Do you think labour will actually implement 20% vat on school fees?

[labpit]

We have two in Year 7 and year 10 and I am not sure what we will do if this happens. It is a certainty do you think?

Certainly hope so.

What’s with the hyperbole? ‘Withhold from others?’

They can and will afford the VAT. t’s peanuts in the grand scheme of things.

Yes I don’t think private schools should exist but that’s because I’d want them to be redundant. If state education was as good as private there would be no need for it. Private was the best option where we were and it was amazing but pressured. We moved somewhere with a decent state high school so there they went. I choose what I think is best for my kids when the decisions come up. I can’t control what’s available when but I can have a view on how I’d like things to be.

Not correct. Your evidence is based on one school. They vary considerably on fees to attend an customer base.

Private schools around me are somewhere in the region of £20k a year. A 10% rise (which is what is predicted schools will have to charge) will add £2k onto it. I refuse to believe that those that can afford £20k a year won't be able to afford £22k a year.

If a few of them need to go to their local state school maybe it will stop our road being a death trap of Range Rovers trying to save 30 seconds on their journey each morning.

@Trappedandunhappy

There is a word for your behavior: hipocrisy.

We paid through the nose for nursery (close to £2k/month) but I would never be hypocritical enough to thump other people with extra costs simply because I already went through it and it wouldnt affect me.

Your mentality is the classic "raise the drawbridge behind me" because it makes it harder for the people behind you to replicate what you did.

Hahaha my expensive private education clearly a waste.

Just goes to show.

I would have voted the same then! It was a luxury that we had the choice. I’d have happily paid the VAT then. Because I knew charity status for private schools is wrong. I also confirmed my view that they create unfair advantages. So, no, I don’t agree with them.

I am allowed to have an opinion and it is that adding VAT on to the fees is fair. And that those of us lucky enough to be in a position of having that choice shouldn’t moan and wail about a small increase when people are struggling so much and we live with such inequality. It’s not like the decision is between heating and eating.

Most of my friends who still use private education would agree that it’s fair even if they don’t want to pay more.

Anyone able to pay or part pay for education is privileged.

Logically Labour should also apply extra stamp duty on houses in catchment areas of good schools. Because many of the people I know who say private schools are unfair happily pay over the odds for houses in the catchment areas of the best schools, which most people cannot possibly afford to do.

Ironically some of these people may find they can no longer afford to buy into these areas if people now using private schools decide its now a better bet to buy into these areas thus pushing up house prices even more.

What about people who have family there or grew up there and don’t want the schools? Would they have to pay extra too.

Im not sure people should have to pay extra stamp duty for wanting to live somewhere!

What class based rubbish. State schools are well capable of producing good engineers and doctors. Due to funding the state sector has some issues, but it is not a "shit show".

Logically Labour should also apply extra stamp duty on houses in catchment areas of good schools.

I worked for a teacher that taught in a private school in my area and neither that school or the other private schools, of which there are a few had a catchment area as such.
A fee paid was a fee paid no matter where you lived.

I suppose they do in that housesxnear good schools are worth more so more stamp duty is paid and higher value properties have higher stamp duty bands.

I’m not ‘raising the drawbridge’ I’m agreeing with a proposed added VAT onto fees and would have voted for the same back then. Because I want a fairer society.

DC are now in a state comp because we moved. Most of the parents I know still using private education agree that the charity status thing and no VAT is unfair.

It was hypocritical to use a system I disagree with - but that makes me human and doesn’t mean my opinion is wrong.

Im not blaming anyone or telling anyone else their choices are wrong. As parents we all do our best for our kids. AND I want to live in a more equal and fair society where all children get equal opportunities because all babies deserve that chance, not just the lucky ones. I’d love for state education to be so good that private education was no longer viable.

It’s bordering on hysteria the tizz that people are getting into over a possible 20% (fair) rise. Ditch the gym membership. Ditch a TV subscription. Go on one less holiday. Work some extra hours. Clean your house yourself. Cut down on eating out. Most can make small sacrifices to raise the extra. I would have, happily, because it’s fair enough. Honestly, there are literally people fighting for their children’s lives out there. Get some perspective.

Some people are making massive sacrifices though and it feels totally shit seeing people have the attitude that we can just pay thousands of extra pounds in tax a year when we just cannot. I would have loved another child. I would love holidays etc, but we were happy with our choice until thus happened.

Many people are placing their children in state school with incomes like ours and have the extra child, go on the holidays etc and are not making those sacrifices. And they sit in judgement of us treating us like some kind of mega rich other class. Most of us at our school are just working professionals not on mega bucks.

Yes, many state school pupils experience difficulties and schools should absolutely be properly funded, but it is absolutely not the class that they are underfunded due to the lack of vat on private school fees. They will still be underfunded if this goes ahead. There will be even more inequality as well.

Then why should we be penalised for spending our money on education rather than a house? Both are privileged positions to be in. You can't argue both sides. Either you want to penalise perceived privilege.or you don't.

How many ‘extra thousands’ will it actually be?

What class based rubbish. State schools are well capable of producing good engineers and doctors. Due to funding the state sector has some issues, but it is not a "shit show".

This..

It's really irrelevant of state or private schooling, if your DC want to learn they will.

It’s not ‘penalising’ - it’s making something that was unfair, more fair.

There needs to be a wider discussion on the funding gap between regions, I know it's complex and it's difficult to do a like by like comparison but why is there so little debate on why funding and outcomes are so different in London vs some regions.

London schools receive some £7k per capita. In Devon and Cornwall, it averages about £5k. That's almost one-third less.

catchment areas of good state schools.

It’s a difficult one. I have read threads recently on the situation in state schools currently. Teachers are having to teach lessons in subjects they have not been trained in. Supply teachers are being used several times a day for some kids and some subjects. Teachers are leaving and not being replaced. I just don’t see how GCSE and A-level classes can complete the syllabus to a high standard if there aren’t enough excellent teachers around due to Government neglect.

The next step would be worrying that these kids who are bright and able, simply cannot get the grades needed to enter the most highly competitive courses. That is not a reflection on the intelligence or potential of the children or the expertise of the teachers, but of a grossly underfunded system. It is only because of threads on Mumsnet that I have realised what a dire situation many state schools are in. I had no idea it was this bad. Is there any reason to think that the adverse effects of this underfunding won’t filter down to grades and university places?

Are you saying that there are some private schools where the parents really struggle to make ends meet? Where they really won’t be able to raise that extra? There will be a tiny tiny proportion that may be can’t but I’d need hard evidence to believe that there are any significant numbers who simply won’t be able to pay to the extent that they take their kids out.

Well it depends doesn't it. If they have fully staffed, full time teachers, well behaved peers etc then yes they will BUT a lot of schools don't have these so it is harder for "normal" kids to learn.
You only have to read newspapers, education forums or indeed MN to realise that a lot of schools don't have the fundamentals in place to enable effective learning. Schools where kids are having to teach themselves GCSEs and A Levels because there simply aren't any teachers.

Parroting my words shows lack of independent thought.

That is the exact opposite of what I actually said. I said they DON'T.

Read more carefully next time to ensure you don't misquote people. Enjoy the rest of your day.

You won’t know either way, the only people who will are those schools who are surveying parents and then that will have a margin of error.

Without a survey its guesswork. And that includes the IFS