Is it all or nothing, quitting booze

[Sosobercurious]

Recently been reading some sober literature recommended on here, and the way Clare Pooley describes things really resonated. She details how she basically couldn't bear her children when she was drinking (!), and then how one of them said she was "more mummyish" since stopping. She probably drank twice as much in a day and more often than me. And I haven't yet put it in a mug at 11am.

i have massively noticed this recently. I don't think I'm a problem drinker addiction wise (definitely my university - 30s consumption and behaviour was quite shocking in retrospect) but DH and I have definitely slipped into enjoying A bottle of red often in the evenings at home, and often more in total if it's the weekend or social. I used to be able to have a few glasses but these days it really disrupts my sleep, makes me grumpy and yes in summary makes me way less mummyish! I have done dry Jan for the first time this year and noticed a massive difference already in sleep and mood and in particular in my enjoyment of the company of small children, which is great. I do love a social wine though and whilst I'm happy to give up the mindless home sofa consumption, I'd like to keep that in my life.

so my question is... is moderation possible if you're definitely a few rungs down the addiction scale than the writers of these books? Or will I just creep back up as they say they would have.

And, do you get the amazing benefits they speak of from quitting completely if you only nearly quit? My social life isn't that active so I think I could easily get down to once/twice a month with friends, but is it better to bite the bullet and quit?

Watching with interest

Dry January has been great for me. I've been surprised that I haven't missed booze at all. But I'm not sure if I do want to stop drinking totally

I have friends who drink socially, but never at home unless they have visitors

I think if you already struggle to control your drinking moderation is not the answer.

Every time I tried to moderate it would work for a while and then I’d be back to drinking more than ever. So I decided as I couldn’t go on that way I’d have to stop and I am 2.5 years sober now.

For most people yes of course moderation is possible. Its how the majority of people use alcohol.

Theres a lot of space between daily wine drinking and teetotal.

why don’t you give up weeknights to start with as see how you get on?

Also don’t compare yourself to what other people are drinking as to whether you have a problem.

also alcohol use tends to only increase if you don’t get it in hand

you haven’t drunk as much as CP - yet
you haven’t poured it into a mug at 11 am - yet

CP won’t have started her drinking journey doing those things either

I used to have about a bottle a day at home and about seven pints if I went out. I now have about half a bottle a week if that. It has taken me a couple of years to reach this point though. I’d say cut it out altogether for a couple of months and then your tolerance will have been reduced and you’ll find you feel so bad after more than a glass of wine that you won’t want it!

Things that have helped me are doing research on units. I actually never thought about units before. Work out your current units and compare that to the reality of women’s limit of two units per day with at least two days off per week. Anything more than that is far too much and that thought really helps me.

Additionally, ttc has helped. I’ve found being teetotal very easy because of that. I think if you focus on your children and how they say you’re nicer when not drunk then that will motivate you.

Well done for taking the first step. I used to roll my eyes at people who evangelised the benefits of moderate drinking but I’d recommend cutting back to anyone. Days are so much more productive and I’m vastly happier and more able to cope with ups and downs. Good luck!

It depends on your relationship with alcohol really. If there’s a dependency (physical or psychological) I don’t think it’s really possible to do it in a half measures way. You have to reset your brain to eliminate the dependency altogether and find completely new habits and ways of living. If you’re constantly bargaining with yourself over whether you can have one more glass that won’t work.

If it’s just a case of wanting to cut down a fairly healthy consumption I think it’s possible.

You have to do a really honest inventory of your relationship with drink I think.

Thanks all. @Feliciacat yes that kind of resetting of the relationship is what I want to do.

TTC, IVF, pregnancy - I've done it all in the last 5 years, several times, through lock downs etc. I know not drinking is absolute doable for me. I guess I'm quite curious as to whether I should just aim higher and if it would be even more worthwhile. And on the flip side if I don't will I end up there eventually anyway.

I think people are gradually waking up that we have all been mislead over the years by a heavy drinking culture. Hopefully it will get easier and easier to moderate as social norms change!

Are you any good at following self-imposed rules? Could you stick to drinking eg only on Friday and Saturday nights?

I read a lot about the benefits of not drinking and I’d found that I’d gone from being a weekend drinker to it being my go to after a stressful day so tried it for a month last year and I did find I slept better, it didn’t make much difference to my mood, being mummyish etc as I think I wasn’t drinking lots but more frequently than I wanted to be.
since then I only drink at weekends and a bottle of wine will last me all weekend. I did notice over Christmas that drinking more than that made me more snappish and not feel so good reminding me to go back to my normal habits.
The big benefit of not drinking was breaking the habit of that being my go to on a Friday night and getting sleepy on the sofa afterwards, it also stopped me deciding to have a drink as a way to relax after a long day and widens the things I did on weekend nights as I could drive without planning around wanting a drink .
I also now don’t always drink on a weekend and am happy with a cup of tea and a pudding instead which is not what I would have expected of myself

@idhjyd good for you! I think I'm in a similar place. The mummyish thing is what has really hit home. Mine are too young to come up with a word for it but I can see that when I've had even just half a bottle the night before, I don't have as much patience, I'm more inclined to reach for the remote and then my phone than to sit properly engaging, doing stories etc. I want to be that second mum, and the taste of the wine (which I love!) feels much less worth it.

That said I also want to drink wine with my meal and yes I do want to occasionally let my hair down with pals.

@eurochick - I'm managing dry Jan but in general no I'm not the best. I think I need to keep it extremely clear - not at my house unless there is someone here who is not my husband or offspring, that might work.

I think only you can figure out if moderation is for you. It really depends on if you are a problem drinker or not. Realistically, once it dips into problem territory, it's very rare for people to successfully rein it in and moderate happily long-term. As in, if you are someone who needs to have that bottle of wine 4 nights a week and you feel twitchy if you don't, you might be one of those mythical people who can switch to drinking 2 glasses on a Saturday instead and switching to tea after. You won't know unless you try. But most people once they cross a certain threshold, no, they can't go back. Because those neural pathways have been created and they are hard to un-do. I suspect if you've gotten to the point of reading Claire Pooley, you are more than just a moderate drinker now, and are really starting to question your drinking.

I'm sober now, but I used to drink quite a bit. I did Dry January every year though, and I did a few other stints. I always hoped that I'd go back to drinking and drink more sensibly. But no, it never happened. I think that is the experience of most people (certainly most that I know). That said, do you even want to drink moderately?

It's a lot of effort if you are someone who drinks a lot. It means you are constantly thinking about drinking. If you will or won't. How much? Could you just have one more? Two more? But it's a special occasion! But you're celebrating! But it's been the worst day ever.

I've found it's really freeing and so much easier to not drink. I was an alcoholic, but I don't think about drinking anymore. I don't spend money on it. I don't waste time going to buy it. So much more time and headspace now. And I do enjoy spending time with my children more.

I actually notice it in other people now. How they switch off. How they avoid their children when drinking. Dh (who doesn't drink like I used to at all) gets so much more shouty after just two drinks, so much more easily fed up with them. I can't help but think if I'm noticing this, it must be so obvious for them the change that drinking makes, which is sad. I feel bad that I must have been like that too for so many years, and I'm really grateful now that I'm not. People do think it 'relaxes' them. But once you don't drink anymore, you can just tell how worked up people get when they start drinking. They don't really seem relaxed at all.

The unhelpful, but I think most accurate, answer is 'it depends'.

Some people do manage to moderate successfully long term after having been a problem drinker. Others struggle. For me, I have found moderation harder work, mentally, than total abstinence.

I can't say I experienced such amazing benefits from no alcohol that I would give up my weekly glass of wine. I don't drink to get drunk, I enjoy nice wine. I am not a connoisseur by any stretch but appreciate a nice drink of wine or single malt and I don't want to feel like I can never have another drink ever again.
I have on average three glasses of wine a month and maybe two whiskeys. And it works absolutely fine for me. I can have two to three drinks on a night out before switching to lime soda. And I also have been out while not drinking at all. There are some good non-alcoholic craft beers around nowadays.
In short, yes, it is possible to be somewhere in-between an alcoholic and teetotaler and I have done it successfully for years.

I quit drinking 19 months ago.. not because of an addiction but more because I was fed up of it if that makes sense! Fed up of having a drink and feeling rubbish next day...fed up of the money been spent on it albeit not a fortune but still adds up doesn't it... I've now decided that I won't ever go back to drinking... when I go out with family I find I drink water or odd occasion an alcohol free cider which is nice and without the horrible feeling next day... at home I no longer open a bottle of wine I have a cup of tea or again water and my skin is best its ever been lol. I don't feel like I miss out because others around me are drinking im still me just without the booze. The money I've saved not drinking is now put towards cinema trips.. treats for the kids... odd take away or trip to the beach for fish and chips which I enjoy so much more than the booze.

@mindutopia I don't get twitchy but the other things like - I've had a hard day! Etc, yes. I don't drink a lot very often anymore, now it's just the frequency. And the hangovers. I want to drink infrequently not toooo moderately, rather than fairly moderately really often. I'm definitely someone who finds it easier to have no glasses than 1. But I think my hell raising years are safely behind me.

I was looking here for similar experiences before I posted and hence found the book recommendations. Have noticed feeling better in dry Jan and was home alone this weekend not drinking. So hence diving into the books. I don't think I'm in a very dangerous place, but definitely I am curious.

I'm definitely someone who finds it easier to have no glasses than 1

@Sosobercurious I think this is your answer, unfortunately

Ironically this is the one area of life where being perimenopausal has its benefits. I have found since becoming peri that alcohol has less and less appeal: it has a dreadful effect on my sleep patterns and impacts my ability to exercise and work.

Since sleep, exercise and work are all important to me it’s become a bit of a no brainer. I still drink but maybe once a week and very moderately.

Agree with the pp that if your issue is that it's easier to have no glasses than 1, then no glasses is probably the better option... really that's a red flag that your drinking is an issue, even if you're not a full blown alcoholic. I'm not talking about crazy nights out, but at home most people manage to just have a glass and not find it difficult to stop there. I also raised an eyebrow when you said you talked about feeling the effects of having "just" half a bottle the night before. That's 3 units, which is already above the recommended limit - ok if it's an occasional evening out but that's a lot to be consuming on a regular basis. Another red flag is drinking when you're tired and had a hard day. One thing that helped me to cut out that kind of drinking was to find an alternative treat to wind down, eg I ordered some extremely good leaf teas with a special pot to make them in, so I had a "treat" to drink when tired.

Entirely depends on you. It’s all or nothing for me. Can stop completely with problems. Having “just one” I find so much harder.

@Thepeopleversuswork i think I may be peri as well, although it feels a bit early. My ability to handle the next day after alcohol has absolutely fallen off a cliff. Plus sleep. Plus ridiculously heavy periods. Peri is my working hypothesis atm.

Yep. You might just find you want to lean into it a bit!

@sunnydayhereandnow i agree yes I do, like a very many people in this country, drink too much and recently feel it has tipped over into that territory for sure. But my point about "just" half a bottle was only that this didn't used to be a problem to recover from or sleep after. It suddenly is. It's not exactly a bender in the grand scheme of things, but it makes me feel as though I've had much more the next day, and impacts my ability to parent much more than it ever used to impact my ability to send emails and sit in meetings (I still work, but parenting is the activity specifically impacted).

I've found dry Jan surprisingly easy so I'm not concerned. But once a bottle is open we tend to get through it is all. If I don't start and I've made the decision, I don't agonise.

im going to try and stay extremely moderate but now that I've started to feel this way, if it does step back up I will do a more extended period off it and go from there

You are surprised at how easily you can go a month without drinking?

I think a lot of people who do Dry January find it easier than they might have expected. I hope your comment was intended to be supportive ....

Thanks @NeedToChangeName !

yes I can confirm I'm surprised to find that dry Jan is easier than giving up chocolate for Lent, easier than trying to stick to a low carb diet and forgo bread, etc. As someone who enjoys the taste of wine, whose husband family and friends like a drink too, I thought it would be more difficult. I'm going to take that as a positive not a negative @Coyoacan