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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be really, really pleased about the explicit ban on the proactive teaching of gender identity?

291 replies

BiologicsBeforeIdeology · 16/05/2024 13:35

It's just such madness that we even got here. My family has been badly affected by activists pushing this madness on my Autistic son, who now half believes he's a girl because some nitwit came into the school and told him people who feel uncomfortable and like they don't belong are trans (not maybe gay, not maybe Autistic, not maybe just Puberty, but trans)

I won't apologise for wanting to safeguard children. This is not a Section 28 thing, it really is protecting vulnerable kids.

"Gender identity
The guidance will introduce an explicit ban on the proactive teaching of gender identity. It will say that the idea that children can change their gender by using different names, pronouns and wearing the uniform of the opposite sex is highly contested. If pressed by pupils, they should instead focus on the facts of biological sex.
Teaching children about gender identity could lead to them questioning their own gender when they may not have done otherwise, the guidance will suggest. Children can be taught the law about gender reassignment — that people can legally change their gender from the age of 18 — but children will be told that that they cannot legally be classified as members of the opposite sex."

More info on the changes https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/4a2b0d57-13c9-409a-a40b-104d7a0499b2?shareToken=ed46490f36a6c9fbb0f70d6bf03c0a99

What the new sex education guidelines mean for schools and parents

The changes will ban teaching about gender identity and set out what children should be taught at each age

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/4a2b0d57-13c9-409a-a40b-104d7a0499b2?shareToken=ed46490f36a6c9fbb0f70d6bf03c0a99

OP posts:
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Leah5678 · 16/05/2024 17:04

I really feel for all the kids who feel for this bs at its 2015-2023 peak. It's too late for so many but thank god it finally happened

BiologicsBeforeIdeology · 16/05/2024 17:05

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 16/05/2024 17:01

The other issue, relating to GI, is that teacher training and the teaching unions are so decidedly GI, that they publicly have stated (in the press and in communication with their members) that unless the guidance around GI is statutory, they will just ignore it.

Following from the Cass report, I can see that the only way to ensure that schools must comply, is to ban it.

If the schools/unions had been willing to discuss, and plot a reasonable path, rather than demanding that GI is the one true way, I suspect this would have been different.

very good point.

OP posts:
Rainbowshit · 16/05/2024 17:07

Great news. Gender lunacy should not be being taught as fact.

Just a shame it won't apply in Scotland too.

PrancerandDancer · 16/05/2024 17:10

GrammarTeacher · 16/05/2024 13:45

And the age related limits are going to make so many things a whole lot worse.

I agree, I think this is huge step back.

Not teaching about contraception until year 9 is really concerning.

Just read this guide https://schoolsweek.co.uk/new-sex-education-guidance-proposals-what-schools-need-to-know/

And so many of these "not until this age" are really misjudged. I run a youth group and the infant and juniors are already picking things up from siblings and online.

But hey ho, trans chat will get banned so that's the main thing eh?

Sex education guidance changes: What schools need to know

Age limits on 'sensitive' topics and a ban on teaching about gender identity set out in DfE consultation

https://schoolsweek.co.uk/new-sex-education-guidance-proposals-what-schools-need-to-know

SingleSexSafeSpace · 16/05/2024 17:15

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SingleSexSafeSpace · 16/05/2024 17:15

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fiftyandfat · 16/05/2024 17:16

The link from fairplayforwomen is about changing rooms, but I doubt whether mixed sex toilets in secondary schools are likely to be safer.

SingleSexSafeSpace · 16/05/2024 17:17

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WallaceinAnderland · 16/05/2024 17:25

If little Jimmy in Year 2 comes into school talking about how he plays GTA with his teenage brother or Sally in Y1 has been watching YouTube clips from Five Nights at Freddie’s, I think the teachers need to be able to discuss this with their class.

Thankfully teachers are not in the habit of terrifying their 5-7 year old pupils.

Tosstyhat · 16/05/2024 17:28

I would encourage everyone to have their say in the consultation. It really makes clear how bonkers some of the new changes are. I'm inclined to think that some of it was thought up by people who've never spoken to a child. E.g no teaching on domestic abuse until year 9 because children younger than this are unlikely to understand it. Do they think that 11 year olds are babies?

Confusionn · 16/05/2024 17:32

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Tosstyhat · 16/05/2024 17:33

Also, as someone raised earlier, it does state no teaching on contraception/STIs until year 9. Unfortunately, at a school I previously worked at, there were several sexually active Year 7s that the safeguarding team were aware of. Some of the new guidance is incredibly out of touch with reality.

The consultation really breaks down which topics are for which ages if anyone is unsure.

IdgieThreadgoodeIsMyHeroine · 16/05/2024 17:55

This is excellent news, but this line from the article really pissed me off:

"Teachers will also be banned from giving children lessons about gender identity — the idea that children can adopt different pronouns, names and uniforms of the opposite sex."

Biological sex should have nothing to do with what uniform a child wears! Girls wearing trousers and boys wearing skirts is freedom of expression, it is NOT gender ideology.

Sleepysendco · 16/05/2024 18:02

My 7 year old says she wants to be a boy because she doesn’t want people thinking she’s cute. She hates pink and loves sport, especially football. I tell her that boys and girls can like whatever they want. The only difference between being a boy or a girl is their “bits” - so unless she wants to use the stinky boys toilets, she could just be a girl that likes football.

other parents I know have said “oh you want to be a boy? Ok, we’ll tell the school you want to be called bob now”.

It scares me what well meaning, loving parents are doing to their children.

scarletbegoniass · 16/05/2024 18:08

Blonkets · 16/05/2024 13:53

I agree but I would like a broader look at teachers and schools peddling ideology to kids. Eg critical race theory. I’d like to know how it happened that schools felt they can do this.

I would also love it if schools were not allowed to use the curriculum for their hobbyhorses, particularly English lit, which often seems to be entirely focused on political or social messages.

What do you mean exactly by social or political messages? The fact is, literary texts are informed by their context, contexts of sex, race, relationships etc included.

It’d be difficult to ignore William Blake’s views on religion and institutions; it’s impossible to discuss The Handmaid’s Tale without conversations around feminism and the rise of the new right in 1980s America. Even more ambiguously, plenty of Shakespeare’s female characters acted somewhat subversively – is discussing that pushing a political message?

How exactly do you propose teaching literary texts without an awareness of their political contexts?

JacketPotatoFoodOfTheGods · 16/05/2024 18:13

Completely agree.

JoleneTookHerMan · 16/05/2024 18:19

Beowulfa · 16/05/2024 13:43

I would like children to be reassured that it is completely normal to resent the changes puberty brings, and to feel uncomfortable in your body. This seems to have been lost in the rush to label everyone.

Thanks for this.
I'm having a sex ed/puberty chat with my eldest (11) at weekend and this is definitely something I want to bring up with her.

PurpleBugz · 16/05/2024 18:48

This is great news.

I've been following the content of PSHE lessons for a while and some of what has been shown to primary aged children is outright pornagraphic. Im talking drawing of adventurous sex positions talk of oral sex and promoting masturbation. (Nothing wrong with teaching masturbation is normal and fine in private etc but I've read things encouraging primary aged kids to try it)

The pants rule is taught from reception and I feel this covers what kids need to know at such young ages. The way to tackle the sexual abuse of young children is not to teach them explicit sexual details it's tackle social attitudes and put better safeguarding in place such as this guidance

WickerMam · 16/05/2024 18:49

I think it is good to put guidance in place about what is taught to children, without diluting any message about inclusion and acceptance.

But for young children, the message of "you get lots of different types of families" is as much as they need, IMO.

My 7yo actually came home from school last week with the brand new information - from his teacher, apparently - that "you get people with a woman's head and a man's body, who are called a he-she". God knows what the teacher actually said! But they are just too young to understand properly at that age.

CranfordScones · 16/05/2024 19:01

Now let's put a stop to the money the Civil Service and other public bodies pay to outside organisations to hector staff with this unsubstantiated and highly contested idology.

SoreAndTired1 · 16/05/2024 19:08

WickerMam · 16/05/2024 18:49

I think it is good to put guidance in place about what is taught to children, without diluting any message about inclusion and acceptance.

But for young children, the message of "you get lots of different types of families" is as much as they need, IMO.

My 7yo actually came home from school last week with the brand new information - from his teacher, apparently - that "you get people with a woman's head and a man's body, who are called a he-she". God knows what the teacher actually said! But they are just too young to understand properly at that age.

@WickerMam I would actually go speak with the teacher and ask them exactly why they said to the class. Because this is concerning, and I'd be demanding to know what was said.

zaffa · 16/05/2024 19:31

LilyBartsHatShop · 16/05/2024 14:59

@SwordToFlamethrower I may be misunderstanding what Taylor is saying but I'm chilled to the bone by the suggestion that the way to help a nine or ten year old girl who is being sexually abused is to provide her with explicit sex ed.

If you don't teach her sex Ed how does she know she's being sexually abused? How does she find the words to tell a trusted adult at school?

littlekittyhoward · 16/05/2024 19:59

FrancescaContini · 16/05/2024 13:53

I don’t think it’s helpful for children to dwell on any potential discomfort during this phase of life. I don’t remember a single friend saying during teenage years that he or she felt “uncomfortable in their body” or similar. Puberty needs to be “re-normalised”, and adults need to encourage adolescents to stop navel gazing on social media and get busy with activities that take them away from negative thoughts and focus instead on enjoying themselves - sports or music or cooking or just taking a dog for a walk.

I would add adults need to stop doing this too - lead by example. The pathological treatment of menopause and pregnancy in our society has gone much too far and encourages this navel gazing for teens and puberty. Normal life events do not need to be treated like medical problems.

WallaceinAnderland · 16/05/2024 20:01

If you don't teach her sex Ed how does she know she's being sexually abused? How does she find the words to tell a trusted adult at school?

Abuse of a child is not sex that they need to be educated about. So many people get this wrong.

Sex education will cover relationships and reproduction between consenting adults and older teens.

It will be irrelevant to 7 year old experiencing sexual abuse.

This is why abuse is covered separately to sex education, in an age appropriate way, and always has been. No one has suggested that this will not be continued. Young children will still be taught the PANTS rule, who to tell and how to tell.