To think the PoW’s diagnosis makes healthy living seem pointless?

[Notsuretoputit]

I try my best to live heathily (although definitely not fanatical). I try and stay away from ultra processed foods, try and avoid saturated fat, too much meat etc., try and exercise every week. I’ll have the odd takeaway and definitely overindulge on wine, but always try and be mindful of living heathily because so much information is constantly battering me through the radio, media etc. about getting ill from various foods and not exercising.

I’ve recently lost my mother far too young too, so I suppose it’s particularly on my mind at the moment. But then you hear Kate’s diagnosis, who obviously exercises regularly, has the best instructors, best food, best ingredients, best preparation, and she still falls ill, and it all seems a bit pointless.

AIBU to feel this way? I just wonder whether I really should make an effort to watch what I eat and run when I don’t feel like it if really, what will be will be regardless.

Exactly what @Cleaningupthemess said in fact.

It's the data and understanding the effect of doing something in a large population.

People can get lung cancer for many reasons. If you smoke ,you increase the risk.

But if you don't smoke and you get lung cancer, it could be genetics or the environment you live in. Is someone living near a busy road more likely to get lung cancer than someone in the country, all things being equal?

Which is why you need large scale studies

Hi @43ontherocksporfavor

I must admit I don't know anything about the Dukan diet but if you are interested, Dr T Colin Campbell's famous book "The China Study" talks about his research which showed links between a high animal protein diet and cancer and how dairy turns cancer cells on. It came from studying rural areas of China where cancer was low, but people ate high fibre low protein diets.

Not that I am suggesting that Kate's cancer has anything to do with this of course. So many variables and sometimes, sadly, a "perfect storm" can set these things in motion ...

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/cancer/#:~:text=The%20cancerous%20cells%20can%20invade,of%20cancer%20during%20their%20lifetime.

1 in 2 people

Sure thing.

My bloods are taken 3 days before chemo.

The results are not on the nhs app. I just double checked.

I definitely haven't had my obs done the last two chemo. It's shocking.

I have seen my oncologist once before chemo. Once after my first cycle. I will see him once after my new chemo drugs start and presumably once after my chemo finishes?

I've read you have to see your op to request a new oncologist. For 3 possible 4 appointments it didn't seem worth it.

I tried ringing pals multiple times. I couldn't get through.

Otherstories.

Yes, I agree with your point which is why i wrote
definitely there is a huge rise in lifestyle related cancers. We all know that smoking and alcohol consumption greatly increases the chances of cancer. So my point was don’t smoke, don’t drink alcohol (or drink only a little ) but doing go to extremes in terms of diet, exercise etc. It’s presently far more difficult to work out why those at very low risk of lifestyle related cancers, end up with it.

I don’t think eating healthily and exercising 100% stops you getting cancer but it reduces the risk (of getting a whole host of illnesses including) cancer: also I think it improves your chances of being able to beat it. Someone fit and healthy taking chemo is going to react differently to someone starting off from a more unhealthy position.

Isn't also important to mention that most Chinese are lactose intolerant and dairy just does not feature in their diets. Rural areas also tend to be poor and tofu/soya, not meat, is the main form of protein. I doubt the study has little relevance outside of China or those whom are lactose intolerant. (incidentally, I am, like most people of Jewish descent.).

To my mind, dairy turning on cancer cells is much like sugar feedlng cancer. Not something that is true. At no point when asking about diet/what I should and should not eat has dairy been mentioned. IN fact, I recall one session I went to that told us to ignore anything that said x, y, or z foodstuff feeds cancer... If anything, I have been advised to prioritise protein.

@tothelefttotheleft

You don't ring PALS, you go, in person - they will have an office at your hospital. Alternatively, you can email them.

I don't know the protocol at your hospital, am just going by how mine works. But if they're taking your bloods and your chemo isn't being delayed, then your blood work is good, so I really wouldn't give it a second thought. This might be why you haven't spoken to your oncologist all that much. I've had a lot of issues due to a double BCRA mutation, so I know my MDT are more curious about me and how I handle chemo, more so as I have refused steroids.

As for your results, it might be your hospital/trust does things differently. Again, am only going by mine. Either way, you can still ask your breast cancer nurse for this information, or even the chemo nurse when you're having treatment.

I don't know. what else to say. We're clearly different. I want to know all the information, so make a point of asking where my blood results are/how to check them. When I have chemo every three weeks, I make sure they fill in the treatment details in my cancer book and don't take no for an answer.

Anyway, I hope you do follow up with PALS if only to ensure others' have better treatment. Like I said, no oncologist should complain about the cost of treatment, particularly as it's pretty standard treatment.

Wishing you well for the future.

The main thing is not smoking and medical services and experts on tap. I’ve waited 46 weeks for a cardiology problem after an x ray on my chest revealed a shadow and I still haven’t been seen. If it is something bad - I’m a year further on. My GP said I’ll be seen within 9 weeks and that was last april.

My best friend has fought and survived stage 4 bowel cancer 3 years ago. She started bleeding in august a continuous period and in September was referred on the two week wait as she has history of bowel cancer (she’s 40 and fit) and she’s still waiting for a gynaecological scan and it’s March. I don’t think people that can pay or go private have the same results as the people that can’t and are reliant on the NHS and waiting.

I have been shocked at the waiting lists and I hope Catherine recovers quickly and that they caught it early but at least for her she has brilliant doctors and no wait to be seen. However the amount of stress she has been through is ridiculous in recent years and that has to affect her immune system.

It’s actually made me want to get into better habits. Because if it can get Kate when she has all the access, likely to be worse for me as my diet is terrible and I’d slacked off with exercise!

That's a good take.

This is the effect of stopping smoking and the relative reduction in risk of various diseases

Benefits of Quitting | Smoking and Tobacco Use | CDC

OP I totally agree. I know a (horrifying) number of people - my age (30s) - with conditions they were diagnosed with / developed as adults. Including terminal cancer (2 have passed away very sadly). They were all healthy. Drank sporadically if at all. Non smokers. Healthy BMIs. One ran marathons as a fucking HOBBY alongside raising a family and working FT. Didn't stop a particularly aggressive cancer developing. I think people have far, far less control than they like to think.

Cancer has absoloutly NOTHING to do with diet and excersize though.

Cancer is a rogue cell overriding its self destruct when damaged and replicating the damage. It can be triggered by literally ANYTHING and is nothing more than your own cell and DNA thats gone haywire.

Some things are known triggers for damage and mutation so best avoided but thats not the be all and end all of it.

The only way to never have any form of cancer or risk of it is to literally not exist.

I figure I take care of other things in my life my home, my car, my job, why wouldn't I want to take care of my health and body too?

I wouldn't want to treat my body like a garbage dump.

How do you think the mutations happen that cause cell replication occur?
And how do you think those mutations can be reduced?

You don't think that diet helps reduce the risk of certain cancers?

I think science would strongly disagree

Healthy eating and cancer | Benefits of a healthy diet | Macmillan Cancer Support

Healthier diets could help prevent up to one-third of cancers (30%) in the UK. A lot of research is being done into which types of food may affect your risk of developing cancer.
Research shows that being overweight increases the risk of developing some types of cancer. There are many reasons why people are overweight. But an unhealthy diet and lack of physical activity are often factors.
Some foods may increase our risk of cancer, but others may protect us. The link between diet and the risk of developing cancer is complicated. Scientists still do not completely understand it. Research suggests that eating more fibre may reduce the risk of certain cancers. Eating a lot or red and processed meat may increase the risk of bowel cancer. We have some answers to common questions about food and cancer.

I know what you mean OP- you think why bother denying yourself the happiness short term when it’s not necessarily contributing to a longer life.

@doublec

Sorry just one last question.

What's a cancer book?

Stress is a big factor. We don't know how much stress she's been under, and in the public eye too

Hi @doublec

You are quite right that dairy does not feature in the diets of those tested (I don't know about lactose intolerance). You are also right in that the reason they weren't eating much meat is due to poverty.

Actually, the study is really important world wide. What they found was that when the people in these areas travelled to the city or to western countries such as the US, consuming the Standard American Diet, then the same people sucumbed to what were considered to be western diseases - so not genetic.

I mentioned the film Forks over Knives earlier which talks about this study. Apologies for linking again. I just thought it might make it easier than searching my previous posts if you are interested. I haven't got a vested interest :) it's just that it explains it far better than I can.

Unfortunately most Dr's have very little formal education in nutrition and frustratingly too many dismiss the relevance unless they take additional training.

There’s always a point to living a healthy lifestyle in my opinion. I like to eat relatively well (I’m not fanatical I love chocolate and other treats) and I exercise because I feel better for it and I know it can reduce my risk of some diseases. However cancer doesn’t discriminate and is a truly shitty disease

Absolutely @grinandslothit ! I sometimes hear the story about an elderly homeless man who used to go to the markets to see if he could get fruits and veg that were thrown out. I believe he was part of a documentary. The film makers asked him why he was getting the fresh stuff instead of throw outs from McDonalds and the like. He replied that if he didn't look after his health he wouldn't have anywhere to live. His body was his home. It made a huge impression on me!

You know what, I hope Kate won't find this thread intrusive, but good on her for talking about it (although it is sad she kind of had her arm forced). It's got us all thinking and sharing ideas and even if we disagree, it may get some of us learning a bit more and thinking a bit more about what we can do.

I wish Kate all the very best with her recovery and to all those on here and their loved ones who are going through health issues, I send all good wishes ❤It takes a tough person to be ill xxx

I know what you mean. I thought the same when Linda Mccartney died of breast cancer. All that healthy eating and then dying at a relatively young age. But I think we need to just accept that this awful disease strikes where it wills. And hope there is a cure or preventative treatment eventually.