To say no! Twilight sessions (unpaid)

[LorlieS]

Can't sleep I'm so stressed!!
I'm working as a HLTA - paid hours 8.30 until 3.30.
Just picked up an email sent today telling me I need to attend two twilight sessions from after school until 6pm. Needless to say these will not be paid for and the first one is this week!
AIBU to say no?
Oh, and I also have a 3 yo and her childcare only runs until 4.30.

It's really misleading to describe that as 'technically unpaid'. You are paid and contracted for that day but you fulfil those working hours during the twilight sessions.

She's not working for free. Although it's a moot point now because apparently the OP has decided to just hand in her notice.

IT IS NOT UNPAID.

OP has misunderstood the terms of her employment.

No you're not misreading it. 🙄

Hi everyone - can I ask what twilight sessions are? DH is a teacher and they have training every week at his school for two hours (after school) but they also attend inset days - is it supposed to be one or the other?

No, it can be both, but INSET days are often replaced with twilight sessions, eg if the last day of term is a Monday, it's an INSET day but so staff can finish on the Friday the INSET day is "moved" to a couple of evenings instead.

Not necessarily anyone who you feel you know well enough to ask for a favour, though.

State schools in England have five INSET days per year. Schools will often replace one or two of these with disaggregated twilights. Generally speaking, 3 x 2hr twilights = 1 INSET day.

In addition, there will be directed time. This usually means a meeting after school every week. One hour is the norm but two hours is possible. In maintained schools the total directed time including teaching, duties, INSET, meetings and parents' evenings should not exceed 1265 hours. Academies are not bound by this but many choose to observe it nevertheless.

Thanks @enchantedsquirrelwood - I'm not sure what they have is a twilight session, it's just regular training once a week (usually behavioral management or such like I think). He definitely still goes to inset days all day so I'm guessing it's not quite the same set up.

In general, teachers are paid for inset/twilight sessions, but TAs are not. That's certainly the case in the 3 LA near me. Academies may be different.

OPs child is 3 isn't it? Hasn't started school yet. Play dates and sports clubs??

But i'm wondering what child care OP would have arranged WITH enough notice out of interest? DH doing it? Or gran doing extra with more notice?

It's weird that you're living hand to mouth but can just chuck your job in OP ...

Thanks @ThanksItHasPockets - so he is contracted to a set number of hours a week as a teacher which only covers the school day - should his contract also cover the additional directed time? What about PPA - is that part of the contracted hours?
Sorry for all the questions, he retrained late in life following lockdowns and we are both very much corporate private sector so the whole set up in schools is completely different to what we are previously used to!

No, if he is in a maintained school he is contracted for 1265 hours over the course of the year. This includes PPA. If you ask to read his contract it will all be stipulated in there. If you want additional context then the 'Burgundy Book' lays out the conditions of service for school teachers in maintained schools England and Wales. Academies are theoretically not bound by this but in my experience they tend to mirror it broadly.

It seems quite impulsive and knee jerk to decide to hand your notice in before you’ve even talked to the school about the difficulties this presents you with. You may be able to do the training at another time or miss it due to the short notice. You won’t know unless you have a conversation with them.

Have you discussed your wish to do an MSc with them and is it something they would potentially support?

Also is your husband in the NHS? If so, I’m surprised he can’t ask for emergency carers leave. Especially as you imply he is in a relatively junior role.

I will say, as a parent of a three year old at nursery, if DD grandparents were unable to step in and DH had a last minute meeting, our options are extra time at nursery or I step in (he does after school pick up as I am still working at that time). Im lucky to have flex in my work day but not every parent would, so I can understand the OP dilemma.
OP - you can't be the only one in this situation - is there no flex within the school to provide more notice?

So you are a HLTA who is incapable of discussing this with their employer like a grown up if you are that stressed about this.

Thats really depressing.

Well, quite.
I'M not going if YOU don't do this.
Great example for the kids.

Honesty ive never worked in a school that doesnt have twilight session's. Your childcare is not their concern. It will be in your contract. If it isnt then you go to the head and talk to them. You really are getting this way out of proportion. If they really have sprung this at last minute then you calmly tell the head you cant make this one as you dont have childcare however youll make arrangements for the future planned ones

In every school ive worked in staff have been able to bring children in on inset days if they dont have other arrangements.

If this is all too much for your mum you need to find alternative childcare. What would you do if she is ill or decides its all too much for her?

Say no, you just can’t do it because of child care. If one of my staff couldn’t attend training out of regular work hours I would accept that, especially at very short notice. What are they going to do or say that is so bad? The fact they have got you working like this makes me think you should work for someone more reasonable!
Maybe it is in your contract but it’s too short notice , it’s work not a prison sentence, push back.

Do you not know any kindly neighbours? Do you not have any friends where you live?

Tbh I find all this a bit confusing. Your op says you are paid until 3.30 and your childcare finishes at 4.30. You later say you usually finish at 4.45pm 'at the earliest' and that your mum minds DC. So this differs to the op and would suggest that staying to 6pm infrequently shouldn't be a big deal. What time does DH finish, can't he pick her up from your mum after work?

You claim it's unpaid even though many posters have explained about TOIL and inset days, you refuse to respond to that.

It's very clear you just don't want to do it.

Why do you keep saying you have no childcare, you took the job, that was the time to consider childcare. Use sitters.

Do you not meet up with anyone in the school holidays?

Sounds to me like your DH needs to take some leave to cover it for you - but the shortish notice is an issue but next week might be OK. I would get his head in a place that he also has responsibility to cover childcare occasionally now as you will need it later to maintain a job yourself. As to other childcare - if she is at a nursery do any of the nursery nurses do babysitting - thats always worth an ask as some of the younger ones like to for a bit extra and that means you have a back up plan and your child knows them. The other alternative is to look at what the training is for and whether it can be done any other way - say an alternative but similar course, online, on sat or one of your none work days, shared at another school in your group of schools (if that is how yours work) etc. ANy job has occasional things like this and you need to be flexible in the approach to managing it