VAT on private school fees - will it change how you vote?

[Iwishicouldflyhigh]

Following on from the other interesting thread about whether it will be implemented, will this policy change how you vote either way?
For me - i've voted Labour and Tory over the years, but Tory for the most recent GE's. This year, i've been thinking seriously about how i'd vote at the next GE and it wasn't definitely a Tory vote - i was definitely a floating voter.
However, my children are at PS and so i will now most definitely be voting Tory (not just because how the VAT will seriously impact us - child number 3 will now not be going to the prep that we had lined up for her, she'll enter the local primary until secondary school - but how i think that it will affect schools negatively and children negatively).
I have a lot of left leaning friends who educate privately and whilst they cannot bring themselves to vote Tory, they won't vote Labour either at the next GE because of this policy.

It seems to me that this policy is only a vote loser (ie many Labour voters and 'floaters' who school privately won't vote for them at the next GE) and not a vote winner (ie i can't imagine that many Tory or 'floaters' will vote for Labour solely on this policy).

AiBU to think that Labour have really shot themselves in the foot with this idea?

@jasflowers My point exactly - We pay enough. If it's not enough, let the government find it elsewhere.
Higher earners aren't the enemy. I would have more disposable income in Scandinavia not less.

Except for a few marginals (Richmond Park?) I don’t think there are enough floating voters with children at private schools who can’t afford fee hikes or can but feel more strongly on this issue than other policies.

Most private schools will just carry on. They survived competition from grammars and end of assisted places and will survive this.

The thread is about whether or not the policy will change how you vote. My comment is in response to several posters who say that left leaning private school parents/teachers will never vote Conservative. My point is that they might not, but the policy might mean they won’t vote Labour either.

why can't private schools just cut their cloth accordingly, like everyone else has to at the moment increase teacher/pupil ratio so more akin to state schools or apply to convert to an Academy!

Your views on how private schools could cut costs are irrelevant. Current parents don’t want the tax impact to lead to increased teacher/pupil ratios and cost cutting elsewhere. It’s a big reason why people choose the private sector. So, yes, regardless of your personal opinion, the policy will affect how some people choose to vote.

Ironically in a constituency like Richmond Park a Conservative win would be a Lib Dem loss, even though they oppose the policy.

But I still think there are more voters in the Constituency who would switch away from the Conservatives for other reasons than would care about this issue.

Yes. I won't vote Labour and I used to be a member of the LP.

Mainly though I won't vote for them because they are a Sherman tank full of shit for women. Obsessed with identity politics which is so far from actual socialism it's laughable.

I have met plenty of people who like people to think they are left leaning but the ones who would not vote labour over this probably don't vote labour anyway.

@Another76543 yes there is a municipal or council tax included in your taxes as they get a portion of your money. You don't pay council tax - only a waste collection fee of 35 to £90 a year. The rest is part of your income tax bill.
You don't pay NI - that's an employer's expense, which is quite high but doesn't come out of your salary in Scandinavia.

"By contrast, the UK average tax rate on a top earner in 2016-17 was 51%. This was still less than the 55% average amongst higher-tax European countries, but the gap was much smaller than for median earners."

Except everyone gets a LOT back for that extra 4%. More than you could ever dream of in the UK. In the UK you just pay - and get barely anything back.

Everyone in Scandinavia has equal access to schools including private, public and private hospitals and more in my previous post. The UK system needs to change. Currently the UK is really for the elite and the people on very low income. Everyone else in the middle just gets shafted!

You might but certainly that's not true of a lot of high earners in the UK.

Does everyone here who agrees with the idea of putting VAT onto private school fees, also agree with putting VAT onto university fees? It is the same principle after all.

Or if there is such a problem in state schools then why don’t parents start contributing to their child’s state education? Why does everything have to be free? State education should be means tested with those coming in above the income threshold paying a small contribution to the school in support. That is how it is done in other countries. Also, other countries provide tax rebates to families of privately educated Children who are not making use of state school options! Not everything needs to be gotten for free or off the backs of those who have worked harder or are perceived to be richer. Labour’s policies of envy are the most divisive that I have seen in a long time and should they come in to power, we will leave once the children finish their primary ps in a couple of years.

Exactly this. People seem happy for a multi millionaire to send their child to a state school, using state resources, but for some reason think that a normal hardworking family scraping together private school fees should be punished. We must be the only country in the world where a decent education is seen as a bad thing.

These decisive policies are awful. We should all be working towards helping the state sector improve, to the benefit of all, not attacking others. This sort of attitude is precisely why my children have to put up with shouts of “effing snobs” and the like, when innocently walking down a street in their uniform. For some reason, people think it’s acceptable to hurl abuse at those who are privately educated. You even see it on these threads.

The very wealthy aren’t going to give a shit though are they it’s chicken feed to them. It’s the people who are stretched with the fees already that will be hit not those at the top.

Dds private school friends are hugely wealthy. Though sure others at the private schools are not at that level.

This. A huge number of parents at private school aren’t “very wealthy”. Yes, they tend to fairly well off, but many will find it too much of a stretch to suddenly find several thousand pounds a year, especially on top the cost of living increases over the last couple of years.

Really not going to cry for families able to pay an average of £15K in fees for one child. Most will have more than one child in private education. They are wealthy and have a perfectly good enough alternative option that everybody else- state education.

Some are talking as if state education is a fate worse than death. Private education isn’t an entitlement. It’s a luxury service that causes damage for the huge majority of kids that don’t have it. It is the reason we have such poor social mobility in this country. 7 out of 10 judges in this country are privately educated and that just isn’t ok. As a country we desperately need to be focusing on the big problems private education causes not a few wailing parents who are just starting to realise they didn’t plan ahead properly and what it feels like to be shut out of a privileged system only a few can enjoy.

perfectly good enough alternative option that everybody else- state education.

Are you saying that the current state education system is “perfectly good enough”? In that case, it won’t need any more funding, so any tax raised by this policy can be used elsewhere.

Many don’t feel that the state system is “perfectly good enough”, including many currently in the state system.

It’s apparantly good enough for everybody else and ok for private education to cause huge inequalities . As such a few who haven’t budgeted properly going back into the system is not something we as a nation should be worrying about.

You might want to remember state and private teachers are often trained in the same unis.

It’s an excellent and totally reasonable policy.
Decent public services for the vast majority of the population vs Tax breaks for the few and privileged.

It’s not a ‘tax break’ but how much are you expecting?

If you think it will improve all public services

It’s apparantly good enough for everybody else

It isn’t good enough for everyone else. There are some good state schools, but there are far too many failing our children. The state system needs improving. It’s a disgrace that, in many parts of the country, children can only access a good school if their parents can afford to send them privately. I say that as someone who was educated in the state system.

You might want to remember state and private teachers are often trained in the same unis.

There is much more to a school that where the teachers’ qualifications came from. Behaviour, tailored education, specialist teachers per subject, extra help when needed, extra curricular opportunities etc. Decent teachers are leaving the state sector in droves because it’s in such a mess.

Decent public services

How will this be funded, because VAT on school fees won’t even scratch the surface.

89% of schools are rated Good and above by Ofsted.

Teachers are leaving because of the huge expectations being put on them not recognised in their pay.

If the state sector is such a mess surely state pupils should be prioritised by default in applications to uni courses when applicants have the same grades. Surely a student coming from an education system that is a mess who has the same grades as somebody who comes from a system that is apparantly far superior is clearly a better student.

People do contribute to state education, it’s called paying tax. A wasteful government has chosen not to invest in schools over the last 14 years, why should parents have to pay twice because a Tory government has decided to penny pinch on education.

Totally meaningless. There are plenty of schools rated "good" that are nowhere near the standard that I or many others would consider to be acceptable.

It all comes down to how much you prioritise education.

Ah ok. So an education system which 95% of the population use and is robustly inspected by a robust inspection system isn’t good enough for 5%. That same 5% who are over represented in the top unis and jobs. That same 95% are supposed to be concerned about a few of that 5% no longer being able to afford to buy that privilege.

We all know what the gnashing of teeth and wailing is about and it isn’t quality of teaching- it’s your kids having to join the 95% and you no longer bring able to afford the privilege and unfairness that comes with being part of the 5%.

So let's be honest here.