AIBU to be surprised how many people on MN seem to be people pleasers?

[Mnk711]

Granted probably people who are people pleasers will post their dilemmas more often on here than people who are able to set healthy boundaries, as people pleasers are likely to encounter more problems they can't resolve themselves. But I'm shocked how many people seem unable to tell other people the truth about their behaviour being selfish, unpleasant, and rude. Are there really this many people who in real life are incapable of standing up and being counted?

I find it really sad that there are so many threads of people being walked all over by 'friends' or 'D'Ps who treat them horribly and OPs can't defend themselves. Or people who are surrounded by other people pleasers/those who just want an easy life who won't stand up in defence of what's right. And the same IRL - friends with a terrible boss or work colleague who everyone just tiptoes around and won't speak up.

AIBU to be surprised at the seeming prevalence of people pleasers?

I was in a supermarket today and for fat-middle-aged-invisible me it was quite noticeable how many men just moved and stood in my way and blocked the aisle. They did not give a shit. On two occasions it was women who moved to let me past - one was on crutches, and one in a wheelchair actually apologised (when it was actually a dumb bloke at fault). He just looked at me with a vacant expression. Not a thought in his head to move out of the way or say sorry.

Thats why people pleasing irritates the fuck out of me. It’s largely women. Nice lovely women. But women who unwittingly let selfish self-serving shits (often male) dominate and get in front. And that is why people pleasing, whilst maybe giving them a momentarily feeling of ‘being a good girl’ or whatever fucked up reason they do it, ultimately does not help society or the world.

Just be a decent person. But have boundaries that say you expect decency from others too.

That's because a lot of these self-proclaimed people pleasers are pleasing no one, their behavior is actually annoying as hell.

I think I do it as a hangover from an abusive childhood, it's not so much about people pleasing as such but just not "causing a fuss" or directing any attention towards myself as in childhood that behaviour would always end in a vicous beating and horrible insults and names spat at me.

I didn't even realise I was doing it until someone I considered a friend did something horrible to me (but sadly not unusual) and when he apologised I said "it's fine". Then I realised that actually it wasn't fine at all, it was awful, it was his fault but I was the one willing to make myself small so that he didn't feel bad which was extra messed up as that behaviour was nothing new for him towards him. I realised I didn't even like that person, yet I was willing to put his feelings first because part of me was scared of how someone would react towards me.

I am also autistic (late diagnosed) and have since found out that it can be quite common as a kind of masking.

However, now that I've realised this I am trying to recover from the behaviour and prioritise my own feelings and needs where possible.

I’ve been a lifelong observer of a chronic people-pleaser, and she brought me up to be similar. I had to unlearn my entire upbringing and socialisation in my 20s.

@MagnusCanis — I think it comes because the people-pleaser sees you as an aspect of them, not a separate person. So they think it matters more that they say ‘yes’ to the other, more important person than that they inconvenience you, because they don’t mind, therefore neither will you.

@MrsCrumPinnett, in the case of the lifelong peoole-pleaser I know best, she gains a sense of ‘being needed’. Her self-esteem is so low that she doesn’t believe anyone would be interested in her if she didn’t continually do things for them. So she chooses peoole who are unfortunate, ill, unlucky etc, and avoids the happy, fulfilled, lucky etc because she sees them as not needing her.

I used I be like that and tbh it’s quite shocking that as soon as you start standing up for yourself and pushing back, just how quickly you get further ahead than everyone else, especially other women! Shy bairns get nowt or something like that…

I actually think people pleasing often comes from quite a selfish place at heart. People who never tell you what they really think/want have been conditioned into believing this is the easiest way to get people to like them and don’t have the imagination or the guts to do anything under their own steam.

To be fair, it’s a trait that a lot of women are encouraged to cultivate because it’s thought to be unseemly and threatening for women to have strong views and boundaries.

But ultimately it’s incompatible with deep and trusted relationships. You can’t have an honest relationship with anyone ever if you’re constantly trying to smooth things over for a quiet life and never reveal yourself.

I have contempt for people pleasers who continue to do it after a certain point. Just grow the fuck up and grow a pair.

Yeah, I think this is harsh but basically true. It’s manipulative, even if it’s entirely unconsciously. It was how I was brought up to be, and I had to grit my teeth and work to undo those scripts, so I don’t underestimate how lingering that kind of socialisation can be. But it’s no way to live, and it’s often covering up enormous amounts of anger, conscious or not. You see it on here all the time. ‘Why don’t people like me and invite me to fun things when I run around after them all the time babysitting, giving them stuff, listening to their troubles?’

Best post in this whole thread. It also makes you really hard work for other people!

I think this is called ‘White Knight Syndrome’ people who want to look good helping out other people to the detriment of those close to them, they want to look all heroic and selfless in the strangers eyes when in fact they are being incredibly selfish to their own family.

Am just so glad that at 60 I really don’t worry too much . Have an amazing group of friends ( who don’t really know each other) ..got rid of one friend because I couldn’t be arsed with PA behaviour fairly recently…so relieved! I just enjoy quality over quantity 😊

It is an online forum, by default people with issues are prolific.

Hmmm I'm not sure I agree with you there. Read up on the " fawn " response; it's a way of protecting yourself either emotionally or physically from the threat of harm and usually stems from a traumatic childhood. People pleasing is nearly always rooted in trauma actually, and as such, is not as easy as getting over it by just deciding to become assertive. I dearly wish it were that easy!

How can you tell

I've been one most of my days. Unfortunately for me, it was rather late in life before I snapped.

@CutPiece
You see it on here all the time. ‘Why don’t people like me and invite me to fun things when I run around after them all the time babysitting, giving them stuff, listening to their troubles?’

Interesting. Thing is, you seem to be suggesting that if they didn't help people out they'd somehow get invited to more things, be more wanted. Does that actually happen? Genuinely curious, as a former and perhaps current people pleaser!

It's complicated because being there for each other and generally being considerate of others is something I value in friends. If I meet someone new and they're particularly considerate or thoughtful I do notice it and think well of them. Do others not do this? Or is there a difference between that and people pleasing?

You can see the difference in things like:

1. Social cues (seeing on someone's face that they don't in fact want to agree to xyz even though they are saying yes)
2. The sheer amount of stuff they do for other people being way more than the average person does
3. The horror on their face when they slightly inconvenience anyone with anything
4. They constantly apologise for every minor thing, even when they haven't done anything wrong, example: my friend going on and on about how sorry she is that she missed my birthday party due to being ill, to the point she was getting on my nerves with the apologising. This is why I say these so-called people pleasers should be called something else because they are pleasing no one, in fact their obsession with how they are perceived is so irritating

This is interesting as I don't think I'm a people pleaser at all or indecisive but there are lots of situations where I genuinely don't mind what we do. Like, I never mind where we go to eat as I know I'll find something that I'll want to eat whatever the cuisine but people think I'm being indecisive.
I'm happy to go with someone else's preference because I don't have one.
It's just not a big deal to me.

Yeah me too. Everyone else has such strong opinions on things like where to eat, I literally don’t care a lot of the time. Perhaps it comes from having very fussy members of my family when it comes to food - I always ate pretty much anything. I can’t bear lengthy conversations about where to eat and think the person with the strongest opinion should just pick somewhere because otherwise they usually find something wrong with the other person’s choice or sit there all meal looking unhappy. If they genuinely don’t mind then I don’t mind picking but I know a lot of people with strong opinions and this is rare.

Interesting that people have ‘contempt’ for people pleasers. Seems a bit extreme to me. How is it a better personality trait to not try to accommodate anyone else and dislike people who try to? Saying No is a skill we are not conditioned to learn and I admire people who do teach themselves to despite the odds. I do think perhaps it is different for younger people whose own parents grew up in a more progressive era where having an opinion without having to dance around the issue is totally fine. This was not really the case for me. My daughter has zero problems speaking her mind so far.

In my experience people pleasing covers a a few of groups of people and they probably display it differently:

• people who've got baggage and trauma from childhood and people pleasing behaviour in adulthood emerges from the trauma fawn response.
• people who enjoy being viewed as the saviour and gain validation. (Eg. Will sign up to volunteer commitments outside the home where they'll get praised even if it's to the detriment of their family)
• a section of the "I'm not like the other girls" women who people please, or more accurately man please, by saying and doing what gets them male kudos. They've likely internalised that their worth comes from male approval.
• There's also a group of people who aren't particularly concerned about people pleasing but are very indecisive and would rather other people make decisions. Possibly controversially I think this can end up being a bit selfish as it's a way of dumping the mental load back onto other people if done all the time.

This

Absolutely this from me, too. I agree with the OP that there are threads on here where people just need to speak up, although that's easier said than done in real life.

But I've been much more shocked at the number of people who won't put themselves out for anyone, even close family, EVER.

I mean it's factually true that you don't have to do anything you don't want to, but a really horrible way to be!

I’m grateful to those of you who replied with why you do it/what you get out of it, and I’m sorry to those for whom it’s been a self-preservation tool in the face of abuse. I often feel very lucky to have been brought up in a way which made me value myself and gave me self esteem which has lasted me all my life. I wish everyone had such solid foundations.

Oh, I think you might be reading some people wrongly! I absolutely support the people I care about, and put myself out for them in so many ways, which we all do mutually. The difference is, I think, that we don’t value each other for the things we do for each other, but for who we are, and the relationships would not be affected if someone was unable to do things to help/please the others.

I used to be a people pleaser...because in my younger days I thought it would make me popular and buy me friends I suppose.
But looking back I let people take advantage of me,whats the saying,give people an inch and they will take a mile.

But the minute I had a lightbulb moment with individual people then I put a stop to everything I did for them.

Over the years I decided being the real me was good enough and I didn't have to offer to do things for every person who dropped hints.
Its ok to say no to things you don't want to do.

Anyway thought I had got rid of the fake friends and users and takers years ago....until something happened to me last year and I had to sit with my closest friend and tell her I was really sorry to let her down but there was something I couldn't do anymore and I was crying telling her.
She gave me a hug,we chatted and she left...not heard from her since.
So 15 years down the pan just like that.

Those conversations are just so wearing, no one is going to get offended by you expressing a choice of restaurant!