To wonder what has happened to my Son's school

[k2493]

Just posting for thoughts

Both my kids have gone through the same secondary school. When my daughter started, the school was lovely and new with around 750 kids.

Fast forward to 2024 and there is now 1500 kids and it's become like a dictatorship.

Due to the number of kids, the school has put lines either side of the hallway that they have to walk within otherwise they get detention.

Every hallway is a one way system.

The minute they arrive in school, they have to remove their coats or it's detention even with no heating in the middle of winter. The other day my son arrived back to school to find that there were long queues outside while they did two uniform checks at the door. By the time he got in, he was frozen. Immediately he got shouted at for still having his coat on even though he had just stepped in from the cold.

He then went around the corner and got shouted at again even though he tried to explain it's really difficult to be expected to stay warm, keep moving and remove your coat all at the same time. Nope. Threaten with detention again.

AIBU to wonder what has happened to our education system? I'm lucky in that my son is quite strong minded and just brushes it off but what about the kids who's mental health this is impacting? Surely we want our kids to remember school as being enjoyable for their education and friendships rather than for being shouted at every two minutes for not walking between lines or not taking their coats off the minute they arrive in school?

And you don't think that private school might have a considerable head start with attitudes of parents towards learning?

I'm not condoning draconian, "flatten the grass" measures, but I don't think people really know how far south behaviour has gone in schools. Not the full on stabbing type bad behaviour, but low level shittyness.

Secondary school teacher here, This zero tolerance approach has leaked over from the USA and been adopted by many academies. More akin to prison than school. I think it’s appalling and would never teach in/send my kids to such a school l

If you need to ask, it can’t be explained 😊

Yep.
The vitriol against schools and teachers on here sums up why behaviour has deteriorated so badly. There is just no respect for teachers and kids learn that attitude from their parents.
If parents respected and supported schools then so would kids. Like you say, at DDs school there are none of the behaviour issues because the parents are invested in, and support, the school.

It has, sadly😞

But I would be lenient for a Y7 who always has their equipment and forgot something once for example. Also it's about being proportionate - a break time detention is enough for forgetting your ruler. It's annoying enough to make a student want to remember their equipment but not so harsh as to crush a DC for a mistake.

Apart from the not being able to take the blazer off they all sound sensible and the kind of rules at my DD's school. Nothing to be traumatised about.

But that's not what is being discussed on this thread, it is extreme controlling rules and harsh punishments.

Haven't been able to read all the thread but our school is exactly the same as OP's.

Not a new head - but the behaviour policy has got ridiculous... DD's behaviour is massively improved this year, but she's clocking up penalties for the most minor things. Completely devalues the punishment and makes it hard for us to support.

Obviously different but trainers were allowed at my Dd's primary and even Y6s weren't turning up with expensive trainers as far as I was aware. It was just the usual cheap ones like you'd send them in for P.E. My DS for Y10 & 11 was at a non-uniform college - again the DC just wore basic clothes/trainers. It's not like non-uniform day where it's a novelty.

I here you having the same problem with primary. In order to control the children as they can't get them to stand in a line is to make them sit on a wet outside floor until there name is called. My daughter year 6 I may add came home with wet knickers and I lost my rag at the school and their response was......... Yes we realise it was a mistake to make them sit on a wet cold floor we will be making them kneel instead like what the actual *

This sounds very odd and arbitrary. Don’t they have pegs for their coats? Ever since Covid my daughter’s school ventilates the classrooms so she goes in in layers.
The focus is on the wrong thing - they should be aiming for good behaviour and respectful to each other during breaks. Being good humans generally. Walking within a line won’t do that. But then, I have seen groups of teenagers out of control constantly when I visit my family in the uk and I pity the school that has to deal with them. The schools need proper funding and way way more and better paid staff.

1984 clearly being used a blue print.

After reading these comments I know the answer to the increase in school absences. You can bet the Government’s leadership, policies and interventions have taken there toll.

As someone who works in education, I wish this was more wide spread as behaviour has become a massive issue

It's a shame the kids don't all refuse en masse to go along with this bullshit. One way systems are fair enough but the coat thing is ridiculous. I wouldn't be made to sit and freeze in my office if the heating wasn't on so why should the kids?

This is a result of Covid and poor parenting styles. Teachers are now having to deal with low staff numbers and appalling behaviour from self entitled parents and kids. All of you need to grow up and give a bit of respect back / teach your kids what is right and what is wrong. Rules are not about the rule but about the way you deal with them. A lot of poor parenting out there.

Always the PE teachers! They have something to prove and I expect more time on their hands to pursue promotions… as most lessons are watching kids kick a ball around rather than thinking.

Also I used to hate doing PE in a game skirt in all weathers

Teachers in tracksuits

Nothing changes

I absolutely am teaching my child what is right and what is wrong and standing freezing because the teacher says so isn't something I consider to be right.

You’re extrapolating the entire education system from one school - I work in a London LA with a secondary school that has 2,500 pupils - another that has less than 500. Primaries ranging from 70 pupils to 550 (bigger than our smallest secondary). It’s horses for courses and space.

I don't work in that town, haven't for some years, I have heard they now wear uniform again. Just had a look at their web page and their results have improved since they got a new Head and the no uniform Head left.

Oh I disagree @Pollythenurse and neither do I like your tone.

DD's supposedly excellent state secondary and I fell out when they insisted on punitive and silly rules for the well behaved children and did sweet fa to deal with the significant minority disrupting every lesson, bullying, swearing at teachers and who even beat up a fellow pupil. They were deprived according to the head and needed different and more lax rules to the girls who wanted to learn and could behave.

We voted with our feet, a very strong letter to the governors and with delight. We could pay. DD had a much better experience from the start of Y9.

Leadership in state schools, based on my experience is an ideological left wing trope and needs to enter the real world. However the real world also needs to reintroduce more schools with specialist staff for those pupils who are genuinely dysfunctional.

When I was 11 to 18, theft resulted in expulsion. Violence resulted in expulsion, swearing at teachers resulted in expulsion. However, we had cloakroom pegs and storage in our desks and that was all fine because everyone knew that if they stole or damaged other people's property there were very real consequences. My head mistress would have been appalled to have her girls wandering around in crumpled coats because damp coats had to be shoved in bags. Notwithstanding the fact that it is inhumane to expect coatless children to hang about in sub zero temperatures or the rain. I imagine the leadership teams are wrapped up in thermal fleeces and padded coats.

The system has become absurd because there are no consequences and schools designed for 1500 children cannot possibly cater for the needs of all. Different children need different schools.

Our experience of state schools (church) was that their grabby little hands were constantly held out for donations. Regrettably donations cease when they don't deliver what was promised on open days.

I have to say, though I do believe in buying decent shoes. I think it's not good for our feet otherwise. I usually spend quite a bit on our shoes but then our clothes are from Primark.

@RosesAndHellebores

Sounds like the school I went to, had a cloakroom and regulation coat (awful)

I agree about the bad behaviour not being sorted out

However it's very difficult to expel or exclude especially when they have an EHCP

@HugoDarracott just guffawed at your comment, we have a couple of these.