How is this ever going to be fair? (DH/ work/ house split)

[Giveupnow]

I feel in a right mess and don’t know how to get out. I am currently a SAHM but want to return to work, but I feel trapped that I won’t manage balancing children (currently 3.5, possible SEN, and 1.5) and the house.

i had a good career (doctor) which I put on hold to follow my husband abroad (stupid I know). Because of these extra skills he has acquired, he earns a good salary working very little hours (15-20 /week). It’s my belief he wouldn’t be paid this much without my career sacrifice/ support.

I found my job very stressful and difficult. Part time hours would be about 30/ week if I did 3 days. 5 days would be nearer 50 which I would struggle to manage with the children. Husband would earn 3 x what I would earn part time. I’d actually be working more hours than him but earning 1/3rd.

he is the type of man that does very little around the house and I doubt that will change. I don’t feel I can cope with doing 99% of house and children and go back to that stressful job, especially as eldest really struggles, she only does short days at the moment and has never done wrap around care etc as she wouldn’t cope. I just feel trapped.

if I ask for help, he will pretend for a bit but I think secretly feels as he earns so much he doesn’t need to do the household stuff. Cleaner wouldn’t help much because it’s the daily tidying etc that’s hardest to keep on top off.

Surely if he works so little you can easily return on a part time basis and he takes care of things when you work.

I can't agree that a cleaner wouldn't help much.

Financially you would be in a good position so get a cleaner, get rid of stuff if you have too many things that make your home messy.

Get into a system for meals and laundry. If your husband won't do any of these chores then don't do his laundry and cook his meals.

You could go back to work and drop your domestic standards so you did only what was necessary to care for yourself and your children. Then if your husband wanted a tidier home, he would need to make that happen. One of the reasons men are able to succeed in their careers is because they opt out of domestics, as yours has done. No reason why you can't take a leaf out of his book.

It doesn’t have to be all or nothing. I suggest that you wait another year as that will make everything a lot easier from a childcare point of view. In the meantime, can you start some kind of work or volunteering that would not entail the hours/demands but begin to get you back out there and accustom your DH to the ideal that you’re not there to be at the beck and call of the family!

For example:

Phlebotomist - they always seem desperate for them in my local area and you could do it with your eyes closed!

Medical helpline work

Vaccinating people

First Aid volunteering at events

In the longer term, could you move into a different area of medicine?

Hope that helps.

Can you use a childminder for some of the time so your dd isn't at daycare all of the time?

I also moved overseas for my dh's career so I know what you mean about feeling trapped. I think you are doing the right thing by going back to work. I didn't do that (I'm a teacher) and now I work part time and I'm really aware of how I bollocksed up my career. I felt vulnerable as an immigrant with no family support. Everything was so difficult as you have absolutely no background knowledge of how things work.

Sounds like you are in a pickle! Maybe jot some points down - pros and cons, why you want to go back to work etc. Hopefully this will start clarifying things for you. If you found your job stressful, is there any way of shifting in some way to change/reduce the stress, retrain?
Maybe try some volunteering for a bit, so you are doing something for you but can adapt as needed?
If you know your husband isn't going to pick up the shortfall with you being back at work, you have to make a plan that works for you, your children and your well being. If there is money to throw at it, do that ie housekeeper/nanny/cleaner.
There is no easy answer and with a child with suspected SEN, things will be tougher.
Hopefully your husband will get on board with helping more if he has shorter hours, but sometimes you need to get everything up and running first for them to slot into the gaps!
Good luck!

Go back parttime. 1) for your mental health 2) so you have some personal financial security.

Get your husband to pick up the slack or hire a cleaner/ part time nanny.

The housework is the least of your worries.
You are losing your valuable work skills and making yourself dependent on your husband.

Get the minimum hours job you can to retain those skills. I know a doctor who worked just one half day per week till her children started school.

Sorry - but a husband who thinks that housework/childcare are not his responsibility is not a team player or to be relied upon.

If you have a cleaner, it will free you up to do the daily tidying up.

Money and housework are to some extent interchangeable - there are people who can do your food shop, chop your veggies, etc. you could have a cleaner come in every day for two hours and do the dishwasher and the tidy up and run a load of laundry etc etc. it does take work to set up the system but it is totally worth it!

I definitely echo what the others say - go back even a day a week and it will give you so many more options. It will also make you push your husband a bit more and help reset his expectations a bit!

My set up has similarities with yours. We are a bit further along than you and I am still a SAHM. During school hours I fill my time with volunteering so I feel I am contributing and a hobby that challenges me intellectually and is social. It’s not what I expected but it takes the pressure off everyone. DC get what they need, which they wouldn’t, due to their specific needs, in wrap around care, I get time to do things I like, as does DH.

Especially with SN involved it is nice to have time to yourself to recharge and to have taken the family’s foot off the pedal a bit. Needing extra time to get things done (ie get a child ready in the morning, be there for a child when you’d otherwise drop and run) and needing time and space to deal with the extra stress SN brings is really useful. I still don’t feel good about the set up, but I think it is the right set up for us. I do call myself a carer rather than a SAHM though.

How about a part time housekeeper, my friend has one for five hours per day, four days a week and she does the cleaning, lots of cooking, shopping, changes the beds, etc etc?

With two decent incomes, get a cleaner in daily for 1-2 hours a day? Get her to do the laundry as well.

I went to get a degree from a very prestigious university as a mature student with children aged 5 and 3. Even though I was working part-time by that point, it still came as a shock to the family set up. That was almost years 10 ago. I now work full-time in a very well paid but incredibly stressful job. My husband thinks he does a lot around the house. I disagree (but learned to keep my opinion to myself). My advice to you if you decide to go part-time is to 1. wait until the youngest is 3 as they become less needy and can play with an older sibling at that stage 2. massively drop your house keeping and child rearing standards 3. get as much hired help as you can afford. In a perfect world, a woman would have 3 lives: one for herself, one for family, and one for work. That's not possible. You might have to accept you children won't have perfect table manners, won't be eating home made food very often and the dining table will be dirty until 1 minute before dinner is served. There will be mess on the floor and you will keep buying socks because it will be more efficient use of your time that pairing the old ones. Family harmony is the most precious gift you can give to your children. Something will have to give and I hope your job won't come at the expense of your divorce. I suspect your husband isn't going to change. However, you can instill good habits into your children so you don't end up the house maid once they are older. I hope it helps

I am reading all of the replies, thank you.
to those saying “your husband should pick up the slack” that’s the specific point of this thread and the issue.

If ask him to contribute say 50% of the household, but he is contributing 3 x the wages, he will say that’s unfair. But Even working part time (eg 3 days /30 hours) I don’t feel I can manage to do all more than say 2/3rds of the house stuff as I’ll just be flat out. The point is, he isn’t really a team player mainly because he thinks he does way more than he does, and other than divorce or not going back to work, how do I navigate this?

Getting a cleaner will help because at least once a week the house will be in a cleaner state than it would otherwise be. The way to get him to pull his weight more is make him responsible for things he will notice. No point in making him responsible for the skirting boards but if he washes his own clothes he will soon notice if they are not done.

All men think they do a lot a more than they actually do (as they don't see half the work women do just as women often fail to notice their contributions). I have been married for over 25 years and I learned to appreciate Confucious' saying "Change what you can change, accept what you cannot change and be wise enough to know the difference between the two".

I do think regardless of how much you earn in your job it's important for your own self-worth and identity to have something that you do too (and also as insurance for if something goes tits-up with your DH, not just death or divorce but job loss, ill health etc). Also as you are a doctor, presumably some investment in time now at a lower wage may well pay itself back many times over once you reach consultant and/or can build a private practice, plus pension investment considerations etc?

Where abroad are you (just rough area not precise location) - if middle east or Asia I definitely would be taking advantage of any local custom for plentiful/extensive domestic help to get back to work. Even somewhere where the culture is that cleaners only clean, not tidy as well then I still would try and get back to work with some form of paid for assistance, yes maybe all your problems can't be solved that way but some of them can be - if your husband really is going to do 0 to help practically he can still throw some of his money at the problem, as a PP said £££ can solve so many things if you're prepared to spend a lot of it, e.g. a nanny for the children, a housekeeper, a professional sorting/decluttering service, a meals service, a laundry service, gardener (although maybe when he sees how much these things cost he might reevaluate his thought on doing nothing at all around the house, you have to stand firm though that these are shared problems not your problems). It really would be a shame to waste 6-10 years + of medical education in order to tidy toys away? Particularly when you have a DH that earns well and works flexibly which really sounds like the dream combo in terms of being able to support your career as well as you supporting his in terms of where you live etc.

What kind of medical work would you be able to pick up where you are - anything career enhancing or would it just be ticking yourself over until you can get back into training? When do you plan to get back to the UK - or never?

It is irrelevant that he earns more if you are both working FT. Any attempt to use that as leverage to do less within the family is sheer selfishness and abuse. It's just bloody good luck for him that he's well paid.

I would not think myself remotely superior to a spouse that earns less than I do, or someone who works FT within an industry that has lower salaries. That's just an ego trip.

It's not clear if you want to go back FT or not given the ages of your children and possible SEN issues. Irrespective of whether PT or FT it's time to sit down with your husband and tell him you want to go back to work for X days a week and how are you BOTH going to make it work. That you've followed him to X country [and back] and it's now time to restart your career for which you had many hard years training for. It is IRRELEVANT if it is paid 1/3rd of his.

There are financial options to outsource cleaning, childcare etc but as you've pointed out your daughter may need either more personal care in the form of a PT nanny or trained childcare worker, or more one to one arrangements.

Your DH's response will tell you everything you need to know.

Hey @Giveupnow it’s irrelevant what you earn and what he earns. I’m staggered at all the replies coming up with convoluted ways for you to somehow find solutions to what isn’t the problem, completely missing the point! @TreadSoftlyOnMyDreams is right. It’s also yet again the bar is set so low for men and what’s expected of them.

does he not see the children as equally his, or the marriage as a partnership? I find it so hard to find the right way to phrase these things to get through to some men and some women that it’s somehow not his job.

There’s a book called Equal Partners by Kate Mangino that might be helpful, but I think both parties have to be willing to make the parenting and marriage equal to even read it.

I hope others will come on with more practical suggestions of their own experiences. Could you remind him that men who do more housework get more sex?!

The thing about his having more money therefore you should do the shitwork, regardless of actual hours worked outside the home - does this mean he imagines his wages are buying your labour? You are his paid domestic help? His live-in nanny / housekeeper / PA? Is that how he sees it?

If so then you need a contact, and you're entitled to sick pay, holiday pay, pension contributions, bank holidays off. Fixed hours. It's workplace sexual harassment if he touches you while you are working.

Time isn't equivalent to money when it comes to family life. Just because he earns more doesn't mean he shouldn't support his wife and family. I'd recommend having a read of the Fair Play book. And rather than focus on who does what you could explore how to make equal leisure time. If he doesn't do much at all right now it sounds like he has a lot of leisure time and you don't and that needs to change. I would look at spending some of those earnings on outside help but fundamentally he needs to step up and be a partner and the Fair Play book explored strategies towards this.

Yes Fair Play book and cards probably better than Kate Mangino book that is overly academic

he is the type of man that does very little around the house and I doubt that will change.

This is your problem, not returning to work or disparity in earnings.

Fundamentally, he doesn't respect you, OP.

If you don't want to get divorced, I'm not sure how you can really fix this. You can try talking to him, but if he holds deeply sexist views about your respective roles and responsibilities, I doubt that he will be open to changing his position. He sees himself as the provider and as far as he is concerned, that lets him off the hook for everything else. But of course, talking to him again is always worth a try.

With a husband like this, I think it's very important for you to go back to work and maintain your independence as much as you possibly can. You'll have to just let your standards slide in the house, it doesn't really matter if it's messy. Pay for a cleaner and good quality childcare, buy in as much help as you possibly can. And stop doing any "wifework" for your husband, just focus on essentials for you and the dc.

When the children are a little older prepare to return to work two days per week and expect that your DH will help a lot on those two days - child care routines, cooking, shopping.

Employ a cleaner for half a day when you are home and ask them to clean bathrooms and kitchen and help with laundry.