4 year old sleeping and partner's attitude

[Wahwahwah82]

Hello, looking for some advice please. I have tried not to make this too long but have failed at the first hurdle sorry.
So 4 year old DS started school in September, he's one of the youngest in his year. I'm pregnant with second DS, due in a couple of months.
4 year old has always had 'trouble' with sleep since being in his own room from about 9 months - multiple wake ups, and particularly irritated if DP went to settle him instead of me. Prior to that I co-slept, and he was not a napper either - 30 min naps at the most 😩 Anyway, I have always just taken it as that's how he is and eventually he'll grow out of it. His sleep has gradually improved over time, and since about age 3, he's managed alot of nights without waking, or with maybe 1 wake up. When he was younger would sometimes have night terrors, and he has a very overactive mind, which also seems to play into lots of dreams - good and bad. If he's poorly this can understandably go out of the window and may take a few weeks to reset. Have also used reward charts a couple of times in the last year which have gone down well.

Over the last 4 years, DP has continually insisted that he should be able to sleep through (even as a baby), insisted on trying cry it out to 'teach him' not to keep waking up, and generally (in my view) shows no empathy or understanding of his own child and that he's an individual. We tried CIO when DS was about 1 yr old, and he literally threw himself out of his cot in distress after several nights of no progress whatsoever, so I put my foot down.

DP will constantly compare to other kids but conveniently ignores those whose sleep is similar to our DS'. He has also always been a complete prick to DS about his sleep. He will shout and swear if DS wakes up (even if I am the one who has gone to settle him), which just causes so much tension, and would shout and scream at DS if he was settling him (and then wonder why he wouldn't go back to sleep!) So got to the point where I have done most bed times for the last couple of years as DS doesn't want DP to do it, and I can't take the shouting and upset. If I go out in the eve, DP will do bedtime, and DS has become slightly better about it as he's gotten older, but is vocal about not being happy about it 😄 DP generally also quite regularly speaks to him in an irritated and condescending way, as though he's a constant nuisance. DS picks up on this and asks him to stop. DP will then shout at him, DS shouts back and tells DS to stop shouting (whilst shouting) 🤦🏾‍♀️. I have tried to explain the futility of this approach but he'll try for a few hours and then revert to type. No one else speaks to DS in this way (teachers, grandparents, family friends etc) so DP I think knows it's not ok.

Anyway, so DS2 is on the way, we have moved DS1 into his new bedroom over Christmas to give him time to get used to it. He loves his room and slept fine the first couple of nights. Was poorly over most of Xmas, and in the first 2 weeks of Jan, has just got well again. His sleep has been disturbed since Xmas, with a couple of wake ups each night. Not long ones - he literally resettles within a couple of mins, but wants the comfort of someone lying with him, which we haven't had to do for a long time - would usually just be a cuddle and then he would lie back down by himself, and I'd wait until he dozed back off and then leave. Wake ups have been consistently around 11.30pm and then 2am. He's clearly having a nightmare during the 11pm wake up as you can hear him shouting in his sleep. Then he wakes and either calls for me, or will come into our room. He has no interest in getting in our bed, he just wants one of us to reassure him as he goes back to sleep. DP will lecture him (often in the middle of the night) about how he shouldn't call out, and if he comes into our room in the morning (6am) tells him off for not staying in his room until his alarm has gone off at 6.30. I tend to just get up and take him back to him room and sit and chat until 6.30 or read a book or just have a cuddle.

DP has decided the recent wake ups are all my fault - he thinks the fact that DS likes someone with him as he falls asleep has created this problem (but completely ignores that he's been sleeping through happily in his other room for the last year). I'm open to changing how I do bedtime, but think this is more about change and DS' various anxieties: new school (where he is still learning to navigate new friendships and fallouts etc), long days in a new environment (he is in breakfast club from 8am and afterschool until about 5pm 4 days a week), new bedroom, new baby on the way. He is 4, but his emotional intelligence is quite advanced and he can articulate his feelings quite well for his age. He's told me he is scared in his new room at night e.g. because of different shadows (something he also used to worry about in his old room), he hates school (and will dwell on very small incidents despite clearly having had a good day), and he is worried about me (he can see me struggling physically sometimes as pregnancy progresses), and worried about me and DP arguing (which we have started to do as both tired) and daddy when he shouts. He would share these worries with me but not his dad, who usually just fobs him off or doesn't really listen.

I've explained all this to DP, but everything is very black and white to him, and he only focuses on quick fixes, he cannot see an issue as having multiple parts. Had a humongous row today and I was honest and said I fear when DS2 is born, and DS1's behaviour likely goes down the pan due to the massive change, and DP will not be able to handle it and I will have the stress of trying to keep the peace and deal with newborn. I already feel like a referee, and DS has been increasingly vocal about how he 'doesn't like daddy ,and wants him to live somewhere else' 😬 The saddest thing is DP is actually very caring, but for some reason repeatedly fails to be able to extend that care and compassion to his son. Every once in a while he pulls his head out of his arse and then feels guitly and makes a conscious effort to be better, but it doesn't last.

Sorry, this has gone on a bit, but any advice on the sleep, and whether this is likely just another phase, or something more drastic needed? Like I said, I'm happy to consider how I might change things at bedtime to help, but I won't allow DP to bully DS into submission based on unrealistic expectations, or his own resentment at being woken up etc. But perhaps I'm the one being a prick here?

• sorry, edited as something wierd happened to the formatting!

Some kids just don't sleep through. My now 9.5yr old never slept through til she was 6 and it's only in the last year that she's consistently slept in her own bed every night. Her now 7yr old sister is quite different and always has been, sleeping through from very young babyhood.

Your son isn't the problem, of course: your horrible partner is. But I think you know that.

He needs to agree to get help to change before the new baby comes or go and find somewhere else to live.

This is the first time I have ever been driven to post this very unhelpful comment, but... why the fuck are you having a second child with this abusive monster? If you stay with this man, you are utterly failing to protect your children.

I am honestly gobsmacked that someone can type out what you have just typed put and not realise what a vile man you are living with and how you are allowing your son to be subjected to emotional abuse.

Your partner is the problem

Your partner needs very urgent counselling to control his abusive very angry behaviour to a 4 year old. WHAT will he do to a new born baby? Can he move out?

I think you should prepare to be a single parent. It can't be as bad as the life you and your son are currently living.

Thanks everyone, yes DP's behaviour is a problem. Although not to make excuses but just to clarify, he has not sworn at DS, he swears in the night, whilst lying in bed after having been woken up. And whilst I go to resettle... But not not in front of DS, although he does shout, and in the grand scheme of things, it's not much better.
And to be clear, someone else questioned his behaviour towards me aswell, and assumed it would be the same. It's really not, which is what makes it so difficult to understand sometimes really. I only saw this side of him once DS was born, and we'd been together about 5 years. I thought he would be an excellent dad, and am really disappointed in how things have turned out. He can be excellent with DS at times, and they have great fun, but it seems to be on DPs terms, and if he's in a bad mood, or tired, DS gets short shrift.

@ShoePalaver and others ,thank you for your understanding, and @ShoePalaver it sounds like you have been going through something similar - you have my sympathies. Yes I have spent alot of time, especially in the first couple of years second guessing myself, but gave DP an ultimatum when DS was about 2 and to be fair, he did improve alot and we got back on track in our relationship and his relationship with DS has been much better (hence trying for a second DC). It has gone downhill again since Sept when DS started school, and he's needed even more love and support - and leniance, which DP just cannot get his head around. I think some quiet intervention from his MIL may have also helped last time, and I'm thinking I may speak to her again. His dad is lovely now, but I think growing up showed similar traits in terms of the impatience and harshness, and DP has had enough insight at times to recognise this, but also to almost use it as an excuse for his behaviour, rather than try to break the cycle. My mum wasn't the best when I was growing up, but it has made me determined to be different, and I very rarely shout at DS, and if I do, I apologise, and we talk about why I got cross. DP would very rarely apologise, I think he sees it as weak, or maybe unnecessary because he is 'the parent' and therefore somehow this translates as a position of 'power'.

As someone else has mentioned, there is of course other context which I haven’t put in my OP - DP was made redundant in November out of the blue and has been panicked about money once I go on mat leave, and making sure that he is 'providing' and supporting us all. I'm more relaxed about it, at best we need to manage for 12 months whilst I'm off (and my maternity package is not too bad), and then my salary will kick in again, but it really knocked him. The mad thing is he has got back on his feet incredibly quickly and has gone freelance and is fully booked until spring, so there's really nothing to worry about. But I think the stress of the whole experience is contributing and he is not someone who can compartmentalise. If he's stressed, thw whole world knows about it.

I have spoken to him several times since DS was born about counselling to manage his frustrations, but he's never done it. I think he's scared to actually. But I had already decided that if he doesn't start recognising his part in all of this, and DS2 is born and nothing has changed, then he's out the door. I guess the sleep thing has brought it all to the surface and put me back in that place of second guessing myself, hence my OP, when deep down I already knew it was nothing to worry about, and it's actually his attitude that is the problem.

I had massive sleep issues as a child (undiagnosed SEN and Ehlers Danlos, eventually diagnosed in my 20s). It was a nightmare for my poor parents who had broken sleep until I was much older than your DS.

They never once treated me like your DP treats your DS. I was never shouted at, they never scared me or punished me for my issues which included insomnia, sleep walking and bedwetting.

They spent a lot of time and effort on helping me. I saw all sorts of specialists as a child. I Every specialist I saw advised my parents not to turn bedtime into a battle as stress, conflict and upset would only make things worse. Things got better with consistent boundaries and as I became secure that I could always get into bed with Mum and Dad when scared, that I could always safely call them when I needed them e.g. I was unwell. I would never be shouted at or made to feel they wouldn't meet my needs.

Your poor little boy is only 4 and he's worrying about his mum and saying he wishes Daddy lived somewhere else. Heartbreaking.

would shout and scream at DS if he was settling him

I didn’t get much past this ^ in your OP. The sheer disgust that you’ve not only stayed with this piece of shit but are having another child with him stopped me from reading any further.

I hope someone recognises you from your post and reports the pair of you to SS.

Your son's father is co-sleeping with you and having a go at a child for not being able to regulate himself at night... but your husband is showing no evidence of regulating his own emotions.

Sounds like he is a very spoilt child, the father that is.
Pack him off to your in-laws and you and your son might actually have restful night that you both need.

Your situation sounds remarkably similar to mine. There are less than 2 years between my children and I don't think I realised any warning signs before getting pregnant with the second, but things rapidly deteriorated after the birth of nr 2. I was genuinely shocked and in disbelief for a while and almost didn't dare say anything but after a while I started calling him out every time and things have improved no doubt. But underlying it there's a strange attitude that is more than a difference in parenting styles. I have got to the point now that I feel the relationship is over as I can't get past the way he is with the children. That sounds mad I know as why didn't I think that the first time he shouted at my child, but when you've known someone a long time it is hard to accept they are not who you thought

So it sounds like you have already tried to sort this, that good to hear!

Unfortunately, and I say this as someone with a similar issue, when your with someone who is unintentionally passing on their shitty childhood treatment, it's very very hard to get them to see it. Often cos they know they aren't as bad as the parent was to them. But it's a crap comparator, cos by any other standard they are being, well, shitty - just less than what they knew to be normal.

He needs to get help, I'd give him that ultimatum if it were me cos you cannot continue as you are it's just not fair on you & your son.

Not a helpful response. The OP is clearly seeking help. Social services won't be interested unless there's physical abuse or neglect. Shouting at children is not illegal.

Your partner is a cunt to your child. That’s the problem.

And he will tell school. My Dd did. Your husband sounds very very much like my ex.

Note exh.

You can sort of paper over the awfulness of an abusive h with one child - one child who sounds actually very well behaved and sweet - but once you have a baby and a 5 yo (I had the same gap) it becomes too difficult to have someone actively working against the smooth running of home life, actively working against giving your children a secure and happy childhood.

Report “the pair of you”? The Op is a victim of domestic abuse. She’s trying to work her way through the fog that abusers shroud you in. She’s not some one to be reported ffs

The OP is looking for solutions to make her DS sleep better so that her DP kicks off less and she doesn't have to feel like a 'referee' between a 4 year old child and grown adult man, and she won't need to issue another ultimatum that she won't follow through with.

I agrée she needs to leave him.

The fact she thinks the sleep is the issue is part of the fog he’s created. I’m sure I asked for lots of “parenting tips” before realising exh was the problem.

And yes my children are much happier having a secure home with me, even though they still spend time with their father.

I disagree that the OP is a victim of domestic abuse; she even says in her update that her partner doesn't treat her the way he treats their son! She is standing by and allowing her child to be emotionally abused.

Do you mind me asking how much time he spends with them and is he better when he sees them less often?

Wow I love DP with all my heart and soul but he if ever spoke to our 3 year old like that he would be FINISHED!!

If he treated our cat like that he would be finished also.

FYI it will harder to fix the damage of emotional abuse in the future than to get your child to sleep now.

‘The saddest thing is DP is actually very caring,’ no OP, the saddest thing is you think this.

You are allowing your husband to make your small child very unhappy. The very least is counselling for your husband to resolve the need to assert his dominance over his own child and parenting classes to help him manage himself better in the moment.

You are deluded and fooling yourself playing happy families with this man leave or get it sorted for goodness sake.

Make plans to leave this abusive bully before he damages your son beyond repair.

No wonder the poor child doesn't sleep well.

You need to take this very seriously.

Make plans to leave.

Tell your family and your friends what is going on and ask for their quiet support. If you hesitate to open yp about this, ask yourself why, and ask yourself who you are protecting if you choose to say nothing.

If DP can’t admit that he has a problem and that he needs to solve it nothing will change. That is the basic fact. Something is always going to upset him: ds’s sleep, school issues, financial stress. His response is to lash out and act out and blame everyone and everything else for his angry, out of control, behavior.

If you want to stay married to this asshole then videotape one of his tantrums and play it back for him and tell him that change is non negotiable. He must go to therapy for anger management and he must be successful at reforming or he has to leave. There can’t be any room for excuses or self pity or whining or promises. He simply can’t stay if he can’t reform his behavior.

I really feel for you - I'm having a similar experience although my DC is a bit younger than your DS. Not a good sleeper and DP just cannot handle when DC cries and won't settle.

DP sometimes apologises afterwards but can't seem to stay calm in the moment. It means I do most night wakings and I always wake up and watch/listen when DP does them. Which makes him more stressed and angry.

And like you, DP is lovely the rest of the time and usually has a great time with DC during the daytime.

I've been thinking about discussing this with our health visitor so that DP can hear from someone else that his behaviour is not ok. And maybe the health visitor can suggest some strategies for DP - even just walking away. Might be an idea for you too? (I'm scared where this might lead though.)

Sorry, I don't have any real advice for you. But I know the guilt and stress and fear you might be feeling over this. You're not alone.