Barristers vs Solicitors!

[HBGKC]

Posting here for traffic - I told my son I'd pick the hive-brain of Mumsnet on his behalf.

He's in lower sixth currently, and thinking about possible career paths. He feels more drawn towards being a barrister (reasons: more interesting work, suits his skill-set, possibility to make a concrete difference), but is also thinking about degree apprenticeships to be a solicitor (reasons: getting paid a v decent wage whilst training, possibility to transition to barrister later on if he still thinks that's a better option, can make lots of contacts during his training that would be useful later as a barrister).

There's also the option to do a normal BA of his choice and then the law conversion course afterwards.

The degree apprenticeship would probably be the most difficult to get on to, as they're insanely competitive from what I've heard; though all law-related careers seem to like that!

I'd be very grateful for any tips/advice/words of wisdom/caution from any solicitors and barristers on here, particularly those who've qualified in the last 10-15 years. Thanks in advance

Thank you ALL for so many more helpful responses; I will reply in more detail later (got to get younger kids up and going places).

I'm a solicitor and for me I felt the nature of the work was far more varied on the solicitor avenue as opposed to the barrister route. You also get involved in cases earlier and will dive very deeply into the case itself and I enjoy that aspect.

I'd caution against picking a route at this point though. Go to uni and find out more about the law. I'd even do a non-LLB degree to spend that time studying something interesting before converting across. I did the law LLB and it is a pretty dry 3 year degree and I often wished I'd spent that time studying history or something before converting.

I work in-house now and will not be returning to private practice. I love my work (intellectual property and commercial law in a big global tech company), the company is cool and modern and has great flexible working practices. I can travel if I want. I get to work with amazing inventive engineers. And I'm paid better than I was in private practice 😂

'I knew what kind of niche I wanted, something intellectually stimulating, non litigious and with a public service element to it and a work life balance. I've managed a career that has largely kept all those elements, and I would say the majority of my colleagues are lovely if somewhat quirky intellectuals'

@CassandraWebb this (tho he quite likes the idea of litigation) is pretty much exactly what he's after, so if you wouldn't mind sharing any further details, I'd be really interested.

A lot of barristers work is deeply unpleasant and incredibly stressful. Your clients are often the utter dregs of society if he goes into criminal law. The question is what type of law he would like to specialise in. Intellectual property/commercial/criminal/environmental etc. my criminal law friends have it tough, lots of child SA. Environmental lawyer lives a fab life as does IP barrister. Financially IP wins it they are all highly paid.

(I'm essentially trying to advocate on behalf of his future wife and children - which he definitely wants - in terms of finding a career path/niche which will allow him to earn a decent (London ) living but which doesn't overtake evenings and weekends...

Maybe law is not the right area in that case... but it sounds like a few of you, at least, have managed to find this Holy Grail.

Words, rather than numbers, are definitely his forte, hence not going the banking/trading route. He's very good at writing/reading comprehension and public speaking.)

Are there any areas of law that you'd particularly recommend, or would avoid? And why? Are certain areas more family-friendly in terms of work/life balance, or is that more a function of which role you work as?

Being an in house legal adviser in the public sector. Not as well paid as the private sector but certainly more family friendly and better work life balance.

Also it can be extremely difficult getting a pupillage (trainee barrister on a chambers) unless you are privately educated and Oxbridge. Old boy network is alive and well.

I'll PM you @HBGKC

In my experience working with them, barristers are more interesting in work they do, but it’s very stressful and you’re only as good as your last case. I worked with a female solicitor who used to be a barrister.

Solicitors, depends what type of work you end up doing but I’ve known at least 2 practice for a few years then get out and do another totally different job. One had the client from hell for almost 2 years (civil litigation) and that was very emotionally draining for him.

I know 2 in house female lawyers who couldn’t hack it in private practice beyond their mid 30s, one worked in a silver circle firm, other for a law firm outside silver circle, one has children and the other no children and I know a few lawyers who work for the government in Government Legal Department as lawyers for the work/life balance.

There is variety in law - it is transferable within the profession whatever you are told. I should know I’ve worked in each type of firm (high street /
mid level / magic circle / in house bank😀. That’s why I don’t understand the negative “it’s awful being a lawyer” if you’re unhappy - move. That said there are far easier ways to make a good salary. The lawyer is always on risk and that is stressful. AI is a real concern too. We are being v careful in advising our Dd. She is a born solicitor though it’s her natural skill set.

Hmmm I wonder if the Civil Service offers any training routes for apprentice-solicitors..? I shall Google.

One concern about the apprenticeship route is that you're locked in to the process for something like 6 years..? Which is a long time, and what if you change your mind half-way through and have nothing to show for it.

Pretty sure the skills you acquired would make you a good candidate for business / management etc. A girl at dds school got top A levels and turned down Durham for a solicitor apprenticeship. It’s not looked down on.

Look at Government legal department website as they do offer apprenticeships for paralegals and then a good career path into being a government lawyer but you have to be sure government is where you want to be. Can be hard to transition from government to private practice. I worked with apprentices there on the admin law side and one is now a G7 lawyer. They might’ve changed rules this was in 2021.

So yes, you have to be committed. Even then once you have your law degree you may be working for say 2-3 years as a paralegal before you get a lawyer job.

Just popping on to post this as I always do on these threads.

It's too late for me, he can still choose another path.

Our plan was head to City whilst young earn as much as possible to buy house and travel prove you can succeed there so you never get pangs etc then quit while you’re ahead with good cv for less pressured job when you have family and enjoy life. Not sure I would head straight for safety of in house / gov legal without having done private practice at all. Personal choices though.

Law drop out here.

Law is one of those areas like teaching, medicine etc where people go into it with lots of ideals about helping people, making a decent living then get thoroughly jaded about pay, conditions, work life balance, getting sucked into a system.

I did it about a decade ago when there were way, way more students than training contracts. Firms knew this and would keep lots of cpe/lpc grads as paralegals on a pittance while dangling the chance of a training contract over them.

A friend who went the barrister route found it a very harsh and hostile environment.

I'd advise your son to try to read some case law, or a cpe textbook, to see what he's getting into. If he pursues it, I think also having a plan of what sector and specialism he wants is a good idea.

I was a bright student, good grades etc, good university but found law so overwhelmingly dull. And in the 5-6 years I spent in it, most of the people I met were not my people at all. They mostly reminded me of Rimmer from red dwarf!

I trained as a barrister and now work as a government solicitor. Totally endorse above recommendations about getting experience. The interesting nature of the work isn't impacted by the solicitor/barrister decision but by the specialism decision. All avenues are highly competitive so he will need to be determined, resilient and prepared to put in lots of hard work and hours. I switched because I prefer to have more control over my work, more client contact and greater involvement in the early stage strategy of the litigation which you don't often get as a barrister, which creates it's own interesting opportunities but it wasn't what I wanted. Also advise to really think about the long term commitment from a solicitor apprentice route, you are tied into it. Do look at government jobs but keep in mind they are diverse but if he wants to be in court it may not be the right route. It's worth taking the time to do lots of work experience to get a feel for the industry.

I work for myself now still in law. Most interesting job ever!

Experienced solicitor here. Was a partner in City for 7 years. Currently working in house in public sector. (Better hours, more interesting work, paid a LOT less)

I'll not repeat the good advice above, but from your description he sounds to me like barrister would suit him better. For the Bar you need to be able to master stuff quickly, get to the heart of an issue, present it well and, imo, charm people. They are not necessarily cleverer than solicitors but they usually try to give that impression (I've sat in a conference with more than one leading QC who have given incorrect advice or I've had to effectively feed them the answer because they weren't prepared).

Good solicitors know the law but also have to build long term relationships, project manage, perhaps lead a team or help run a business, and often think more widely about what the best option is for their client particularly in non criminal work. IME they are not as quick as getting to the correct legal answer.

So different jobs. But he has no need to decide now

I think Government Legal Department does do an apprenticeship scheme but it is extremely competitive. However, GLD would be interesting, but not particularly highly paid until you get to Senior Civil Service level.

There have been some changes that enable solicitors to represent clients in minor courts and initial tribunals. I think my solicitor friend argues at Housing tribunals. So you see a case through.
She is in North of England/Borders
Can anyone confirm or tell me I am wrong?

@AhBiscuits that made me laugh, thanks - I shall send it to DS!

When I worked for a solicitors we got the graduates interviewing sometimes who were all “I want to help people/do eco/human rights law” which was all well and good but we just wanted lawyers who’d earn us money. Harsh but true. Other lawyers I know now work incredibly hard but mostly wfh and say it’s intense. One is currently off sick with the virus everyone has now and says her boss has been understanding (she’s on antibiotics, not her boss is on them!) but still a whiff of your work is waiting for you when you return.

At a very simple level, why not just go to a few open days or familiarisation events for law? It will either appeal to him or not.

I was interested in law as a bright sixth-former, went to one of those events and decided that it really wasn’t for me. Probably saved myself a lot of time, money and heartache in the process.

I’m no longer practising as I realised I hate client work but still work in the legal sector and really don’t recognise a lot of the descriptions in this thread. In 10 years in private practice as a solicitor I never found it unduly stressful nor did I work ridiculous hours. If you pick the right firm and practice area you don’t have to participate in the performative long hours culture.

There are plenty of lazy and academically average solicitors. The race to get trained is competitive but once you’re in you can coast as long as you tick the right boxes.

If I were advising my child I’d take them to watch a trial, get them to arrange a wide range of work experience (civil, criminal, barrister, solicitor, law centre, private practice) and tell them that they need to have a passion for whatever legal field they go for before thinking about routes to qualification or barrister/solicitor.

If advocacy is their thing you can get to do this as a solicitor in employment or housing law with the added security of being an employee and without the bunfight of trying to get pupilage, which most aspiring barristers don’t get.

Finally, if seeking to qualify as a solicitor, the SQE is far more difficult than the old LPC, it’s still developing so I think it will get easier but the pass rate in the first set of exams was something like 50%.