, and in an abundance of caution, both Joe Biden and Mike Pence VOLUNTARILY had officials come to their homes to help identify documents. Full access was given and some documents were found at both Biden’s and Pence’s locations. All documents were immediately given back. Full transparency. No lying/hiding/refusing to surrender the documents. Therefore, no FBI raids were required. And no criminal charges filed.

Jesus—does anyone follow WTF is actually going on? Or are we just listening to the “whataboutisms” on Fox News?

Biden and Pence complied. Trump did not.

Wallaw · 31/05/2024 14:48

@Chatonette

Jesus—does anyone follow WTF is actually going on? Or are we just listening to the “whataboutisms” on Fox News?

I think the answer to that question is pretty clear.

@izimbra

To be fair, the man does positively radiate goodness, positivity and moral rectitude

SerendipityJane · 31/05/2024 14:53

Chatonette · 31/05/2024 14:46

It was discovered that Trump had classified documents offsite—he was given warnings to return them and refused. Documents were shown to Mar a Lago country club members as a way for Trump to show how important he is. His lawyers signed off that all documents had been returned—untrue. There is CCTV evidence in Mar a Lago of staff members moving the boxes around the site. They were instructed to lie. This all resulted in an FBI raid.

In light of this, and in an abundance of caution, both Joe Biden and Mike Pence VOLUNTARILY had officials come to their homes to help identify documents. Full access was given and some documents were found at both Biden’s and Pence’s locations. All documents were immediately given back. Full transparency. No lying/hiding/refusing to surrender the documents. Therefore, no FBI raids were required. And no criminal charges filed.

Jesus—does anyone follow WTF is actually going on? Or are we just listening to the “whataboutisms” on Fox News?

Biden and Pence complied. Trump did not.

What I find interesting is how (some) UK observers are surprised at the culty nature of Trumpists. When we have our own home-grown-loonies who still think Boris Johnson walked on water and fed the 5,000 (admittedly probably his own offspring).

There is a wonderful scene from "Avenue 5" where a selection of such Darwin contenders manage to blow themselves out of an airlock. Leading to the equally wonderful quote (from Hugh Laurie) "We have just seen seven people stupid themselves to death"

LifeExperience · 31/05/2024 14:55

It will be overturned on appeal.

Chatonette · 31/05/2024 14:57

SerendipityJane · 31/05/2024 14:53

What I find interesting is how (some) UK observers are surprised at the culty nature of Trumpists. When we have our own home-grown-loonies who still think Boris Johnson walked on water and fed the 5,000 (admittedly probably his own offspring).

There is a wonderful scene from "Avenue 5" where a selection of such Darwin contenders manage to blow themselves out of an airlock. Leading to the equally wonderful quote (from Hugh Laurie) "We have just seen seven people stupid themselves to death"

Well, once we get our £350,000,000/week as promised now that we’ve left the EU, the NHS will be in tip-top shape.

izimbra · 31/05/2024 14:59

@Wallaw "To be fair, the man does positively radiate goodness, positivity and moral rectitude"

😂

He's literally planning to dismantle the civil service, put Trump ring kissers in office in every institution, and rule by executive order.

He's openly telling people that he plans to rule the USA as an autocrat and to dismantle the way it functions as a democracy.

For those people who don't know what Project 2025 is - you really, really need to get your head around it.

Chatonette · 31/05/2024 14:59

LifeExperience · 31/05/2024 14:55

It will be overturned on appeal.

All 34 separate verdicts? Surely at least one will stick, especially since his co-conspirator actually did jail time for this crime.

SerendipityJane · 31/05/2024 14:59

LifeExperience · 31/05/2024 14:55

It will be overturned on appeal.

Why ? Like Donald Trump I too have fuck all knowledge of the US legal system, and yet even I know that courts are really really really reluctant to overturn jury verdicts.

izimbra · 31/05/2024 15:04

@SerendipityJane "even I know that courts are really really really reluctant to overturn jury verdicts." especially when there is so much corroborating material evidence. They never would have bought Trump to trial without it.

Begsthequestion · 31/05/2024 15:11

Trump is only running for president to stay out of prison.

His team will long out the proceedings as much as possible to get past November, and if he's elected he then has a chance of keeping his freedom.

A lot can happen in a few months.