To think that Poor Things is actually a seriously fucked up film?

[AngeloMysterioso]

Spoilers obvs

Basic plot summary- pregnant woman trapped in an abusive marriage attempts suicide by jumping from a bridge. Frankenstein-type scientist retrieves her body, transplants the unborn baby’s brain into her head and brings her back to life. This child-woman is then basically abducted by a dodgy bloke who teaches her all about the joys of fucking, she very naively gives all their money away and because they are now broke and she enjoys sex so very much, she becomes a prostitute, whilst still having the mental age of a young child.

There’s no denying Emma Stone is brilliant in the role, but AIBU to think that it is otherwise one completely messed up Freudian nightmare of a movie?!

From what I've read on here, posters who didn't like the film, like me are not disputing that way she is treated by men is problematic, the argument is whether that problematic treatment is there to titillate rather than for plot development. To deny this purpose appears to be pollyannaish.

You are completely missing the point, LovelyTerry was littering the thread with cries of, 'misandry' which was in relation to posters revealing that they did not like or care for the film but also that there are misandrists everywhere on Mumsnet which is totally irrelevant to a discussion on a film. I was making the point that men don't like the film either, like my DH, he doesn't hate himself so why are misandrists the only people that don't like the film. Equally, VampireWeekday's husband/partner stated that they didn't like the film but she wasn't jumped on because she did like the film so all the anger over me offering my DH's opinion is a) disingenuous and b) a pathetic retort aimed to belittle someone who doesn't like the same film as you.

Thank you for explaining, I don't know what pollyannish means though? I can see how there's a grey line there between presenting the problematic behaviour, yet also perpetrating it by presenting it in that fashion i.e. with quite that much sex/nudity on the part of the lead character/actress. I personally didn't see it that way but then I don't watch films to be titillated (or find them titillating) so it's not something I can really understand or relate to, and therefore comment on! I think my partner probably would find it sexy for sexy's sake (which is actually why he hasn't watched it as he feels uncomfortable about the idea).

@Goldenbear Possibly best to stop digging 😂

This is ridiculous. It was very clear at the time why DHs were referenced. One poster claimed that anyone who disliked the film was misandrist, two posters responded that their DHs had disliked it. Male journalists have also criticised the film in the media.

I'm just sick of being reminded in some form everyday that many men love childlike looking women.

Please explain how an adult woman can look childlike. What do these women wear? I've never noticed my DH liking this. He fancies Sandra Bullock.

How are you coming across this everyday?

Please explain how I am digging? I'm just stating a fact, not liking the film equates to misandry according to a majority who like the film on this thread. In reality women and men don't like the film, this is not due to being devoid of intellect as some very rude and childish posters have claimed. Equally, others are quite blatantly trying to get others to discuss the details of that displeasure, presumably for their own titillation and I'm not going to engage with that.

Again, it's no consolation as that is not the point I was trying to make. You have taken offence where none is intended. When I made that comment it was in the context of the conversation about misandrists and how they are the only people that hate the film. I made the background in Arts comment as I anticipated the next attack to be something about DH probably being a deconstructed male and not appreciating 'Art' but actually like most of us, he is contradictory and complex and can't be pigeon holed, hence the comment about him liking football but also having studied Art.

I cant see that see groomed her gorgeous husband. He was beautiful then and has grown into a very handsome man and a good actor. They are still together and have 2 children. I say she is lucky but he is most probley thinking he is the lucky one.
I know its hard to believe that they are together but they seem very happy and no one is twisting his arm as far as I can tell. Oh and some women do like sex as much as men.

@middleofthenightmediumsizedtoblerone Like a teenager I mean. Reading this forum, hearing about porn tastes, plus I am out and about every day and see how men look at teenagers. I remember being that age and feeling so vulnerable with it, now I feel protective over them.

Isn’t the point that she ISN'T child-like looking? She has always had an adult body.

How does that change the fact that it's disgusting shit?

Written by a man, lauded by other men. Yeah ok. It's still shit.

I definitely don't make my judgements towards men from Mumsnet

I think we all notice beautiful young people. When I watched One Day I thought he was lovely looking but I have desire to have a partner that age.

Most middle aged men I know say they wouldnt have the energy for a younger women.

Not saying there aren't dirty old men out there.

@middleofthenightmediumsizedtoblerone Men are different in that way. Most men put the sexual first and would be all over that. Porn is partially to blame but it's always been thus. I look at a young person and just feel protective, not sexual at all.
And obviously munsnet didn't represent everyone but there's a lot of truth here. It's not all made up is it?

Exactly. Just because she doesn't have large breasts and wide hips doesn't make her look like a child. What does that say about Emma's husband Dave?

Of course it's not all made up.

I tend to avoid the threads that are made just to slag men off because the posters on them just want negative comments and the old not my nigel gets thrown about.

Sorry, I've gone off topic.

I've not seen all of the film yet. We put it on after a few drinks in the pub. I don't think my DH really understood, he was only half watching it. I don't think he will be bothered about finishing it. I will.

Yeah, my job involves interacting with lots of young people (18-22) and the difference in attitude between the female and male staff is quite telling. I can honestly say I've never felt any desire for these kids at all. Sometimes I might think that someone is the type of person I might have been into when I was also that age, but never have I sexualised them, even in my own mind and certainly not in a way that would be noticed. In contrast almost all of the male staff talk about particular young women, have hit on them, even dated and slept with them. I find it disgusting. Again, not saying that all men are like this, but I think that you're far more likely to have experienced objectification from a young age if you're a woman compared to if you're a man. Even as a society the idea of a 25 year old woman with an 18 year old is looked down on, but the reverse seen as acceptable. It's bullshit, it's awful, but it's also reality.

I understand though, that the debate boils down to why this show is depicting this scenario. Some people think it's to luridly get off on it, other people (me) think it's to shine a light on the reality of it in order to criticise. Perhaps they've failed by not making whichever interpretation is correct explicit.

As a contrast, and because as mentioned upthread I've just watched it, call me by your name makes explicit that the relationship between the 17 year old and the adult is supposed to be good. They shoehorn a monologue in at the end to make sure you get the message and the director has even addressed the question himself, saying the age gap is not a problem. This makes it easier for people who don't like age inappropriate sexual relationships being depicted to criticise what's going on (although interestingly I think because both characters are male there is way less uproar than if the young one had been female). Perhaps Poor Things was relying too much on the actors to portray the events and left too much ambiguous, I don't know.

OMG! I've just read my comment.

I DO NOT have a desire to date a younger person.

Missing one word out can be bad.

Haha @middleofthenightmediumsizedtoblerone I understood what you meant from context!

Have you definitely seen the film?

@VampireWeekday exactly.

I panicked.

I do think what you have described is disgusting. I can remember a man older than my Dad asking to walk me home from the pub in a sleazy way when I was in my 20s. I just thought WTF? Really creeped me out.

I really like Keanu Reeves and like that he is dating an older woman not like Leonardo Dicaprio etc.

They don't. Emma Stone is slim and slight, but not 'childlike'. I find that description of her insulting, a bit 'real women have curves'. And women are just as bad as men. I am a bit disturbed by the number of women my age (I'm 40) who drool over Timothee Chalamet.