To say 'enough' and just get rid of it all?

[Downdowndownsize]

I know I am in a very fortunate position to have a nice house, lots of toys and clothes for my children, all the streaming platforms etc but I think it’s damaging us.

I dream of having a simple life, of my kids (ages 5 and 8) playing outside for hours and coming in when they're tired to do some reading or drawing, of eating simple meals, spending time together.

I do my best to limit their exposure to streaming platforms, online games etc but when I'm tired and overwhelmed with housework I capitulate and they know it. Also I spend too long on my phone (right now as a prime example, with kids sat in front of Disney+ while I type away). I want to get rid of Facebook etc but don't want to lose the ability to connect to the many people I've met through my life who I'm not close to but still fond of.

Older DC will read a bit to please me but I know she'd rather be playing on the ipad, or watching god-awful tween dramas where all the characters have mobile phones and fight with each other all the time. She loves buying stuff though and has a shelf full of books that she has chosen because they are shiny and cute but that she has never read. When I was her age I remember getting two books for my birthday and they were absolutely treasured and read over and over.

Younger DC is less interested in the TV and will happily come out for a walk with me but he, like his sister, has terrible concentration and struggles to get down to anything that isn't fascinating for him (thanks 24-hour entertainment on demand). His teacher has told me he is the same at school.

It all seems so simple to just take it all away (DH is very pro-technology and a spendthrift as well but he would do it to support me). But I actually feel scared to do it, which is ridiculous.

Please can you give me your opinions and your experience on this? Particularly keen to hear from those who have downsized in the same way! Thanks all 🌞

We have a rule of screens are for weekends only, but also plan things to do during the weekend that take them away (sport, parties, chores, family activities).

You can’t just ban them - you replace them
with something more engaging. That’s a very young age to be addicted to screens.

I HR per day of NO tech! Really. That's awful.
At your kids age we did the following:
3 days a week no tech/screens (usually Tues, weds, Thurs)
1 hour on Monday and Friday
2 hours at the weekend

Huge improvement in their behaviour, they read much more, played more, were nicer to each other. 3 of them are ND (ADHD &ASD) and screens were the easy go to for calming them down, but we worked out it meant they failed to learn other ways to self regulate and became more and more reliant.
The change was amazing. Harder now they are late teens as it's up to them more but we encourage days off still

I should also add that their patterns ebb and flow. Today is wet so they’ll be outside less, and online more. We’re out for brunch together as a family and will walk the dog together this morning, but the afternoon is theirs to manage.

As long as their homework is done and their clothes are organised, I’ll leave it to them to decide how to spend their time. I’m happy we’ve had a good balance overall. Much less stressful for me too not to have to manage their time!

I suspect we will play another game as that’s something we all enjoy - would highly recommend that as a great way of interacting with them and they are happy to drop their phones for. Can recommend some corkers (for younger kids) if you’re interested.

Do it, it is easy to reverse so if it doesn’t work you can reinstate them with more restrictions.

This generation will need more practical skills so the sooner you can start the better.

You are in charge @Downdowndownsize My children had that childhood, it's a choice. It's only difficult when you consider other people's expectations, which I didn't, I only did what I thought was right for my children.

I embraced the mud, dirt and mess, but I also had cleaners. They had a garden, great outdoor things; the trampoline, wooden wagon, trees to climb. Dogs. Tech was present but ridiculously restricted; the internet was Ted talks, TV was a huge choice of carefully chosen DVDs. Masses of amazing books and games and toys. It all takes time, money and knowledge.

This was only a few years ago but I think it's much more difficult to do now, mostly because of external pressure. It's so easy to give in, most people do and will not help you feel good about doing your own thing.
I am so happy and proud, actually, that I held firm, that's probably the one thing I did right, in life. They have great memories of their 'deprived' childhood and it has served them well.

I always found the argument that children have to grow up with tech to be well-rounded learners totally nonsensical; it's a tool. Children have to grow their own brain. They don't need to be plugged int the matrix, it's the matrix who needs their brains (literally now, with AI).
Also, tech has been with us for about 2 generations and I've never met a child that had any difficulties catching up with it.

I disagree with most on here. Screens are nothing but bad for primary aged children and letting your child use a screen is taking the easy option however you justify it to yourself. I strongly believe that most of the current mental health problems and behavioural problems are due to excessive screen use in young children.

For primary kids a good balance is 2 or 3 hours a week of TV on the family television. No iPad etc. I really disagree with schools encouraging screen use by setting primary aged children homework tasks that require screen use.

Every hour a child spends staring at a screen is an hour wasted. Wasting some time is obviously fine but the default for many children seems to be unlimited TV when they are not at school. There's no way that this doesn't harm their development.

When kids are not watching TV they don't need entertaining but there will be more mess, noise, arguing, needing to get things out for them etc.

I have similar fantasies. Instead I have deleted all social media apps, so I have to use my browser to go on them, turn my phone off 6pm-8am every day and my children aren’t allowed to go on tv until after dinner and bath so for around 45-60 minutes a day. No iPads / phones. They do use a laptop for homework 3x per week but that is literally homework only.

it can be done.

have seen massive differences in sleep, temperament and quality time.

I think there is a middle ground. I don't think isolating them totally when they are older is a good thing as they will miss references to popular culture and in their working lives it will be good to have some common ground.

You could encourage in a positive way, by encouraging them to learn to programme etc.

I don't know I think on a school day that's not too bad... My younger kids are out from 8.30 until 4. Watch TV for an hour after school. They only have an hour screen free as the rest of the time they're eating, getting dressed, in the bath, asleep. If we had no TV at all on a weekday they'd have 2 hours screen free time.

What do you do? When you have downtime... do you sit on your phone? watch telly? Coming down to it... are you the default do-er? Do the kids help with laundry, cleaning, cooking? Do you get them involved, or just leave them to their screens whilst you skivvy for the family?

We are a tech heavy household - both I and dh worked in computing as a career.... but my girls play hockey... because I did. They play piano, because my Dh does. They sit and read a book because we do... sometimes on a device (my eyes aren't as good as they were). They are at uni now and cook, clean, do everything to stay clean and healthy - as they have always done it.

A lot of this requires parental involvement, engaging the kids so that they have less time... you will too.

Model the behaviour you want them to follow and take on to their future lives. That will include a lot of technology, some of which is purely for entertainment, some for learning, some to make other jobs easier.

That's completely valid of course, but this only happens to people who have the right dispositions in the first place, one in millions.

The advice I give my students parents, and that I try very hard myself to adhere to is two fold

1. limit your own tech use as much as possible around them - this is so hard as a parent - reaching for your phone is the easiest way to check out / snatch some ‘me time’ (but ultimately it’s a short circuit because it doesn’t actually fill your ‘me time’ bucket - it just zones you out for a moment) - I try to have a book or magazine or a sketch book on the go that I can sneak a moment to myself with while still modelling not-relying-on-tech

2. instead of saying ‘no’ to tech - say yes to everything else - even if it’s a bit inconvenient or messy. They suggest a cake? Let’s make it now! They mention it’s sunny - let’s race round the garden now! Etc etc

also lots of good advice above about having tech free times for everyone at meals / before bed etc

you got this!

We have very limited screen time

Each child has one day a week where they can have 1hr screen time

Friday and weekends they are allowed about 2hrs in the evening if not out/busy - but often are busy.

It helps that they do a lot of activities and have a long ish school day plus homework so there isn’t a lot of spare time at home to fill.

One is good at coming up with non screen stuff to do (she loves drawing and reading) the other one not so much.

There is a fair amount of squabbling and mess creation when they are both at home and not allowed on screens. But I’m damned if I’m letting them veg on screens just because of that!

Yes, completely agree. Balance is key. Limit the time you and your children are on screen. I'm pretty sure my concentration isn't what it was-too much scrolling and skim reading. Facebook-10 minutes and do something else. Children, 30 minute or similar. These are just thoughts. If they have ipads, you can time limit the use.

I used to turn the router off in the days of 3G and once took it to bed with me to get my daughter off screen.

There wasn't so much tech when mine were that age but more so when they were teenagers. I think you just need to have times when you set that they can't use it. My two weren't allowed on screens on weekend afternoons (even when teenagers) . They either had to be out doing stuff or reading, playing board games etc. In the end they didn't even moan about it.

You aren't wrong OP. There are numerous articles available online that discuss how tech giants (Steve Jobs, Bill Gates etc) limited their children's use of tech and didn't permit phones until 12/13. They know the effects of tech on children's developing brains.

I'm glad my DC was born before 30 years ago when this wasn't a very big issue - it must be a minefield to navigate now for parents.

Do you work OP, or SAHM? I ask because you say you default to devices etc when you're overwhelmed with housework. What's causing the housework to be overwhelming?

Congratulations to all those posters whose children play outdoors, are indifferent to screens, enjoy a wide range of activities, volunteer to spend time with their parents, etc

Your comments have made me feel a hundred times worse, as I think about my own screen-addicted teenage DC. So thanks for that.

And yes, we rationed TV (tightly!) all through primary school, didn't get them smartphones till year 7, offered all kinds of activities and outings and fun stuff ... we did everything that people always recommend on these threads. It didn't make any difference.

It's hard, op. I actually have the same vision as you, maybe it's the era we grew up in?

I can only share what we do. I have a 3.7 year old and a 13 month old. Unless sick, the 3 year old only gets 60-90 minutes of TV a day, and only when his brother is sleeping as the 13 month old rarely sees the tv on. Obviously in times of sickness for me or the 3 year old, I do no TV restrictions. Or some days I will pop a movie on together even if he's had his TV quota but that's not so often (I can imagine this becoming more often when he gets older).
We have no iPads / tablets and I don't want to buy any for the reasons you've mentioned above. And there's no watching anything on phones / laptops. I want to keep to this for as long as possible.

I try to get out as much as we can...even just the garden. But this could be more, I'm hoping with spring now we'll get out more. I'm not a natural outdoorsy person so I keep it simple. Walks in the rain to splash in puddles, the garden to play in the sandpit, a hour running around the park. Holidays are in mobile homes at camping sites.

I'm on my phone way too much. I'm trying my best to curb this. I hate I'm on it so much so I can't really help it.

It's so hard with technology everywhere. Our neighbours are very nature orientated /outdoorsy. They have two small children and don't even own a TV. I wish I could just get rid of everything too and hate that I feel I can't.

I haven't ever limited screen time in general, though they do have parental controls that shut off phones from bedtime until morning.

We go through periods where one or more DC will seem obsessed with a screen for a while. I talk to them, explain why screens feel so good but that's it's temporary, and offer/suggest other activities. They often choose to do those activities, and agree that they feel better when they have a more balanced day.

I want them to be able to self regulate (like I struggle to do, I think because it was all so strictly managed by my mum when I was little). My eldest has spent far far far too much time on a games console over the last three weeks, but has cooked every meal this weekend and spent hours entertaining a preschooler on the garden, as well as an hour or two of gaming with his friends. Last night, unprompted, he said he felt so much better today for having spent time outside and with me/siblings. This is the reflection I am aiming for, and it felt so so good to finally get it!

I see where you're coming from but it's 2024 and not the 70's/80's and life just isn't like your imagination anymore - that horse well and truly bolted over a decade ago.
Firstly get a cleaner again to free up some time for you if you can afford it.
We used to have a games night once a week. We played a couple of games - the DC chose one each. Occasionally we'd do a jigsaw and used the time just for chatting about all sorts of stuff we wouldn't normally get time for.
On Sunday afternoons we would often do crafts like decopatch. I bought a selection of papers on Ebay/Hobbycraft, glue and papier-mâché animals/letters etc - it doesn't matter what they look like and any age can do it and it's fun. I also bought Sticker Dolly Dressing books and we'd do one of those on a weekend afternoon etc.
We'd do it less in the summer as we live near some great parks and some with paddling pools (all free).

I’m with you op. It is so difficult, but is down to you. Restrict screens to 1 hr a day for all of you. When on your phone concentrate on contacting your close friends. Invite people round.
To have a simpler life, you just need to change your priorities ( actually there is no just about it, it’s bloody hard and I still fall into rabbit holes on my iPad when left to myself)

1. buy consciously. Do I really need this/ can I buy it second hand/ is this a impulse buy?

2. can you work less or prioritise family time more? Go for walks, collect leaves, teach them about nature. Or stay in and play games, do crafting. It involves parental time input.
   can you get your family involved in your community, whether it’s litter picks, or jumble sales - getting out and doing stuff for others.

3. Involve your kids in food prep. As you said, eat simple. Make bread together, have homemade bread, homemade jam, cheese and maybe homegrown salad for tea every night. Go foraging for berries etc and then make something together.

4. consider getting an allotment, or turning some of your garden to veggies. Make sure your children are involved and learn.

As someone said, very Enid Blyton. It’s about finding the right balance for your family. I started too late, my kids were too old, and too under the influence of screens. When they were younger I was working all the time. Now I live my ,more Beatrix Potter life, they are seeing this as adults and my daughter 23 months is better at controlling her screen time than I am - but she knits and crafts instead.

In your position I’d go for a full digital detox for a couple of weeks, maybe even a month, and then bring it back in gradually and see what happens. If it’s too hard you could allow a bit of CBBC etc or a movie. But no hand held/ internet type devices for everyone.

We do this once a year and it’s great, breaks toxic habits and just gives a bit of breathing space.

I am one of those posters. But I was fortune smartphones/tablets were not really mainstream until ds(20) was around 9-10ish so he had already learned pleasure from social interaction and other activities. He learned how to behave in a restaurant without them, or the pleasure of board games, he had friends who were also not connected to screens etc.

If he has been born just 3-4 years later when screens exploded into our lives and were much more popular, I admit ds is likely to have go sucked into to them and I would have been unlikely to have noticed it taking over until it became an issue. Kids and screens and the negative impact is really just starting to be seen/known in the last few years and understandably some parents have been caught out with it.

I have no idea how I would have parented ds in his early years in this new screen orientated world.

I think the key is that you have to be living that life with them. So you can tell them to go do something else but as you say they will just be waiting until they can get back on a screen. But if you're playing a board game with them, planting some vegetables, baking a cake, reading a story, geocaching, making a birthday card for their dad - or whatever - then they will get into it as much as you do.

I still read to my 18 year old! We still play card games and board games, he hates gardening so that one didn't work out - but find the things that do work and go with them.

Screens take away the need for parents to put the effort in, especially after a long day at work. Kids don't 'need' technology, it's much more likely to expose them to bullying and inappropriate content then anything positive. You can learn how to use technology very quickly it's not some skill you need to develop from a young age and being in constant contact with friends just isn't necessary, certainly not at primary school, it's all just FOMO.