Non Kennel Club Lab

[purplemonkey12]

More of a WIBU! We got a Lab puppy in October. At the time, they were advertised as KC-registered Labs. The breeder sent us the details of both the mother and father and we saw both dogs. We paid 1300 for the puppy (which is a lot for us!). The vendor told us that she was in the process of registering the puppies and would send us the details.
I'm not quite sure what's happened with the vendor, but she seems to have had a bit of a meltdown (I think a family crisis) - and either hasn't or can't register the puppies. I'm honestly not sure what's going on. She's stopped responding to texts etc. A friend of ours also has one of the puppies and she's not responding to them either. We (obvs) love our puppy, but we also might want to breed from her and so the KC registration is important. Just not quite sure where to go from here! Any thoughts?!

Nowhere in the post mentions a dog having health conditions.

as he was also a chunk cheaper due to the conditions.

i presumed by conditions the poster meant health conditions

but now i see the posters bought a non KC registered puppy for a “chunk cheaper” because she agreed not to breed

Sounds ideal

If £1300 was a lot for you I’m intrigued how you are going to pay for the relevant health tests, stud fees, vet checks etc

"Might want to breed from her"

Says it all.

That was exceptionally cheap for a KC registered lab, OP.

Ours was £3000 in 2021. Working black lab from KC reg working black lab lines.

Prices have dropped hugely, the working lab we bought in 2021 was more than twice as expensive as the one we bought in 2023

£1300 is about right for a KC registered Labrador.

2021 was peak pandemic when prices were through the roof. They're slowly coming back down to normal. Our KC registered beagle was £650 in 2018.

Actually, £3k is incredibly expensive for a KC registered lab, and unscrupulous breeders capitalised on the increased demand during the pandemic by over-charging. Please don't state things as facts when you clearly don't know anything about how much labs should cost.

Edited as I forgot to quote
I never said he came with any health issues, nor did he come with any. He has yearly checks when he has vaccinations etc and has never had one problem, hence me saying that.

It does sound a little off but my wording was probably wrong. Due to not receiving papers he was about 100 cheaper than ones with papers. I bought my lad simply due to knowing of the breeder of him through a circle of friends in equestrian circles. It wasn't a price thing he was chosen it was more through having connections. Chunk cheaper sounds bad rereading it and yes comes across badly!

but why wasn’t he KC reg?

Absolutely no inbreeding, I certainly would not have entertained that. I saw both papers to mum and dad, both seperate lines and also checked them out elsewhere, it was simply due to family not wanting their large breedlines from being used by folks who wanted to breed on with them They had more than one family line bitches/dogs as they bred and trained gundogs.
It admittedly comes across as confusing but it was quite clear in person. To compensate for their choice to do this he was a little cheaper but that was not what swung it, price didn't come into it as the reason why we bought him. My lads breeder was recommended via a good friend that moved in the breeders shooting circle, not a circle I am part of though.

The litter has been falsely advertised. You could contact Action Fraud and report the breeder, and report her to wherever she placed the advert.
You could also consider taking her to the small claims court, but there's no guarantee you'd get a refund.
The litter should have been registered before you paid for the puppy, so the court might decide you chose to go ahead with the purchase knowing the pup had not been registered.

Many thoughts, the first being do not breed your dog. The second being that KC registration in no way assures the health or well being of any dog you might buy, or indeed its parents.

KC doesn't guarantee it's not from a puppy farm
https://www.janettaharvey.com/puppy-farming/kennel-club-registers-puppy-farm-puppies/

Suck it up. Shes still your gorgeous girl and please don't breed from her, there's too many unwanted pups in the world

Please don’t breed. Labs are the highest numerically registered breed, the co-efficient needs thorough checking of that line. £1300 is a very elevated price unless you’ve seen and verified all breed health checks (elbow, hip, eyes as a bare minimum). I’d say you’ve been done. Last time I bought a KC registered pup, the paperwork was handed over on the day, which isn’t always the case, I’ve had it posted to me too. However, she sounds like she’s unlikely to send it to you at this point.

Nothing like a quick backtrack

Please do not breed from her. The nation is overrun with puppies from puppy farmers and ignorant breeders. How would you know where to start with ensuring you have selected healthy bloodlines for temperament, genetics and all the rest of the specifics that go into a well bred, sound, dog. It takes decades of experience to produce quality puppies. That said, I hope you enjoy your new pup.

I'm naff at explaining via word, I'll try my best.

The lady that bred my lad, her father who we also met at their home allowed his daughter to breed one litter from the bitch who she was given to by her father. The lady wanted to breed her the once and then spay her and he agreed but also said he didn't want the line from her 'ruining' with folks who in his words would use his long line of dogs being bred from so to discourage this he said no papers were to be given. It all sounds a little strange admittedly but face to face and speaking to him it was a case of somebody who just didn't want his dogs being bred from by others outside of his immediate family and to protect what was his so to speak. He used to breed and train gundogs and still runs gundog competitions now. His choice, I didn't push him on it as it made no difference to us as we were getting a cracking and lovely pup who we never had any intention of breeding from anyway. We have genuinely been stopped during walks and asked if he was entire as they would be interested in using him as a stud, he really is a cracking dog.
Were papers an essential add on to us? No, not as long as the dogs were healthy and we were happy with what we saw. I've had KC Labs in the past so I had a good idea of what we were looking for and we walked away happy. He was slightly cheaper having no papers but price wasn't an issue tbh as long as the pup was 100%.
If I wasn't experienced enough or if it was my first pup then I'd have walked away as a first buy but as I say I did plenty of checks on this line with no flags and I can still pick up the phone to her now if I felt the need.
Looking back at it now it was possibly a case of a man who was ott proud and picky of his dogs line.
One of his line is now snoring his head off next to me and hasn't a care in the World other than a nudge for a belly rub.

You’ve been had

A Part trained FTW from FTCH lines isn’t £3k
Not even kennels like Drakeshead charge that for puppies

And anywhere inviting you all for an annual get together is clearly targeting the first time pet owner. No one with a working lab for actual work would give a crap about that, it’s not a ‘perk’ and it’s not something that marks a breeder as credible in any way. It’s just a gimmick that pet owners would find cute

The lady wanted to breed her the once and then spay her and he agreed but also said he didn't want the line from her 'ruining' with folks who in his words would use his long line of dogs being bred from so to discourage this he said no papers were to be given. It all sounds a little strange admittedly

Sounds like bollocks to me. The same could have been achieved with an endorsement on the KC registration. I've never heard of one good reason not to register a litter from KC parents. I've seen all sorts of dubious excuses on adverts though.

No good reason not to KC reg - only bad ones.

Look up the parents on the Kennel Club site, you can stick their reg. names and affixes in and see their details, registered litters etc. (DM me if you like with the relevant names, it needs to be the full affix and name, spelt accurately!)

Recently the KC has had some issues sending out paperwork, but IF registrations have been sent in, you'd be able to check that with the KC - the fact the breeder has ghosted you speaks volumes tbh!

If you have it in writing that the pups you and your friend have would be KC registered, or have an advert stating they will be, you could take legal action (small claims, trading standards, local authority licencing...).

Don’t breed from a KC registered dog either, as they are so inbreed they often have a few issues! Non pedigree dogs are usually healthier.

1300 is cheap for a KC registered Lab.
That is usually what you would pay for a non pedigree (though pure breed still) Lab.

@Knavesmirelass

Your breeder was a scammer.

He could have got the puppies KC registered and added an endorsement preventing breeding