China and our children. AIBU to be deeply concerned?

[Concerningalgorithms]

I read this article and am so concerned. So many of our kids are on TT.

https://nypost.com/2023/02/25/china-is-hurting-us-kids-with-tiktok-but-protecting-its-own/amp/

Basically, TT and other SM have the same effect on our brain as addictive substances such as heroine. Developers know this and create highly addictive (make use of our knowledge of the reward centre in our brain), apps/platforms/games that leave us with dopamine crashes when we can’t have it. So that tantrum or meltdown when we say ‘turn screens off now’ is partly, if not mostly, to do with that, is one example.

The article above says that China use different algorithms there for TT so it is helpful for children’s development. They are peddling addictive, concentration lowering crap to children around the world, but protecting their own children.

Why are we allowing this? Why are we not protecting our children too? The science is there.

And AIBU to think that we are at risk, as a country, of raising a generation that will be less well adapted and more vulnerable in the future to a hostile take over?

I also find it concerning that the morals of those in power is corrupt enough to give us anything that makes them rich. Social media is a large one but it's really screen time in general - how has Apple persuaded all education systems to hand out individual devices to our little children?! It's other areas too though - fast fashion, upfs, etc etc. We're destroying our own species willingly and everyone's response is simply, ' if you don't like it, don't buy/eat/watch it.'
I'm also left wondering why we're in this state and why nothing is being done about it on a global scale. People are money obsessed and as long as they profit, they don't care about the masses.

Well that’s true. But are we happy to accept that or do we want to raise our game?

Exactly, especially when most of the addicting properties were invented by US tech giants and put out there for a generation of kids who are now old enough to be having kids. China is a convenient scapegoat.

Well indeed. Unfettered capitalism is the elephant in the room. I’m not a ‘socialist’ but profit can’t be constantly put before people without huge costs, both to us and the economy.

I did allow SM for DS at 13 (ds is only interested in TikTok and Insta and tbh not that much) but what I did is block them (plus YouTube) at the wifi so if they want to use them in the house they need to use data which is (1) shit- one bar and (2) limited so they can't do it all day or they'll use all their data and I won't buy more. They also have overall screen time limits on phones and iPads.

I have been told on MN I'm controlling and my dc will leave home at 16 to live on the streets rather than be subject to these draconian restrictions but hey. 😂

Raising your game isn’t peddling conspiracy theories regarding China hurting our children’s minds with their apps that are just like western made apps.

China are protecting their own kids from it because, as a Communist dictatorship, they can. Mark Zuckerberg also protects his kids from his own inventions and acquisitions. Every tech billionnaire knows exactly what they are doing to other people's children, but they only give a shit about their own. It's not just a China problem.

Sorry. I’m not blaming China but asking why the hell we are not acting. China is only doing what we did for centuries. I don’t like it though!

I don't like the kids version of YouTube either. It's so easy for them to end up in an echo chamber of crap and kids don't always know what else is out there to search for and there isn't always a search function either.

Yup.

It’s all well and good saying it’s parent’s responsibility to monitor and regulate their child’s online activities but ultimately not everyone will, in fact the majority won’t because they too (parents) are usually addicted to their devices too.

The addiction element is very concerning, there’s an old Star Trek NG episode where the crew of the Enterprise becomes addicted to a game which is being used by an alien to hypnotise and control them to steal the ship, madness to think back in the late 80s such a fanciful idea would become reality today.

Parents cannot allow children to have access to SM, make TTs, endlessly scroll YouTube, post photos or reels for likes and then complain they don't like the stuff that happens on the internet. As pps have said, in terms of neuro development, we expose tiny brains to millions of messages a day, some hugely inappropriate, yet people also worry about feeding their child a healthy diet. Why is physical health from birth seen as important but mental health is not?

.

But OP, poor parenting allows children to have terrible diets, to be obese at 5, to vape, bully, steal, watch porn, obsess over all sorts of weird stuff.

Selecting Tiktok as the source of the country's ills is a bit strange. We have Andrew Tate, incel culture, suicide sites to name but a few. I find a lot of American culture distasteful.

I'm not saying Tiktok is good, it isn't, and I don't doubt the Chinese will use it if they can, but it's just one source of damaging rubbish out of a hundred that have to be navigated.

Schools have enough to do, providing basic education & managing behavioural problems. So who should manage such risks? In the end, childhood outcomes are most influenced by the parents.

Good question.
Why aren't parents protecting their own children?

There's no single answer.
Some are, so 'NAPALT' 😁

Some don't understand the problems the internet can cause or the harm that can be done allowing the world into their child's bedroom so there's an education/ understanding deficit there.

Some don't care as long as the kids are occupied.

Some have rules but don't enforce them - can't break my child's trust / invade their privacy to ensure they stay safe on the internet.

It's the same as with all aspects of parenting - diet, discipline, etc. kids don't come with a manual and you don't need any sort of skills, qualifications or accreditation to become a parent so you're going to get everything from the very best to the very worst.

It’s all well and good saying it’s parent’s responsibility to monitor and regulate their child’s online activities but ultimately not everyone will, in fact the majority won’t because they too (parents) are usually addicted to their devices too.

But that doesn't mean it should be taken away from those who do regulate and use it appropriately.

It's like saying, some people binge eat chocolate so shops should stop selling it because not everyone has self-control.

I used to look back with horror on the 60s/70s when babies were given dummies with little reservoirs of Ribena to suck all day on and destroy their teeth. But that seems positively benign compared with what is happening now

I was confused initially by your OP and thread title because I didn't understand the focus on China. But the more general issue, of how we (as individuals, as parents, as governments) are allowing tech billionaires to feed this poisonous addiction to our children and ourselves - I share that concern absolutely. It is destroying our politics, our cognitive capacities. It was hard enough for my children, who were in their teens before smartphones/tablets/etc began to drown children in tech. But now, tiny children with their hugely plastic neural pathways are being hammered by the algorithms as soon as they are old enough to hold a device. Or sooner! - I wouldn;t be surprised if there were specialist holders to fix baby's tech in front of him/her.

It's like saying, some people binge eat chocolate so shops should stop selling it because not everyone has self-control.

No, I think it is more like saying some people binge on heroine/meth/cocaine so dealers should stop selling it because not everyone has self-control.

Only on Mumsnet.

I don't usually have any truck with conspiracy theories, but the permissions that the tiktok app gets you to give are... invasive. I'm a social media manager and I'm holding out against putting our brand's content on there because I truly don't think it's an ethical platform, for several reasons.

All the big social media sites know what they are doing though, in terms of addictive behaviour and algorithms, and whilst children are the worst affected adults aren't immune to the effects either. Video content on any platform is getting shorter for a reason.

My biggest advice to adults is to follow the examples of the creators and developers of social media platforms, and keep your children off them. As adults, use an app to limit your own time on them - no, your own willpower is likely to not be enough.

China has its own SM platform problems OP, I was in Shanghai a while ago and went out for dinner with colleagues, they didn’t even look at the menu but just went on whichever platform they used at the time to browse for top 5 most ordered dishes and ordered that, and this is just a small example of the digital way of living I saw in the 10 days I was there.
I agree with the others that the parents are as addicted as their kids, I see so many parents glued to their phones on the playgrounds, it’s a sad reality and no amount of government intervention could change that wave for the time being I think. It’s ironically sad that tech people not just the moguls don’t allow these interactions for their kids, nor they allow any personal info posted on SM.

You are incredibly out of touch if you truly do this and believe its ok to issue a blanket ban on SM for 14/15 year olds.

Yes. Us adults get addicted so what hope do kids have. The impact it's having on developing brains remains to be seen.
Too many kids cannot focus, cannot read a book, cannot watch a film. They're just watching TikTok and following YouTubers.
We do need to act.

OP says they aren't blaming China while literally blaming China in every post. 😏

What do you suggest is done about China (who you aren't blaming) and Tiktok (which you seem to think is the only platform out there used by children)

Parents have their own rules.

(and trust me, there isn't a child in the land who can't get round that)

Schools have their own rules. (certain websites/platforms blocked on school WiFi etc)

(and trust me, there isn't a child ..you get the drift)

Are you suggesting the govt (already criticised for nanny stating and doing what parents seem incapable of doing in many cases) steps in?

You are so naive, you genuinely sound like it's your first day on dial up.