How is this ever going to be fair? (DH/ work/ house split)

[Giveupnow]

I feel in a right mess and don’t know how to get out. I am currently a SAHM but want to return to work, but I feel trapped that I won’t manage balancing children (currently 3.5, possible SEN, and 1.5) and the house.

i had a good career (doctor) which I put on hold to follow my husband abroad (stupid I know). Because of these extra skills he has acquired, he earns a good salary working very little hours (15-20 /week). It’s my belief he wouldn’t be paid this much without my career sacrifice/ support.

I found my job very stressful and difficult. Part time hours would be about 30/ week if I did 3 days. 5 days would be nearer 50 which I would struggle to manage with the children. Husband would earn 3 x what I would earn part time. I’d actually be working more hours than him but earning 1/3rd.

he is the type of man that does very little around the house and I doubt that will change. I don’t feel I can cope with doing 99% of house and children and go back to that stressful job, especially as eldest really struggles, she only does short days at the moment and has never done wrap around care etc as she wouldn’t cope. I just feel trapped.

if I ask for help, he will pretend for a bit but I think secretly feels as he earns so much he doesn’t need to do the household stuff. Cleaner wouldn’t help much because it’s the daily tidying etc that’s hardest to keep on top off.

I was going to suggest the same.

Have a conversation with your DH where you openly discuss the input he has domestically and how what he currently does isn't sufficient to maintain existing standards.
Your choice, as a family, is to either (a) get a housekeeper or (b) he picks up more slack.
I'd say (a) is better for domestic harmony.

I wonder if it would help to put on the table a plan that you start to work the same as he does (in terms of time (2-3 days), so there is no longer the whole ‘SAHP should do more/all of the work’. If you have the same workload outside the home, that is a very strong argument to have parity within the home. So you can draw up a schedule of tasks roles that you will both do, in terms of house / childcare - and make sure that they are equal. If he wants to ‘buy’ himself out of any tasks then he can always work more, and pay for a housekeeper multiple times a week.

Okay, so your problem is that your DH is not going to change or even see your point of view from what I can tell. Which means you have to take control. I have a friend in a sort of similar situation - she has 100% completely accepted that he's useless and focuses on what, to her, are the upsides - she likes that she doesn't have to negotiate or discuss anything to do with the DC or the house, it's all on her but also he gets no say. Similarly, while he earns a lot, she gets a lot of say over how finances are allocated - eg deciding on private school for the one DC who is struggling or holidays budgets or whatever plus all the daily stuff.

So, if you can accept a similar pro/con mindset with your DH, you can make this work.

If you want to go back to work, that's fine and entirely up to you. But you 100% have to get the help in as he won't do it. I'd be looking at some kind of houseckeeper/cleaner who comes in for a few hours every day to keep on top of cleaning, tidying, laundry, ironing etc. Can also do many of the household chores like shopping or post office runs or whatever it is that week.

Also, as a doctor, your choices are more than just going back to being a GP. Research (scientific research or even business related to medical stuff) or a slight retrain to something less patient focused.

The only thing you can do if he refuses is to discount him and decide what you're capable of by yourself, and what your priorities are. Many women have careers and run homes alone, but given they have only 24 hours in their days, are obviously cutting back on or out sourcing some of the domestic stuff they'd do if they SAH. Clearly they think that's worth it for all the benefits their career brings. Only you can decide if its worth it for you. Because I agree with you, that for all the talk of what your H 'should' do, you are powerless to force him, and your only option would be to leave him. In which case you'd still have to do everything yourself, but without the benefit of his income.

Money earnt is irrelevant, its all about hours.

As he only works 15-20 hours a week, he should be doing 50% of the housework and childcare too.

Could you get a cleaner for an hour every day or every other day if its general tidying you need rather than a deeper clean less often.

Is it even possible for you to work as a doctor where you are?

I would say that earnings and domestic work need to be separated out. The domestic work has to be done by you, him or a third party. If he is saying that he doesn’t want to do it, he needs to pay someone else to do his share. Effectively that is what he is currently doing with you, but you are completely free to decide you no longer want the job (perhaps because you want to work as a doctor instead!) He therefore needs to either do it or outsource it to someone else (eg a housekeeper).

His attitude is very problematic though. He seems to believe that because he earns a lot, he owns you and you have no right to a preference. I’m concerned that you are in a foreign country and completely dependent on him. Are you considering returning to the UK at any point?

He’s confusing income and responsibilities here, both of you will be working so the home responsibilities need to be evenly split between u both.
was his mum a sahm? Asking as my husband Used to have similar ideas about who should do ‘house ‘ work (even though I earned more than him , it’s actually still my job to sort out the house, probably because I’m female 🤣)
took at least a year almost of constant discussions to slowly change his mindset

YANBU to feel trapped. Are finances joint? Would he pay for a cleaner and nanny? I think you should be free to pursue your career as well. He doesn’t have to do day to day cleaning and child care if he doesn’t want to, but he can’t be a hypocrite and demand you do it if you also want to pursue a career.

I don’t agree that this is due to women setting some invisible bar too low for men. It is just a fact that not all men will even come close to the bar and only a handful ever exceed it.

Housekeeper?

I voted YABU, because I think you've already persuaded yourself (probably because your husband has been doing this for a while now) that he won't do anything or his fair share.

You need to take responsibility for changing the balance here, as he's obviously on to a good thing.

As PP have said, how much either of you earns is not relevant in this discussion. You're a partnership, so you share the jobs.

He won't like it, of course, but you are going to have to stand your ground.

Can you see a life with your husband in the future? What do you want your life to look like for your self and your children? It seems to be a fundamental difference in values and attitudes really, does he want to work to come nearer your expectations. Do you have good times as a family?

I agree with others - time doesn’t equal money when it comes to a family household.

The person who earns more money from their paid work can’t say “well I get more free/ leisure time that you, because my working hours are paid more” - that’s not fair at all.

As a family you both need equal access to money and equal fully free time - and you work back from there!

I would go back at least part-time.

If he thinks his money can buy him out of doing the domestic tasks, he needs to spend it on housekeeping services, not expect you to just pick them up!

If you work 30h a week that might be considered PT by doctors but it's FT according to the UK government. If your DH only works 15h a week (that's just 2 days) then he can look after the DC the other three days when you are working. Might be the best arrangement for a child with SEN anyway.

Get as much paid help in as possible, do not get dragged into a discussion about your DH earning too much to do housework, if he suggests that just keep telling him the work needs to be done so either he does it or he finds and pays for someone else to do it because you are working longer hours than him and so don't have the time anymore. A cleaner, an ironing lady, a gardener, a window cleaner, a daily housekeeper, a nanny will all make a massive difference. Also, something like hellofresh for food might be an idea unless where you are living means you can afford a cook.

I think this approach is the surest way and quickest way to divorce and 50/50 custody. You can't dictate to a man, never mind a successful doctor. I am not saying his attitude is fair however it doesn't look likely it's going to change. I think OP should go down the route "Help me feel fulfilled in my life" based on the type she's got for a husband

Doctor here. This sounds tough. what qualifications/experience do you have? I'd have you CCT'd/ what area would you want to work in?

Regardless there are always locum shifts going. Could you try and get on the bank / with a local agency and see what's available, maybe starting with one of two shifts every few weeks at first? Less of a commitment and you could do fewer hours than 0.6 which is generally the lowest people go otherwise. It would give you a dip back into the system although I genuinely don't know how viable it is after some time out. There is support available for those going back to clinical work after some time away for sure.

Good luck and I'm sorry things are so stressful

This, about the pickle.
You have got earning potential, use it.
I'd rather do it alone and outsource help than have your dickhead of a husband at home.
You would be happier and wouldn't have to "drop your standards".
It's husbands and partners who can destroy our earning abilities, not children, even these with SENs.

If he only works 20 hours a week, what on earth is he doing the rest of the time? If he is out (golf, pub, whatever) then I’d question what he brings to the relationship other than money and domestic enslavement for you. If he’s home, then he will be contributing to making a mess and leaving it all to you to sort out? Unacceptable.

I wouldn’t put up with it OP. I would see if you can go back to work two days a week this year building to three next year. I’d employ a well paid cleaner twice a week for 2 or 3 hours each time - cleaner can learn to tidy, do laundry, and the extra tasks like cleaning the fridge or the oven, descaling the kettle, watering the garden or whatever!

you deserve a chance to use your skills.

It's husbands and partners who can destroy our earning abilities, not children, even these with SENs.

This. I have several colleagues with children with SEN. They all work PT, as does the other parent, so they can share the work and childcare. Better for them, better for their kids.

Your DH works 15 to 20 hours a week and must earn shit loads if he earns significantly more than a doctor.

You should be laughing- he has time and money , most ppl don't get both, some are lucky to get one. You shouldn't be tearing yourself up in this situation, you should easily be able to go back to work part time.

You say divorce isn't an option but I don't know why not when you are with someone who has all the means to make his wife comfortable and fulfilled but is willing to see you struggle. I guess if you're not prepared to divorce, throw shit lots of money at the problem and buy in help.

But definitely go back to work in whatever capacity you can. This man seems to only care for himself.

You should return 3 days a week as if things go wrong, you'll then have a career to keep you going. Having a career is also good for your sanity when you have kids!

Hire a cleaner for a twice weekly clean, and be assertive with your DH. TELL him that the childcare and household stuff will need dividing equally, if not more on him as he works fewer hours. If he disagrees then show him the door.

My DH now does a lot more as he seemed to think his bigger financial contribution meant I'd do everything else. I told him I was his wife, not his mother, and that he needed to pull his weight, and that my role was not to wait on him hand and foot like his mum did! He's still a rubbish husband but at least it feels more like a partnership.

he is the type of man that does very little around the house

He does this because he can get away with it because you're allowing it.

Where does he think meals and clean clothes come from? I'd read him the riot act.

I was in a similar situation with my DH. Not as he didn't want to split the domestic work but because I had to take on a load of the mental load.

i think it's essential you go back to work and outsource as much as you can. You are doing different roles and unfortunately equal work does not mean equal pay.

After years of feeling similar to you, I realised we are a team and there are some things he does better than me and some things I do better than him.

You need to feel a part of a team, which you are not at the moment.

Are you still abroad?

If you’re in the UK, what’s your medical speciality? If you’re a GP there may be some scope for negotiating some very flexible hours - some regions are so desperate for staff they will agree eg a school hours only two days a week post for a salaried GP. However I’m guessing you’re a hospital speciality?

What specialty are you and where abouts are you in your training? How long since you last worked? Will you need to do a return to work programme? Are you looking to get back onto a training scheme?

You appear to have married someone who doesn't care about your career as long as his own needs are met

You have a few options:

1. Leave (but doesn't sound like that's what you're asking)
2. Drop your standards so that you don't need to do a lot, and he can pick up extra domestic chores himself if he doesn't like it
3. Outsource everything you possibly can that you're currently responsible for. If your wages are just going to be a bonus in the pot rather than needed for living costs, you can afford to do this. You should still have access to whatever family money you currently access, but make sure this stays the case
4. Don't go back to work on a contract, but pick up as hoc locum shifts. Have you got the confidence to hit the ground running clinically after some time out?

I would do a combination of 2 and 3.