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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Would you hire someone visibly anorexic?

349 replies

Ncncncncc · 13/04/2024 12:47

I’m looking for honest (even if brutal) answers.

OP posts:
SparkyBlue · 13/04/2024 18:59

I've known two people who have had anorexia. When they were very unwell it was very obvious that they weren't just naturally very very thin. They would look awful. I always remember one woman at a family party at Christmas time in a house with heating on at full blast and she had a big woolly jumper on and she couldn't keep warm. She'd look absolutely awful and it was obvious she was very ill. Thank god she has since made a great recovery. Anyway my point being that being really thin wouldn't necessarily make me think anorexia. Maybe the OP just looks very unwell and maybe seemed tired or distracted . We don't know

SulkySeagull · 13/04/2024 19:02

Unfortunately, for some businesses it’s just not possible for them to take on someone with an obvious, active mental health issue. Time off/not being able to work/finding cover isn’t always possible.

I’ve taken on someone who, after being employed, disclosed to me some very severe mental health issues. We were a small team. She needed constant time off for appointments and couldn’t come to work and there wasn’t anyone else who could take on her role. It was an impossible situation and put the business under huge pressure.

of course, we all have the right to work, but there are lots of other people involved in a team and they have lives and stuff going on too. One persons illness shouldn’t trump everything else.

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 19:02

It's also worth pointing out that trying to prove that someone didn't get the job because of their anorexia would be practically impossible.

DrBlackbird · 13/04/2024 19:02

Ncncncncc · 13/04/2024 12:55

Yes, it’s me.

Struggling to find a new job. Caught sight of myself after leaving an interview this week and wondered.

I have never had time off though.

Yes. With some trepidation admittedly. Though there have been some hiccups along the way (too tired to do all physical elements of the job). Turns out to have been the absolute best decision. She is in recovery, doing well, and is an amazing staff member. Best of luck in your search and your recovery. It is possible Flowers

pam290358 · 13/04/2024 19:11

BeachBeerBbq · 13/04/2024 18:55

Would be required to TRY to make reasonable adjustments..Business simply cannot accommodate everyone.

The key word here is reasonable. The law recognises that not all disabilities can be accommodated, and that’s as it should be. But as a former employment adviser l can tell you that I’ve seen cases where employers have put every obstacle imaginable in the path of employees who have become disabled while in service, and have made very little effort to accommodate even simple needs. Tribunals tend to have a very different idea of what is reasonable than the employers involved in such cases.

Flatulence · 13/04/2024 19:16

I've worked with four people over the years who I know had anorexia at the time. They were very thin.
All four (in different companies, at different times, over the course of more than 20 years) were excellent at their jobs and were extremely dedicated and hard-working colleagues who were also great to work with on a personal level too.
If someone can do the job then the fact they appear to have an eating disorder wouldn't put me off hiring them. At the end of the day, lots and lots of people have complex medical conditions and disabilities that are completely invisible. I have one myself. It would be daft to single out the person who "looks" unwell for fear that they might not do the job well/take too much leave etc.

BusyMummy001 · 13/04/2024 19:17

Devonshiregal · 13/04/2024 18:55

A lot of personal experience on both sides of the table.

As a business owner (multiple businesses) and consultant for businesses, I would say for every one person who finds themself in a job and grows as a person, 10 (being generous) will:

  • not turn up for work on regular occasions
  • cry regularly at work
  • Have episodes in which they behave in detrimental ways to the business
  • Pick arguments with colleagues
  • Claim their (ordinary) responsibilitIes are “unfair”
  • Take their problems out on their employer
  • Falsely accuse colleagues/bosses
  • Quit without warning (and more often than not show up a few days or weeks later claiming that they need to be taken back and it would be unfair not to)
  • Get regularly sick
  • Turn up hungover or still drunk

Honestly I’d challenge anyone with actual mental health problems to swear that they were actually fully functioning at their job during bad periods. If your mental health is truly bad it’s just not possible to be great at your job - and on the odd occasion someone is they inevitably burn themselves out and crash in the end.

like I said I’ve been on both sides so this isn’t some dig at people with mental health conditions. And they can be worked with but people always ignore the impact it haves on managers and owners.

How can we expect one or two people to handle a whole team’s mental health problems perfectly, cover missed shifts without complaint and fund the hours missed and just basically deal with what is essentially someone else’s monkeys someone else’s circus whilst also trying to do their own job?

But OP doesn’t know this person IS anorexic or has any MH issues?

She may just have crones, or recently been diagnosed with hyperthyroidism and GP hasn’t got the thyroid meds right yet? Or anything, really.

Plumeface · 13/04/2024 19:18

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 18:59

Exactly - lots of people are throwing around the Equality Act without really understanding what it means.

Businesses, especially small businesses are expected to try and make reasonable adjustments but the law recognises that it's not always possible, practical or safe to do so, and makes allowances for that.

If someone's disability means them doing a particular job would be dangerous, or unsafe, or require permanent support, then businesses are allowed to say "no". Lots of people don't seem to realise that.

I work in HR. I know what it means.

If you rejected someone for a job on the basis they had a disability, without even exploring reasonable adjustments, as some on this thread have already said they would, that's clear cut discrimination, end of story.

Naturally proving it is difficult but it doesn't make it right.

BeachBeerBbq · 13/04/2024 19:19

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 18:59

Exactly - lots of people are throwing around the Equality Act without really understanding what it means.

Businesses, especially small businesses are expected to try and make reasonable adjustments but the law recognises that it's not always possible, practical or safe to do so, and makes allowances for that.

If someone's disability means them doing a particular job would be dangerous, or unsafe, or require permanent support, then businesses are allowed to say "no". Lots of people don't seem to realise that.

Absolutely. Just no differentiating between 2p0k turnover and 200mil turnover. As I said. Reasonable adjustments are reasonable.

Plumeface · 13/04/2024 19:19

olympicsrock · 13/04/2024 18:35

I don’t think I would. I’m sorry to say that I would not hire anyone with a current serious mental health problem .

Can't see how you'd know that at interview stage unless they told you, which they'd be under no obligation whatsoever to do.

TeenLifeMum · 13/04/2024 19:20

I hired someone with fibromyalgia, liver disease and mental health issues. She was fab when she was in but her sickness was high. I’m incredibly proud of how I supported her to be the best she could be and helped her reduce her sickness levels and increase her confidence. Still friends despite not working together anymore but managing her showed me the strength of compassion in getting the best out of someone. So, yes, I would.

Ncncncncc · 13/04/2024 19:20

Thank you for all the responses.

I am not looking to prove anything or take them to a tribunal.

I personally (maybe because I am suffering) can tell if someone else is struggling with anorexia and not just very thin.

OP posts:
Plumeface · 13/04/2024 19:20

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 18:45

No, she wouldn't necessarily.

Small businesses aren't expected to make the same concessions as large businesses for a whole variety of reasons.

https://www.acas.org.uk/employer-decision-protected-characteristic/objective-justification

https://www.acas.org.uk/disability-discrimination/types-of-disability-discrimination

Both those links have some useful examples.

This is what I do for a living, I really don't need ACAS links.

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 19:23

Plumeface · 13/04/2024 19:18

I work in HR. I know what it means.

If you rejected someone for a job on the basis they had a disability, without even exploring reasonable adjustments, as some on this thread have already said they would, that's clear cut discrimination, end of story.

Naturally proving it is difficult but it doesn't make it right.

The thing is, sometimes you can't make any reasonable adjustments. Not all workplaces are set up for that, for a whole number of reasons.

If you know that during the interview, then the reality is you have no choice but to say no.

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 19:24

BeachBeerBbq · 13/04/2024 19:19

Absolutely. Just no differentiating between 2p0k turnover and 200mil turnover. As I said. Reasonable adjustments are reasonable.

What's reasonable varies depending on the business, though - it's not black and white.

Plumeface · 13/04/2024 19:26

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 19:23

The thing is, sometimes you can't make any reasonable adjustments. Not all workplaces are set up for that, for a whole number of reasons.

If you know that during the interview, then the reality is you have no choice but to say no.

In 15 years working in HR, often with tiny charities who financially haven't got a pot to piss in, I've never yet come across a workplace who absolutely couldn't put in place any reasonable adjustments in place at all.

Many employers are astonishingly lazy and unimaginative on this issue.

BeachBeerBbq · 13/04/2024 19:26

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 19:24

What's reasonable varies depending on the business, though - it's not black and white.

That's what I said before as well

BeachBeerBbq · 13/04/2024 19:27

I will bow out because MN employment advice here is like MN diet advice....

LiterallyOnFire · 13/04/2024 19:30

Ncncncncc · 13/04/2024 19:20

Thank you for all the responses.

I am not looking to prove anything or take them to a tribunal.

I personally (maybe because I am suffering) can tell if someone else is struggling with anorexia and not just very thin.

You'll get something. Keep plugging away.

(It seems to usually be an orthorexia thing to insist slim is indistinguishable from clinically struggling. Just ignore.)

CustardySergeant · 13/04/2024 19:31

BusyMummy001 · 13/04/2024 19:17

But OP doesn’t know this person IS anorexic or has any MH issues?

She may just have crones, or recently been diagnosed with hyperthyroidism and GP hasn’t got the thyroid meds right yet? Or anything, really.

The OP is the one who is anorexic! RTFT.

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 19:33

Plumeface · 13/04/2024 19:26

In 15 years working in HR, often with tiny charities who financially haven't got a pot to piss in, I've never yet come across a workplace who absolutely couldn't put in place any reasonable adjustments in place at all.

Many employers are astonishingly lazy and unimaginative on this issue.

I'm sure they are - I'm not disputing that at all.

But I do think there are some businesses out there where you can't make reasonable adjustments for disabilities - generally places that aren't office based and that require full physical mobility.

Plumeface · 13/04/2024 19:36

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 19:33

I'm sure they are - I'm not disputing that at all.

But I do think there are some businesses out there where you can't make reasonable adjustments for disabilities - generally places that aren't office based and that require full physical mobility.

Many reasonable adjustments have no bearing whatsoever on physical ability so I disagree.

pam290358 · 13/04/2024 19:41

Plumeface · 13/04/2024 19:18

I work in HR. I know what it means.

If you rejected someone for a job on the basis they had a disability, without even exploring reasonable adjustments, as some on this thread have already said they would, that's clear cut discrimination, end of story.

Naturally proving it is difficult but it doesn't make it right.

I’ve been called out on it too despite being a former employment adviser. It’s not a question of ‘trying’ to find reasonable adjustment. Employers have to engage properly with disability equality law or face the consequences. My field was mainly supporting employees who had become disabled in service, and in my experience tribunals had very different ideas as to what constituted ‘reasonable’ from those of most of the employers involved.

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 19:43

Plumeface · 13/04/2024 19:36

Many reasonable adjustments have no bearing whatsoever on physical ability so I disagree.

Okay.

So, if someone works in a doggy daycare centre or a kennel and has an accident which means they need to use a wheelchair for the rest of their lives, what adjustment would you expect the daycare/kennel to make?

Bearing in mind that the workers need to be able to walk the dogs, get down on the floor with the dogs, clean the kennels, separate potential fights, provide canine first aid and potentially deal with injured dogs on their own with no support from anyone else.

I'm genuinely curious as I don't see how it can work. You need to be able to walk, run, get down on your hands and knees etc. on a daily basis.

Rosscameasdoody · 13/04/2024 19:45

fieldsofbutterflies · 13/04/2024 19:33

I'm sure they are - I'm not disputing that at all.

But I do think there are some businesses out there where you can't make reasonable adjustments for disabilities - generally places that aren't office based and that require full physical mobility.

So you think all disabled people are limited to office work and jobs where full mobility isn’t required ? God help us all. It’s no wonder unemployment among disabled people is at such high levels if attitudes like this still prevail.

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