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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

4 year old sleeping and partner's attitude

110 replies

Wahwahwah82 · 18/01/2024 13:36

Hello, looking for some advice please. I have tried not to make this too long but have failed at the first hurdle sorry.
So 4 year old DS started school in September, he's one of the youngest in his year. I'm pregnant with second DS, due in a couple of months.
4 year old has always had 'trouble' with sleep since being in his own room from about 9 months - multiple wake ups, and particularly irritated if DP went to settle him instead of me. Prior to that I co-slept, and he was not a napper either - 30 min naps at the most 😩 Anyway, I have always just taken it as that's how he is and eventually he'll grow out of it. His sleep has gradually improved over time, and since about age 3, he's managed alot of nights without waking, or with maybe 1 wake up. When he was younger would sometimes have night terrors, and he has a very overactive mind, which also seems to play into lots of dreams - good and bad. If he's poorly this can understandably go out of the window and may take a few weeks to reset. Have also used reward charts a couple of times in the last year which have gone down well.

Over the last 4 years, DP has continually insisted that he should be able to sleep through (even as a baby), insisted on trying cry it out to 'teach him' not to keep waking up, and generally (in my view) shows no empathy or understanding of his own child and that he's an individual. We tried CIO when DS was about 1 yr old, and he literally threw himself out of his cot in distress after several nights of no progress whatsoever, so I put my foot down.

DP will constantly compare to other kids but conveniently ignores those whose sleep is similar to our DS'. He has also always been a complete prick to DS about his sleep. He will shout and swear if DS wakes up (even if I am the one who has gone to settle him), which just causes so much tension, and would shout and scream at DS if he was settling him (and then wonder why he wouldn't go back to sleep!) So got to the point where I have done most bed times for the last couple of years as DS doesn't want DP to do it, and I can't take the shouting and upset. If I go out in the eve, DP will do bedtime, and DS has become slightly better about it as he's gotten older, but is vocal about not being happy about it 😄 DP generally also quite regularly speaks to him in an irritated and condescending way, as though he's a constant nuisance. DS picks up on this and asks him to stop. DP will then shout at him, DS shouts back and tells DS to stop shouting (whilst shouting) 🤦🏾‍♀️. I have tried to explain the futility of this approach but he'll try for a few hours and then revert to type. No one else speaks to DS in this way (teachers, grandparents, family friends etc) so DP I think knows it's not ok.

Anyway, so DS2 is on the way, we have moved DS1 into his new bedroom over Christmas to give him time to get used to it. He loves his room and slept fine the first couple of nights. Was poorly over most of Xmas, and in the first 2 weeks of Jan, has just got well again. His sleep has been disturbed since Xmas, with a couple of wake ups each night. Not long ones - he literally resettles within a couple of mins, but wants the comfort of someone lying with him, which we haven't had to do for a long time - would usually just be a cuddle and then he would lie back down by himself, and I'd wait until he dozed back off and then leave. Wake ups have been consistently around 11.30pm and then 2am. He's clearly having a nightmare during the 11pm wake up as you can hear him shouting in his sleep. Then he wakes and either calls for me, or will come into our room. He has no interest in getting in our bed, he just wants one of us to reassure him as he goes back to sleep. DP will lecture him (often in the middle of the night) about how he shouldn't call out, and if he comes into our room in the morning (6am) tells him off for not staying in his room until his alarm has gone off at 6.30. I tend to just get up and take him back to him room and sit and chat until 6.30 or read a book or just have a cuddle.

DP has decided the recent wake ups are all my fault - he thinks the fact that DS likes someone with him as he falls asleep has created this problem (but completely ignores that he's been sleeping through happily in his other room for the last year). I'm open to changing how I do bedtime, but think this is more about change and DS' various anxieties: new school (where he is still learning to navigate new friendships and fallouts etc), long days in a new environment (he is in breakfast club from 8am and afterschool until about 5pm 4 days a week), new bedroom, new baby on the way. He is 4, but his emotional intelligence is quite advanced and he can articulate his feelings quite well for his age. He's told me he is scared in his new room at night e.g. because of different shadows (something he also used to worry about in his old room), he hates school (and will dwell on very small incidents despite clearly having had a good day), and he is worried about me (he can see me struggling physically sometimes as pregnancy progresses), and worried about me and DP arguing (which we have started to do as both tired) and daddy when he shouts. He would share these worries with me but not his dad, who usually just fobs him off or doesn't really listen.

I've explained all this to DP, but everything is very black and white to him, and he only focuses on quick fixes, he cannot see an issue as having multiple parts. Had a humongous row today and I was honest and said I fear when DS2 is born, and DS1's behaviour likely goes down the pan due to the massive change, and DP will not be able to handle it and I will have the stress of trying to keep the peace and deal with newborn. I already feel like a referee, and DS has been increasingly vocal about how he 'doesn't like daddy ,and wants him to live somewhere else' 😬 The saddest thing is DP is actually very caring, but for some reason repeatedly fails to be able to extend that care and compassion to his son. Every once in a while he pulls his head out of his arse and then feels guitly and makes a conscious effort to be better, but it doesn't last.

Sorry, this has gone on a bit, but any advice on the sleep, and whether this is likely just another phase, or something more drastic needed? Like I said, I'm happy to consider how I might change things at bedtime to help, but I won't allow DP to bully DS into submission based on unrealistic expectations, or his own resentment at being woken up etc. But perhaps I'm the one being a prick here?

  • sorry, edited as something wierd happened to the formatting!
OP posts:
hellsBells246 · 18/01/2024 20:30

Why the actual hell did you think to have another dc with your awful h?? Your ds has more emotional awareness than your h!

Your h is an abusive pig.

I'd have dumped him years ago. Why are you still with him?

Your poor little ds.

Meatymeatytimetoeaty · 18/01/2024 20:31

I wonder at your choice to have another child with this awful man.

JWhipple · 18/01/2024 21:02

Get rid of your abusive partner.
Imagine If he screamed at you every time you got up in the night to go to the toilet or get a drink
How would your sleep pattern be? Your anxiety levels?

OCDmama · 18/01/2024 21:33

Your DP is an child abusing bully and you are complicit. Tbh, you both disgust me. Why did you choose to have a second child with this man?

Leave him and actually do the right thing by your children. I can't believe you don't see what's really going on here.

Eaglemom · 18/01/2024 21:36

Wahwahwah82 · 18/01/2024 16:40

Thanks everyone, yes DP's behaviour is a problem. Although not to make excuses but just to clarify, he has not sworn at DS, he swears in the night, whilst lying in bed after having been woken up. And whilst I go to resettle... But not not in front of DS, although he does shout, and in the grand scheme of things, it's not much better.
And to be clear, someone else questioned his behaviour towards me aswell, and assumed it would be the same. It's really not, which is what makes it so difficult to understand sometimes really. I only saw this side of him once DS was born, and we'd been together about 5 years. I thought he would be an excellent dad, and am really disappointed in how things have turned out. He can be excellent with DS at times, and they have great fun, but it seems to be on DPs terms, and if he's in a bad mood, or tired, DS gets short shrift.

@ShoePalaver and others ,thank you for your understanding, and @ShoePalaver it sounds like you have been going through something similar - you have my sympathies. Yes I have spent alot of time, especially in the first couple of years second guessing myself, but gave DP an ultimatum when DS was about 2 and to be fair, he did improve alot and we got back on track in our relationship and his relationship with DS has been much better (hence trying for a second DC). It has gone downhill again since Sept when DS started school, and he's needed even more love and support - and leniance, which DP just cannot get his head around. I think some quiet intervention from his MIL may have also helped last time, and I'm thinking I may speak to her again. His dad is lovely now, but I think growing up showed similar traits in terms of the impatience and harshness, and DP has had enough insight at times to recognise this, but also to almost use it as an excuse for his behaviour, rather than try to break the cycle. My mum wasn't the best when I was growing up, but it has made me determined to be different, and I very rarely shout at DS, and if I do, I apologise, and we talk about why I got cross. DP would very rarely apologise, I think he sees it as weak, or maybe unnecessary because he is 'the parent' and therefore somehow this translates as a position of 'power'.

As someone else has mentioned, there is of course other context which I haven’t put in my OP - DP was made redundant in November out of the blue and has been panicked about money once I go on mat leave, and making sure that he is 'providing' and supporting us all. I'm more relaxed about it, at best we need to manage for 12 months whilst I'm off (and my maternity package is not too bad), and then my salary will kick in again, but it really knocked him. The mad thing is he has got back on his feet incredibly quickly and has gone freelance and is fully booked until spring, so there's really nothing to worry about. But I think the stress of the whole experience is contributing and he is not someone who can compartmentalise. If he's stressed, thw whole world knows about it.

I have spoken to him several times since DS was born about counselling to manage his frustrations, but he's never done it. I think he's scared to actually. But I had already decided that if he doesn't start recognising his part in all of this, and DS2 is born and nothing has changed, then he's out the door. I guess the sleep thing has brought it all to the surface and put me back in that place of second guessing myself, hence my OP, when deep down I already knew it was nothing to worry about, and it's actually his attitude that is the problem.

Absolutely nothing at all you have said excuses the disgusting way he is bullying your son.

Lots of abusers are fine to their partner but abuse the child.

You really need to think of that little boy and the horrible childhood he is having because of his vile Dad.

You asked for advice and you have been given it …. Are you going to listen and actually protect your son from this awful emotional abuse?

The only way is to split up, he will not change. I have no idea how you could stomach being with him having seen him treat your child like this.

DeeCeeCherry · 18/01/2024 21:46

In your shoes I wouldn't have DP in my house tbh. He has anger issues with a 4 year old. He's an idiot who will kill his own son's self esteem. You're having another baby, his irritation will be off the scale and he'll compare them too. Your poor son. He can't advocate for himself but you as his mother should be advocating for him and getting his dad removed. It all depends how much your son truly matters to you, and whether you've written this post thinking people are going to be able to tell you how to turn a ignorant bully into sweetness and light.

ShoePalaver · 18/01/2024 21:57

AlarmBellsAndWhistles · 18/01/2024 20:22

I really feel for you - I'm having a similar experience although my DC is a bit younger than your DS. Not a good sleeper and DP just cannot handle when DC cries and won't settle.

DP sometimes apologises afterwards but can't seem to stay calm in the moment. It means I do most night wakings and I always wake up and watch/listen when DP does them. Which makes him more stressed and angry.

And like you, DP is lovely the rest of the time and usually has a great time with DC during the daytime.

I've been thinking about discussing this with our health visitor so that DP can hear from someone else that his behaviour is not ok. And maybe the health visitor can suggest some strategies for DP - even just walking away. Might be an idea for you too? (I'm scared where this might lead though.)

Sorry, I don't have any real advice for you. But I know the guilt and stress and fear you might be feeling over this. You're not alone.

Edited

I think mentioning to the HV is a good idea, the temptation is to hide it and pretend everything is ok. However if everything is really ok then there's nothing to hide and it's no different to asking for help with any other aspect of parenting. And at least if it all goes wrong and you end up splitting there will be a record in case he starts wanting 50 50 custody.

Zooeyzo · 18/01/2024 22:00

This is horrible OP. 4 is only very young and lots of older kid's need a parent cuddle to go to sleep.

GabriellaMontez · 18/01/2024 22:17

A very long post to say your husband is a cunt.

With a long follow up to justify it.

Moier · 18/01/2024 22:43

I'm laid here crying for your son.
What an horrible horrible Father he has..
All this abuse and mental torture will carry on into his adult life.
Please please let your partner read these replies then either get rid of him or report him to social services.

Caliope27 · 18/01/2024 22:47

Protect your children. FFS get rid of this abuser.

Hankunamatata · 18/01/2024 23:01

Would dp agree to parenting programme. Me and dh found the incredible years programme useful - we did it via zoom. Helped give us some rules and structure and how to engage with dc in a postive way.

Ihaveoflate · 18/01/2024 23:09

Your post was really hard to read. I have a 4 yo who still wakes at night. We bought her a double bed when she was 2 and we take it in turns to get in with her when she calls us. She goes back to sleep and one parent gets an unbroken night. We will keep doing this for as long as she needs it.

I cannot imagine berating and belittling my small child for needing comfort in the night. And if my husband did, he would absolutely be gone if he didn't sort his shit out immediately.

AnneLovesGilbert · 18/01/2024 23:11

Yeah, your long justification of the abuse update makes it even worse.

AutumnFroglets · 18/01/2024 23:13

I already feel like a referee, and DS has been increasingly vocal about how he 'doesn't like daddy ,and wants him to live somewhere else'

Listen to what your son is saying. If your DH bullies and shouts at his young child in front of you, what does he do to him when you go out? Your child is scared of his own father.
^^

Chickpea17 · 18/01/2024 23:23

To be honest if it with a woman doing all those things to her kids I would be thinking ptsd. Maybe talk to your dh about seeing a doctor. More and more studies are coming out about men with ptsd. I'm not saying this make it ok I'm just saying your dh as issues, one way or another and it needs to be dealt with.

Chickpea17 · 18/01/2024 23:29

See what you think. I hope things get better.
www.nct.org.uk/life-parent/emotions/postnatal-depression-dads-and-co-parents-10-things-you-should-know

Snowdogsmitten · 18/01/2024 23:33

DS has been increasingly vocal about how he 'doesn't like daddy ,and wants him to live somewhere else'

Jesus fucking Christ, this is heartbreaking. This little person knows his father is horrible to him, he knows that his father makes him feel frightened and sad, and he’s telling you so. Over and over. His father is an utter, utter failure. Do something. Protect that little boy.

Mistressofnone · 18/01/2024 23:33

Please protect your little boy OP. 4 is so young. I still go in with my 6 year old for the second half of the night and our 3 year old takes my spot next to DH. We love waking up to the smiles.

It is heartbreaking to read the abuse your son is enduring - and recognising. I hope you have family who you can turn to. If someone outside of your home spoke to your son that way, would you allow it?

Rorymyers · 18/01/2024 23:34

Spot on.!!!

Rorymyers · 18/01/2024 23:43

@op you said : But I think the stress of the whole experience is contributing and he is not someone who can compartmentalise. If he's stressed, thw whole world knows about it.

So being stressed gives all parents the right to be absolute shyts to their kids????

You know the problem op. You just wanted strangers to judge and tell you what you want to hear and i'm sure every response here has validated the feelings and thoughts you have about how much of a shyt show your DH is

Rorymyers · 18/01/2024 23:45

Rorymyers · 18/01/2024 23:34

Spot on.!!!

@GabriellaMontez spot on!!!!!

Frangipanyoul8r · 18/01/2024 23:54

This sleeping through and lack of comfort is absolute nonsense. Lots of adults have a warm partner to snuggle with at night. And most adults wake in the night for a wee, to have a sip of water or just check the time and go back to sleep.

Your DH’s expectations are cruel and based on parenting bullshit.

elm26 · 18/01/2024 23:55

I'm laying in bed with tears rolling down my face and thanking my lucky stars that I chose to have a baby with a good, kind and decent man that shows our DD unconditional love and comfort whatever time of day or night she needs it.

FWIW, my stepsister (I wish I could describe how I know her without calling her my stepsister) had 2 kids removed from her and permanently adopted out because the vile cretin excuse of a father started like yours did, shouting and swearing until eventually he lost his rag and ended up beating both of the kids so violently that the neighbours called the police and my nephew had a bleed on his brain. She stayed with him and then fell pregnant again and her third baby was removed just after birth. Our family have disowned her and she now lives a very shit and lonely life, still with the absolute oxygen thief.

Don't be the woman who chooses a man over her kids.

mathanxiety · 19/01/2024 00:05

Chickpea17 · 18/01/2024 23:23

To be honest if it with a woman doing all those things to her kids I would be thinking ptsd. Maybe talk to your dh about seeing a doctor. More and more studies are coming out about men with ptsd. I'm not saying this make it ok I'm just saying your dh as issues, one way or another and it needs to be dealt with.

It needs to be dealt with by leaving him and protecting the child so the child doesn't end up with cPTSD. Adverse childhood experiences are a major contributing factor in all sorts of serious mental health problems in later life.

But having lived with a man who behaved like the PP's partner, I have no patience for the idea that it's male PND or PTSD that causes this behaviour.

If it's a MH issue it's far more likely to be a personality disorder, but not all abuse is down to PDs. Some people are just cruel.