Sorry, not sorry, but wfh really is much easier

[Jeannie88]

I know it's become the norm, especially post covid, but do those who wfh realise how much easier their lives are?

Sorry, but I have found it a bit pathetic and embarrassing that there has been a big defiance of 'going into office' once a fortnight to be such an horrific ordeal?

Don't you all realise how fortunate you are? No commute, time at home to do things those of us have to do after a day of being on our feet, all frontline and retail etc then look after our children?

Sp my point from.personal experience. We are a group of 6 friends (f) and go out regularly together. When we have been to midweek gigs, comedy nights, meal, the 4 who wfh joke how they can roll out of bed and be online within minutes to show present, then have breakfast and just work at their own pace and even during teams meeting they can sit back and contribute what they have to.

Then, the 2 of us who have to get up at 6am, dress for work, ready to drive so sensible of alcohol intake the night before and buy ourselves soft drinks in rounds or even drive and give lifts. Then do a full intensive day with full on human interaction and check e mails on the evening when we get the time to do so.

Of course childcare issues come into this. We who don't wfh have to take our DC to breakfast club or childminder then go on to work, the 3 of the 4 who have DC drop them off at school and rush back having been seen to log on early but not really working as getting them ready.

Ok so my observation and opinions based on this. I guess all the moaning on MN about having to go into the office (which really isn't so hard is it?) had incited me to raise this point.

Oh and I do have DP who wfh and he totally agrees with me. He's hardworking and doesn't do the slob thing, but agrees, in his own words. 'It's a piece of piss compared to going to the office and even that was so easy compared to your job'.

So please those who have the privilege of wfh stop moaning! Honestly, how would the world work if everyone wfh? It wouldn't.

@IcedPurple just to add, I actually don't co-exist with people I don't get on with, outside of work when it's unavoidable (eg on projects where we have no choice on who is there). Do you actively spend time with people you don't want to when you're not being paid to be in that room/call? Why?

My point wasn't about what you do outside of work. My point was that at work, you don't get to choose who you 'coexist' with. And sometimes informal interaction, which can't be replicated on Zoom calls, is helpful in a workplace, however bothersome it might be to some people here. Your colleagues may not be desperate to 'coexist' with you either, but they may sometimes find it useful to discuss work related matters with you or others away from Teams meetings.

But remote work does in fact provide many people with more choice about who they 'co-exist' with.

And sure, informal interaction in workplaces that can't be replicated on zoom is helpful to some people sometimes. Of course. The problem comes when we fail to recognise that not everyone finds it helpful, that sometimes it's actively detrimental, and that the experience of being physically present in a workplace is much worse for some than others. Often because of wider or structural factors that may not be anything much to do with the role itself, such as neurodivergence, disability or structural racism.

Exactly

I can't go unavailable unless I am on my lunch or break as calls come through automatically

Screens are recorded, phones are recorded, stats are recorded and reported. Whether I sit in the office or at home
If I'm unavailable or go over my allocated break I would have my manager on the phone asking where I am

And they have that opportunity on my office days, if theirs match up. We still do some in person meetings. When a project requires it we have "drop in" sessions for them to come and ask questions. And we give them the option to do these things in person or via teams.

But why do I need to be forced to constantly be in a room with people I don't want to be, if there's no requirement for it for me to effectively do my job? It benefits no-one.

And you said life must be difficult for me unless I live as a hermit. Which is a reference to outside of work. So now you're back tracking.

I'm not back tracking. I said that unless you live as a hermit, it's impossible not to 'coexist' with people you don't especially like, or who may not especially like you. I didn't say anything about socialising with colleagues.

I also didn't say anything about socialising with colleagues. In general, I don't spend time with people I don't get on with through choice. It's not impossible to do. You said it is, without specifying work related.

And as so many of the WFH virtues that people extol seem to boil down to "I don't have to deal with/get distracted by/interact with people". Human beings aren't supposed to be islands!

I like working from home because I can do focussed work without getting drawn into discussions that are really nothing to do with me. I have lots of interaction with my team both work related stuff and general chat, they’ll drop me a message or we’ll chat on Teams. The difference is if I’m needing to concentrate on something I can do that without the general office chat happening around me.

Why doesn’t your DH do the school run if he WFH? Don’t have to have breakfast club then

You know this is a privileged position. Managers can cut short unhelpful interactions with staff. I used to have to listen to a manager droning on about work stuff that was irrelevant to me. I could not easily cut it short.
Most of what gets talked about in offices is not work. Its someone telling you about the new car they have bought, or where they are going on holiday. And if it is about work its often someone just bullshitting or showing off.
I don't think a lot of managers realise how much bullshit staff in offices have to listen to.

And I sooo welcome not having the aside conversations of - have you ever thought about doing this?
My job has a lot of regulatory elements, but is the kind of job that every Tom, Dick and Harry thinks they can do. I used to get so many suggestions that are illegal to do. I had to politely bay them away all the time without looking like a dick. Its months since this has happened.
And I am open to suggestions. But not once has anyone made a suggestion that is feasible. Not once. And that is because they have zero knowledge about the regulatory background, and if I try to tell them they just switch off.
I am also glad to be free of the management trainees. They are never managed properly and used to spend an inordinate amount of time popping into the office and asking me and my colleague to help them with things they did not know how to do. Everything from claiming expenses to where things were kept in the building. Every single day multiple times. These are the kind of things managers complain trainees are not learning from being in the office. And I just want to say, fucking train them properly then.

I work just as hard at home as I would in the office. I actually accomplish more because I’m comfortable. The only difference is the lack of commute.

I go into my home office, sit down at my desk and work. It’s just like being in an office.

I know many people who wfh. It is the same for all of us.

Get a better job, then.

I WFH and it's not easy at all. I'm also disabled, so can't physically go into an office.

Better for women: can do laundry during lunch hour/pick up kids from school etc.

Ugh, I hope others have picked you up on this as I am late to the thread. Why is it women’s job to do this stuff? I really hate working from home threads where women rave about being able to do errands and laundry etc. I have never heard a man cite this as an advantage.

I don't think a lot of managers realise how much bullshit staff in offices have to listen to.

Plus some of the casual sexism disappears

I haven't had to hear a man loudly tell his mate that his friend couldn't have raped his ex because she liked it rough

I haven't had to hear men boast about which of the new female graduates they would try to shag first

I haven't had to see male managers rate interview candidates based on how much they want to fuck them

I haven't had to watch male managers cosy up to their male underlings and ignore their female staff altogether

I'm not saying it doesn't happen any more, but thank fuck for not having to see it happen around the office any more

I work from home and I don’t moan. I’ve worked in retail whilst studying, you have my sympathies. I don’t even mind if assistants are a bit rude, you put up with so much shit I don’t blame you.

The other week I was in B&M and the assistant said they aren’t even allowed a drink on the tills until summer. The store is roasting- it’s unbearable.

Thankfully, the majority of my working life has been with men who don't say things like this (at least within earshot of women). There's been a few occasions of blatant sexism but not much.

I recognise I've been lucky there, especially as I'm in a male dominated field. In the same way I recognise I'm lucky to WFH in a flexible job. Although I do also acknowledge that I worked hard to get this job and the flexibility I have. I have had no control over what men say and do, that is pure luck.

I think if your chances of promotion or working on an interesting project depend on you knowing the right people or being in the right place at the right time, then your company is terrible at managing personal development and is treating their staff unfairly.

Also, everyone in my company still has tp complete a work station assessment, so if we're not comfortable at our desks, that's kind of our fault.

You sound very angry OP. Perhaps you should get some career counselling.

Me too.

Of course it's easier - that's why people prefer it. Your post feels a bit odd to me.

Haven't read the full thread. I wfh, and occasionally go into the office. I have to go in today, actually.

What I have found WFH is I will work until a lot later 10pm to get a matter finished and I'll work when I'm sick, which there is no way I would do a 3 hr round commute whilst sick to go in the office. So yes I might put a wash on while I wait for the kettle to boil, but that doesn't negate the hours I am putting in to my job. I still have my caseload to manage, calls to take, and targets to hit. Wfh didn't take those aspects away.

Oh dear. The sarcasm didn't get across. I don't need head pats, thanks.

NRTFT

DH and I both wfh (me f/t and him 3 dpw) and yes I think it’s made my life massively easier for the most part.

Kids at school (end of our street) 8.45 so we’re always logged on in time, after school club covers until we finish work and it’s a 2 min walk away.

we both tend to get chores blitzed on our lunch break which is super helpful.

we both work full steam apart from our lunch break and we sit in different rooms so we don’t distract each other.

there are a couple of down sides but they definitely don’t outweigh the positives. I’m very grateful for being able to do it.

@PhamieGowsSong I think this is one downside of WFH

Lots of people say "my employers don't care when I work, so long as I get through my tasks". That's well and good if you have reasonable employers with fair targets

And there may be days when you have a cold but can still manage a few easy emails from home or study an online course, but not fit enough to travel to an office for a full day

But, in the past I've worked in toxic environments with unrealistic targets. I worry that some staff will end up working crazy hours at home, trying to meet those targets. In an office, they might be more likely to say "8pm, nah, I've done enough, all the bosses have left already, I'm going home now"