No phone for secondary school

[StillCreatingAName]

AIBU? I feel like I might be missing something obvious on this one, but honestly why do children need to take a smartphone to school? It’s baffling me as to why there appears to be parents on auto pilot buying their children smartphones (£££) now in year 6, ready for year 7 as though it’s part of a uniform policy (and then sharing their purchase on the class WhatsApp, give me strength).

Is this all just a fallout from lockdown times, people were sort of forced into screen life, so now there’s more children at secondary school with them, who may not have ordinarily had a phone until older?
I’m expecting dc to walk home with friends talking and socialising without the inclusion of a screen or mindlessly scrolling social media instead of listening to friends. I can see where a basic phone might be needed to contact home, but that doesn’t mean the phone should be out of school bag anytime during school hours should it, but maybe I’m just being naive, time will tell 🤷‍♀️?

AIBU to say children don’t need to get a £££ phone for starting secondary school? (It goes without saying they don’t need it at all for primary school, IMHO)?

None of the parents in our school are like this. Thank goodness

Yes, they don't need their own smartphone and they certainly don't need to take one to school.

I would argue that it's not necessarily healthy for the independence and agency of a child to be tracked by their parents (see 'Free Range Kids' by Lenore Skenazy). I appreciate that many parents might want to do this though, and it's an interesting issue. Nonetheless, you don't need a smart phone to be able to do this (Apple Air Tags, others)

@gldd I'll expand on the bus situation, not to be a pedantic git, but to expose various situations and circumstances.

First of all it's a school bus, it doesn't take cash or card, it's a specific QR code one. If she misses it there's not a next one.Like I said, I can by pass that (and have) by printing it out and laminating it, but I had to keep doing it and it was an extra thing for DD to remember(at a school where they get detention for forgetting a calculator/ruler/green pen/black pen) so yes maybe that was laziness , inconvenience.

Now on the actual bus issue. She is the only kid taking the bus at our station (only person there actually) so there's no one to ask or interact with. Sadly , despite costing £££ the bus often breaks down or is late. I'm not talking about 5/10 minutes , I'm talking 30/45/60 and one time even messaging to say make alternate arrangements. DD can track the bus and see where it is and get updates. She can adjust her leaving time by tracking it so she's not out for an hour in the rain. She can ring or message me if there's an issue, or a friend's mum for a lift. Once, when it broke down on the way back with no ETA for a new bus, she looked on google maps and saw there was a train station to our area a short walk away, so she and two friends did that after checking with me if it was ok.

It was a great piece of mind (for her as well as me)when she went for a 3 minute walk in primary to a 30 min drive on the aforementioned bus.

As for the different phone, the cheapest ones are £40 . Now , I can definitely afford that, but a lot of families can't so it makes no sense for them to buy a new , separate device, plus a tablet/laptop/computer when they can just pass down an old one. A lot of posters just assume these extra devices already exist in most homes. If that's the case , then kids are just at as much risk as from a smartphone ,so once again it comes down to parents to manage and restrict use.You might think that argument is ridiculous, but it's reality for a lot of families.

I don't understand why tablets,laptops,computers,gaming devices etc are ok and normal but smartphones are the root of all evil. Or why , if restrictions can be put on these ,the same can't be said for a phone and make it the parent's responsibility. Again, I'm not being obnoxious, I honestly don't get why a phone is more dangerous than a tablet with the same rules/restrictions.

Tbh, now that I think (and I'm constantly thinking and reassessing)about it I'd probably agree to a no smart phone rule for under 10s ,bar any medical needs.

Oh and all solutions to a very late/broken down bus need to be done within a certain time frame , unless she's already on it, otherwise she will be late to school which obviously stresses her out and it's not ideal.

@gldd some of the messages (including the one where they just gave up and said to find alternative arrangements)from the bus company. I'm not making it up, it's incredibly frustrating and stressful.

I think more restricted and age appropriate smart phones will come but we aren't there yet. For now I think one of the best things you can do is use parental controls as much as possible, and insist on the phone staying out of their bedroom as much as possible.

Don't give them the mindset that it's their phone, their new toy, so much as that it's something provided by you but that they get to take out of the house and use like a front door key or their calculator or their shoes. So don't make it a Christmas or birthday treat (something I regret doing with mine who are now older). While they're young, you provide the phone, you are in charge of what goes on it, no accounts on apps are created without your knowledge and guidance, and you check it regularly. It can still be a place where they can contact friends or be contacted but it doesn't have to be a sort of private link to the Internet that's attached to them 24/7. (Truly private conversations with friends can only happen in person anyway, because phones are not private - you never know who else a friend might be showing your messages to.)

One year 7 specific benefit we found was maps - walking home with new friends who live in a different direction and then needing to walk all the way home later by themselves. Also being able to see where your child is or their lost phone is. Those two together can allow for more freedom and independence (keep the location thing for emergencies though, don't kill their feeling of independence by using any knowledge you have of where they've been for anything less than an emergency).

I understand your feelings OP and I think the tide is turning, but it will be towards restricted phones for teenagers, not no phones, and having no phone at all doesn't completely work now. Right now what you can do is try to mimic those phones of the future by setting up your own limits and controls. A proper phone of their own, with no parental oversight, can be for later.

My kids wont be having phones or internet. Kids need to get dirty, climb trees, ride bikes, read books and socialise.

If you don't want your child to have a smartphone, don't buy them a smartphone.

I think most parents these days want their child to have a phone of some kind so they can call and text if they need to. Obviously that doesn't have to be a smartphone. However, there are obviously lots of other handy things that a smartphone can do which I'm sure some parents feel makes it a useful all-in-one device for their child to have. And they don't have to be expensive at all.

As an adult, I use my smartphone as a watch, a calculator, a library, a music player, a radio, a payment card, a source of travel information and updates, a torch and a creative tool for snapping interesting pics etc. Since those things are also really useful for a teenager travelling independently to/from school, I can see why parents feel they're a reasonable thing to buy. Not essential, of course, but certainly very handy indeed. I guess it's just a personal choice, there's not a right and a wrong here.

In my school, phones are not permitted at all. We have calculators in classrooms so they are not needed for that. Phones are handed in a secure bag in morning registration, kept locked in the admin office for the day and collected at home time.

Loads of sympathy for the teachers having to deal with this issue in schools@TitaniasAss.
But there will always be exceptions to 'phones not permitted at all'. You just can't say that. There are around 32,000 children with Type 1 diabetes and increasingly they are going to be managing their condition using a smartphone as a medical device.

Up to what age? 16?18?

simply amazing what people here will try to start arguments on

@dolphinette if you make wide blanket statements you can't expect people not to ask for clarification.

If this is a school bus, why is it not the responsibility of the school to get your daughter there on time? Why is she made to feel anxious when it is the responsibility of the school, not her?

@gldd because it is run by a private company (hence the cost). The school doesn't care. They don't even know the routes and the info on their website is still about the old bus company.There have been times when the school even forgot to tell the bus company that the kids were finishing early so by the time the bus did make it there, then waited for the other school that uses it (not enough time to do return trip) she ended up getting home at the normal time despite finishing at 12. Tbh the main issue was the lack of communication on all sides (school and bus), otherwise she could've taken the public transport route which is lengthy and more expensive , but she still would've gotten home earlier.It's all fun and games at secondary.

They're always given an exception.
Teachers are shown their photo so we know that they're allowed to have their phones out to check blood sugar.

Home work and communication from teachers is all via app at our school. Also info on changes to schedules for music or extra curricular classes which they may not see if they wait til they get home to log on.

Im quite happy with my mature, responsible, well behaved year 7 child having a smartphone (and definately wasn’t on autopilot when I bought it).

All of my Son’s friends communicate over the various apps (whats app etc). Everything is arranged over them - going into town etc and its the way they communicate today (I used to have to pick up the home phone and cringe at my parents hearing my conversations with friends).

We also have the tracking app on the phone for emergencies - again I trust my 12 year old and his friends to go out together without being monitored, but its always there for emergencies (if he didn’t arrive home at the time agreed).

I feel sorry for any child not trusted enough by year 7 to have a smartphone.

Totally agree - so much of what my Son does on his phone is actually about socialising. Meeting up with friends, taking it out in case of emergencies, chatting with friends etc. My Son would feel very isolated from his friendship group without one.

They all use whats app to communicate with each other and keep in touch. I dont think my Son ever sends texts except to family.

Poor kids…how will they arrange to socialise with their friends when they are 12, going to Secondary school and friends could live in a number of towns and villages around the school?

Are they going to call their 12 year old friend on the home phone? (Other than people our grandparents age, who has a home phone anymore???). They will miss out on everything so good luck with that rule.

You also need the internet to do all their homework, everything other than reading (which we do every night) is set on apps.

Come back to us in a few years time and let us know how its going.

I think YABU to be under the impression that any phone provided for a Y7 has to be an expensive one, it doesn't. Likewise, no smartphone provided has to be given to a child with all its functionality accessible.

When DC2 started Y7 their 'new'smartphone (an iPhone purchased for £30) was locked down so they couldn't access the internet, couldn't download anything without me putting in a password, couldn't share location and had a 30 minute daily limit on it. It also locks down at a particular time each evening. They needed it for accessing their school timetable and the homework app, neither of which were available on paper and teachers weren't saying what the homework would be now that they have to upload it to an app.

That was 4 years ago and DC2 still doesn't have an expensive smartphone but does have more freedom on the phone in terms of being able to access pre-approved websites on the phone etc. One of their closest friends doesn't have WhatsApp and that does mean the others need to be mindful when having group chats because this friend is left out of them. I don't track my DCs' location nor do I expect to be updated as to where they are all the time but aspects of secondary school are hard enough as it is and I want my DC to be able to be in touch with friends, access homework etc. using whatever systems are set up to do so. The smartphones haven't stopped my DC walking to school with friends and chatting, nor have they prevented them from taking part in active, outdoor activities but they have facilitated independence and communication in a time where phone boxes and paper homework diaries are no more.

One other thing to bear in mind is that the later you provide a phone for them to use, the less natural it might seem to your child for you to be in charge of it, so the more you may feel pushed into handing over not just the phone but a lot more control of it. Starting with a very tightly locked down phone at 11 or 12 lets you ease those restrictions gradually, and lets you gradually teach them how to do various things, including setting up accounts with good privacy and so on. Providing a phone for the first time at 13 or 14 could be much more stressful with much more pushback against any restrictions, because they've become much more independent in that time.

Mine did because they needed to go on public transport and incase they needed to ring me with any issues. Many kids have a phone long before secondary these days

Teachers pass on any such information about extra curricular activities changes when they receive an email or the runner comes round. No need for phones.
The homework app will be checked at home, surely?