To think being 'too shy'/'too quiet' for my entire life suggests I'm neurodivergent?

[tooquiett]

I'm very shy and quiet, I'm currently 29 and back at university retraining and I can't answer any questions in class even when I know the answer. Same with work meetings, I just can't speak up. I'm drained and exhausted from everyday life and have considered if I'm autistic or have inattentive ADHD. I burnt out in jobs, always have poor attendance as I struggle to keep up with everything

I found my school reports from reception onwards and every single one says I'm too quiet, too shy, need to join in with class discussions. My report at age 4 could have easily have been written about me today by a manager, just replace 'doesn't join in with class discussions' with 'doesn't join in with discussions during meetings'.

Surely if it traces back to age 4 it isn't CPTSD or social anxiety?

Selective mutism? Comes in 2 types - high profile (unable to speak at all in difficult spaces) and low profile (able to say a few words at best, unable to speak freely).

Have a look at SMiRA.org.uk and see if it feels like it fits?

I don't see what difference it would make, if you are ND. You might have a better understanding of your personality but you would still be the same.
Not everyone is extrovert and ready to speak up.

@AutismProf Thank you, I'll take a look

@Felicia19 It would make a huge difference to know if there's a reason I struggle so much with this, it would stop me feeling like a complete failure and help me have more compassion for myself. It would also enable me to ask for support and accommodations if I had a diagnosis

I was thinking about starting a thread asking if shyness is still a thing. No-one seems to talk about it anymore; has the word become outdated? If someone is shy are they automatically seen as neurodivergent by society?

I feel the same as you, OP. I actually became more confident at work when I was taking sertraline but now I'm back to my usual shy self, too scared to speak up in meetings. The shyness/anxiety can be crippling.

It depends, nobody on here will be able to tell you.
What does it feel like when a question is asked that you know the answer to?
Is it that you just can't answer- your body will not raise your hand and you know words will not come out. Or that it is something that scares you, you can't raise your hand because they will look at you and ask you to talk and that makes you feel sick and tense and maybe hot.

What if someone called on you anyway, would it be horrible and awkward and hard but you could answer, maybe you'd go red and struggle to get your point across properly? Would you just freeze and not say anything? Feel awkward and flustered and embarrassed or like your brain had emptied of anything relevant and you can't even begin to plan what to say. Would you feel like you were going to pass out or vomit or that you feel you are being weird and awkward and everyone is going to think you're stupid.

It's only someone else's opinion that you're "too shy" or too quiet." I was both for most of my childhood, although I'm not shy now. Still quiet though-it's just how I am (and I'm nearly 70 now) I had the same written on my school reports.

Shyness on its own wouldn't necessarily point to autism or ADHD, no. For both conditions, you need to show impairment in a range of areas to be diagnosed. There are some good sources online where you can check the diagnostic criteria and see whether other aspects resonate with you.

Not necessarily, some people are just shy, I’m one of them. I’ve twice had selective mutism, both times when I was called on unexpectedly to stand up in front of a room full of people, I couldn’t physically make a sound. I think if I’d been prepared for it I would’ve managed ok but I wouldn’t ever volunteer to do it.

Forgot to add, some people with ASD/ADHD aren't shy at all! It varies wildly from person to person, which is why it's called a spectrum. That said, we do often share certain traits, and I think as a first step you'll want to dive into some research* and see how many aspects of ASD/ADHD strike a chord with you. Good luck, OP.

*If you're ASD, you'll have already been doing mountains of research anyway! 😃

I was always shy and quiet, never spoke in class as i was to embarrassed to have people look at me. Now im older, i know it was just lack of self confidence, and with age i've gained more confidence.

Some of us are shy and quiet, theres nothing medical to blame, just life, as we are all different.

You just sound like an introverted person.
I don't think they is such a thing as "too quiet" as such. As long as you can get by. Maybe a career that doesn't involve communicating in large groups would help if that is not your strong point...
I'm an introvert too and have recently changed jobs. I work alone but I have my lunch with a small team who work nextdoor to me. It's absolutely perfect and I enjoy my job now ☺️

OP 'shyness' is not an indication of being ND but everything else - the burnout, 'keeping up with things' could be. Sensory overwhelm and slow processing speeds come to mind.

Shyness is an inherited trait. Have you ever had any help and support with your social anxiety and inability to speak up? Did your parents have friends? Were they normally sociable or also self isolating?
Friendliness and friendship is also a learnt behaviour.

Maybe but maybe not.

My son had social speech therapy in year 1 (back when it was a Labour government so more money in schools) because his inability to speak in group situations was holding him back. He had good ideas but lacked confidence . The teacher reported positive effects in months and his year 2 teacher was surprised that he needed the intervention. 2 years later he was so confident that he was the lead character in the school play which was unthinkable.

I wouldn't say that being quiet is in any way related to being ND. I've spent enough time at support groups to know that quiet is actually very unusual.

I have always been shy and quiet. Look up HSP highly sensitive person ..Do you have any of those traits. People don’t talk about it much but I believe it is classed as neurodivergent. Although no official diagnosis I don’t even know if they do them but definitely have all the traits.

I don't think that alone means you are nd.

Being shy or quiet is a personality trait and is in no way a failing - all personality types have their own good and bad points.

Sounds like you just aren't a chatty Cathy.

Shyness is not the same as introvert
Shyness is not inherited
You need help - perhaps assertiveness training or something
Labelling yourself neurodivergent will not help you.

I was/am just like you OP. Then I had a child with ASD and dyspraxia and realised that I'm probably ND one way or another. I don't have a diagnosis but just understanding why I am the way I am is really helpful. I was very academic, found my MA easy and passed with distinctions but was mentally completely exhausted and drained by any - even very low level - jobs I had.

A quick Google says you're wrong:

About 20% of people have a genetic tendency to be naturally shy.

When a question is asked that I know the answer to I won't even consider answering, it just simply doesn't occur to me that I could answer. I just can't raise my hand and do it, and if I did I would be scared they would ask me to elaborate which I wouldn't be able to do because I can't organise my thoughts enough to do that/don't feel clever enough. An example is I have a degree and master's in a science, on the course I'm retraining in we have a very basic science module. I won't even volunteer answers in those classes as I don't trust my knowledge, even though I probably have more specialist knowledge than the lecturer in that particular topic

If I was called upon I would go red, stumble out an answer that would be correct but not be eloquent or reflect my actual knowledge or would say I didn't know as I couldn't organise my thoughts enough to say an answer

Should have said it has a significant genetic component plus social factors. My point is try not to beat yourself up because it's a natural part of your DNA. Work with who you are rather think something is "wrong".
https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20190604-the-science-behind-why-some-of-us-are-shy

How parents can coach their children to learn how to make friends and be sociable. Did you get any of that kind of help when interacting with your parents?
https://parentingscience.com/kids-make-friends/

Why friendships are so predictive of happiness
https://www.apa.org/monitor/2023/06/cover-story-science-friendship?mibextid=Zxz2cZ

I do have two siblings with autism, and I know there is a genetic component which is why I'm thinking of it.

I've never considered it up until very recently, and just thought I was shy/reserved/quiet. But that's done me no favours, and I keep trying to pretend everything is ok but I end up burning out again and again. I can meet deadlines and excel academically or at work but it's at the expense of everything else. In my previous job I would spend hours preparing for meetings, writing scripts of what to say that i'd have open on my laptop next to the Teams window, having mini meltdowns during the workday where I'd slam my laptop shut and go and cry because everything felt like too much. I'd go to the office once a week and I'd spend the night before doing hours of work as I knew once I got to the office I wouldn't be able to concentrate and would just pretend to work for the 8 hours I was there. I had no idea how to interact with colleagues. I'd come home with such a headache and feeling of exhaustion and would frequently cry on the train home. We had team socials we had to go to, and the idea of more socialising on top of a day in the office was so awful. I would walk with colleagues there and then panic and couldn't bring myself to go in so would slip away and go home.

@tooquiett you really sound like you could benefit from professional psychological help. How old are you? And have you ever had any kind of therapy or support? Do your parents and your siblings also struggle socially?